Clarity on Elite Pack Rerolls.

Ohboy

madwren said:

Steeme said:

We made a conscious decision to follow the rules as laid out.  Where I come from, following the rules is something to be commended, and respected.  And yet you seem to turn that against us for some reason.

I'm just curious, do you always obey the speed limit, or do you sometimes drive faster than it?  If you do, do you shake your fist at everyone going 5-6mph over?

I don't have a horse in this race, but trying to turn it into an example of moral rectitude seems a bit over the top.

Ooo traffic metaphors! 

I do get very angry when cyclists run the red light, causing many near accidents. Does that count? 

No one is pissed off with people rolling a couple of times when they have bad luck. Personally, I'm angry that people have been allowed to deliberately go into the purchase with the INTENTION to Reroll. People who already have 5 of the mythics for example. 

bk1234

Ok, guys. This is why we can't have nice things. 

UweTellkampf

wickedwitch74 said:

Brigby said:

mournfen said:
Thank you very much! I assume this does not reflect the Rare+ Pack. Thank you once again

Yes. That's correct. This policy does not apply to the Rare+ Pack.

@Brigby

Thank you for clarifying the policy.

That said... it's dumb. Please ask the development team to just remove owned cards from the list, just like they do with the Planeswalkers offered in the vault.

Why waste everyone's time with this silly, nerve-wracking, time-consuming approach? 

Because not every player reads the forum, thus not every player is aware of their right to re-roll, thus not every player will get a new card, thus the company believes that will make the said player more inclined towards spending real money on cards. 

khurram

Ohboy said:

madwren said:

Steeme said:

We made a conscious decision to follow the rules as laid out.  Where I come from, following the rules is something to be commended, and respected.  And yet you seem to turn that against us for some reason.

I'm just curious, do you always obey the speed limit, or do you sometimes drive faster than it?  If you do, do you shake your fist at everyone going 5-6mph over?

I don't have a horse in this race, but trying to turn it into an example of moral rectitude seems a bit over the top.

Ooo traffic metaphors! 

I do get very angry when cyclists run the red light, causing many near accidents. Does that count? 

No one is pissed off with people rolling a couple of times when they have bad luck. Personally, I'm angry that people have been allowed to deliberately go into the purchase with the INTENTION to Reroll. People who already have 5 of the mythics for example. 

See... that wasn't very clear. It did appear that anyone who ever got more than one re-roll was a cheater and immoral and probably the worst human being on the planet to both of you and since getting duplicates are so common in this game, it was most likely every player who bought more than one elite pack. So i think both of you should understand why all the players who felt attacked, decided to clarify their stance. I think steeme's example of poking a bear is very fitting here. He should reflect on it himself.

And the players who already had 5 mythics in a specific elite pack and bought a new elite pack anyway? I see your point. Why, all they had to do was gather 5 specific mythics (and we all know it's been raining mythics so its no biggie at all) in an elite pack containing their favorite masterpiece in it. Not the ones that contained any of the 'hot garbage' masterpieces though. Because why compromise when you can cheat into getting the cards you want. Yep, they are the most conniving cheaters. Ugh god I can't bear to play anymore knowing they exist. Even though they probably exist by something like 1:10000. I just can't bear it.

Ohboy

khurram said:

Ohboy said:

madwren said:

Steeme said:

We made a conscious decision to follow the rules as laid out.  Where I come from, following the rules is something to be commended, and respected.  And yet you seem to turn that against us for some reason.

I'm just curious, do you always obey the speed limit, or do you sometimes drive faster than it?  If you do, do you shake your fist at everyone going 5-6mph over?

I don't have a horse in this race, but trying to turn it into an example of moral rectitude seems a bit over the top.

Ooo traffic metaphors! 

I do get very angry when cyclists run the red light, causing many near accidents. Does that count? 

No one is pissed off with people rolling a couple of times when they have bad luck. Personally, I'm angry that people have been allowed to deliberately go into the purchase with the INTENTION to Reroll. People who already have 5 of the mythics for example. 

See... that wasn't very clear. It did appear that anyone who ever got more than one re-roll was a cheater and immoral and probably the worst human being on the planet to both of you and since getting duplicates are so common in this game, it was most likely every player who bought more than one elite pack. So i think both of you should understand why all the players who felt attacked, decided to clarify their stance. I think steeme's example of poking a bear is very fitting here. He should reflect on it himself.

And the players who already had 5 mythics in a specific elite pack and bought a new elite pack anyway? I see your point. Why, all they had to do was gather 5 specific mythics (and we all know it's been raining mythics so its no biggie at all) in an elite pack containing their favorite masterpiece in it. Not the ones that contained any of the 'hot garbage' masterpieces though. Because why compromise when you can cheat into getting the cards you want. Yep, they are the most conniving cheaters. Ugh god I can't bear to play anymore knowing they exist. Even though they probably exist by something like 1:10000. I just can't bear it.

Let's be very clear. Many people, myself included had many mythics in Kld when the rerolls started. Your sarcasm is noted, but for a long while in kld, this exact scenario was presented to many people, and wasn't the outlier you're proposing. 

I myself saw no elite pack in Kld that didn't have at least 4 mythics I owned. 

Steeme

khurram said:

See... that wasn't very clear. It did appear that anyone who ever got more than one re-roll was a cheater and immoral and probably the worst human being on the planet to both of you and since getting duplicates are so common in this game, it was most likely every player who bought more than one elite pack. So i think both of you should understand why all the players who felt attacked, decided to clarify their stance. I think steeme's example of poking a bear is very fitting here. He should reflect on it himself.
anymore knowing they exist.

That's not right at all.  We were referring to these threads.  The OP is clearly outlining the exploit.

https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/64544/issue-with-mythic-dupes-in-elite-boosters

https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/66202/anger-and-resentment-from-duplicate-elite-pack-re-rolling/

Read up.  Do your research.  The same posters commending that behaviour were the same ones attacking us here.

Also, quit demonizing us.  It's getting old.  I'm not your punching bag.

Here is my definition of gaming this system, just for clarity in case you can't find it:

Steeme said:

jetnoctis said:

Gaming the system? More like the system is abusing us. Do you really think it fair to work your butt off to earn 400 mana jewels and be content with a dupe mythic of utterly inconsequential value, especially when it's coupled with them slashing all avenues at mythic prizes from events? HA! 

The initial intent was that if you opened a dupe you get a free retry.  That ended up changing so that you if get a subsequent dupe then you can keep trying until you get a non-dupe.  That part is fine.

The part that is gaming the system is intentionally choosing an elite pack selection where you have all the mythics, then wasting customer support's time while you trade in dupe after dupe.  What you don't realize is that once they see players doing this, they will no longer do this ever again, so the rest of the community suffers for your greed.  In addition, the cost of customer support having to deal with all of these tickets is a cost that, you guessed it, the rest of the community will pay for (or did you think customer support was free?).

Monkeynutts

You do realise it's extremely easy to code an app to make sure people DON'T get duplicates. My brother designs apps for other businesses and games and he said its about 10 mins work and about 5 lines of code to basically restrict the card being picked if it is in your inventory or library. I just reinfornces to me that they WANT you to get dupes.
I mean I'd love to have that feature for 120 jewels for each set solely for Rares. Have a non-dupe policy set in it and have people roll and roll getting a new rare eCh time for that set thus enabling peolle to get new things and eventually what they want.

When you look at it from the outside in you can see how east it is and what the developer are intentionally doing.

Ohboy

Monkeynutts said:

You do realise it's extremely easy to code an app to make sure people DON'T get duplicates. My brother designs apps for other businesses and games and he said its about 10 mins work and about 5 lines of code to basically restrict the card being picked if it is in your inventory or library. I just reinfornces to me that they WANT you to get dupes.
I mean I'd love to have that feature for 120 jewels for each set solely for Rares. Have a non-dupe policy set in it and have people roll and roll getting a new rare eCh time for that set thus enabling peolle to get new things and eventually what they want.

When you look at it from the outside in you can see how east it is and what the developer are intentionally doing.

This is not only not a secret plan, it's an essential part of the game. The idea that packs which guarantee non dupes can happen is ridiculous with the way the game is set up. 

Even the new policy of a limit to rerolls reflects this philosophy. You're not guaranteed a new unique card. The day this actually happens is when you can start the countdown clock to the game shutting down. 

babar3355

@Brigby, perhaps we should get the official statement somewhere other than page 2 of a random thread on the forums?

Monkeynutts

He hasn't responded because he hasn't been given the official "line" yet.

Its just poor and it always has been.

ZW2007-

The reason I say you made up the rules is simply because Brigby never posted rules. He posted comments that were clear on a very specific aspect of the matter but vague on everything else.

Here is an example of rules: https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/4/forum-rules-please-read-before-posting#latest

I'm still looking forward to getting an official post like this regarding elite packs.

Ohboy

ZW2007- said:

The reason I say you made up the rules is simply because Brigby never posted rules. He posted comments that were clear on a very specific aspect of the matter but vague on everything else.

Here is an example of rules: https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/4/forum-rules-please-read-before-posting#latest

I'm still looking forward to getting an official post like this regarding elite packs.

I mean if you don't treat his original comment/announcement as official, then the case is even more damning against rerolls because then your argument places them as "unsanctioned activities". That would mean all rerolls have been abusing a gap in understanding between the official rules and customer service. 

You can either treat the announcement for rerolls as official or not. You can't just jump to and fro on it to support the current argument. 

madwren

Steeme said:

madwren said:

Steeme said:

We made a conscious decision to follow the rules as laid out.  Where I come from, following the rules is something to be commended, and respected.  And yet you seem to turn that against us for some reason.

My issue is that you are here blasting the honest players.  That's a terrible attitude and well, we'll just have to agree to disagree.  We have different moral standards and thus will not get along

I'm just curious, do you always obey the speed limit, or do you sometimes drive faster than it?  If you do, do you shake your fist at everyone going 5-6mph over?

I don't have a horse in this race, but trying to turn it into an example of moral rectitude seems a bit over the top.

Not sure what you are trying to say, as it's not related.

It's an analogy. You're arguing that following the rule-as-written (the speed limit/one re-roll) rather than the rule-in-practice (exceeding the speed limit without consequence/multiple re-rolls) implies either dishonesty or immorality on the part of those who re-rolled. It doesn't.

madwren

Ohboy said:

madwren said:

Steeme said:

We made a conscious decision to follow the rules as laid out.  Where I come from, following the rules is something to be commended, and respected.  And yet you seem to turn that against us for some reason.

I'm just curious, do you always obey the speed limit, or do you sometimes drive faster than it?  If you do, do you shake your fist at everyone going 5-6mph over?

I don't have a horse in this race, but trying to turn it into an example of moral rectitude seems a bit over the top.

Ooo traffic metaphors! 

I do get very angry when cyclists run the red light, causing many near accidents. Does that count? 

No one is pissed off with people rolling a couple of times when they have bad luck. Personally, I'm angry that people have been allowed to deliberately go into the purchase with the INTENTION to Reroll. People who already have 5 of the mythics for example. 

I'm fully in agreement with you on the cyclists thing! That drives me batty. I even understand what you're saying about the difference between the "types" of rerolling you describe above.

I simply think that the flaw lies in the system itself, and the way these packs have been implemented, and that all this arguing about who is more honest, or meaner, or morally superior, is a bit over the top. 

Mainloop25

All I've really learned from this thread is that Steeme loves colloquialisms. 

ZW2007-

Ohboy said:

ZW2007- said:

The reason I say you made up the rules is simply because Brigby never posted rules. He posted comments that were clear on a very specific aspect of the matter but vague on everything else.

Here is an example of rules: https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/4/forum-rules-please-read-before-posting#latest

I'm still looking forward to getting an official post like this regarding elite packs.

I mean if you don't treat his original comment/announcement as official, then the case is even more damning against rerolls because then your argument places them as "unsanctioned activities". That would mean all rerolls have been abusing a gap in understanding between the official rules and customer service. 

You can either treat the announcement for rerolls as official or not. You can't just jump to and fro on it to support the current argument. 

I never said it wasn't official, everything he posts is official given that he is a D3 employee. I said it wasn't clear. It didn't cover every facet of the system. His posts were merely official statements buried in random threads. Notice how the forum rules have their own thread, created by a forum moderator, with clearly defined rules? That is the kind of official post I am referring to.

blacklotus

Brigby said:

*Please keep all comments civil, and do not attack other players! Thank you*

Hi Everyone. It's quite apparent there is some confusion regarding this Elite Pack policy. The policy has evolved a bit since its initial introduction, so I will officially confirm what the current policy details are:

If a player receives any duplicate card in a Mythic+ Elite Pack, they can submit a Support Ticket requesting a re-roll. You are allowed up to 2 re-rolls before your ticket is escalated, provided that each of those re-rolls resulted in another duplicate. At that point, your ticket will be evaluated further to determine accreditation of a final Elite Pack re-roll. This process is repeatable for each unique Elite Pack, duplicate instance.

Quoting this because otherwise, it will be buried by lots of pointless arguments which add zero value to what the threadstarter asked. 

Dave808

Wow really?! You can do this? I had no idea! There's a lot of hate going on in this thread but I'd like to thank the OP for bringing this to my attention. I had no idea you could ask for a reroll. Good to know indeed. I've gotten many dupes out of those packs before but never asked for a reroll because I wasn't even aware you could. 
How does customer service even know someone is telling the truth when they request one. Can they see your cards or what cards you drew. Or what about people who didn't even open an elite pack and just say they did and got a dupe? Can they see your recent purchases? Unless they can see these things on their end it seems like this could be badly abused by people. 

majincob

Dave808 said:

Wow really?! You can do this? I had no idea! There's a lot of hate going on in this thread but I'd like to thank the OP for bringing this to my attention. I had no idea you could ask for a reroll. Good to know indeed. I've gotten many dupes out of those packs before but never asked for a reroll because I wasn't even aware you could. 
How does customer service even know someone is telling the truth when they request one. Can they see your cards or what cards you drew. Or what about people who didn't even open an elite pack and just say they did and got a dupe? Can they see your recent purchases? Unless they can see these things on their end it seems like this could be badly abused by people. 

they can look at your collection and can look at your transaction history. they generally tell you not to convert your dupes (so they can see you have a dupe) and ask for the date you bought the pack (so they can find the transaction easier).

Dave808

majincob said:

Dave808 said:

Wow really?! You can do this? I had no idea! There's a lot of hate going on in this thread but I'd like to thank the OP for bringing this to my attention. I had no idea you could ask for a reroll. Good to know indeed. I've gotten many dupes out of those packs before but never asked for a reroll because I wasn't even aware you could. 
How does customer service even know someone is telling the truth when they request one. Can they see your cards or what cards you drew. Or what about people who didn't even open an elite pack and just say they did and got a dupe? Can they see your recent purchases? Unless they can see these things on their end it seems like this could be badly abused by people. 

they can look at your collection and can look at your transaction history. they generally tell you not to convert your dupes (so they can see you have a dupe) and ask for the date you bought the pack (so they can find the transaction easier).

Interesting.., thx for the info.