Vaulting Question... Yes this topic again
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DyingLegend
Posts: 1,211 Chairperson of the Boards
Okay so it's been a while since vaulting has been a thing and yet we have had zero feedback from devs, zero talks about what they have been seeing on there side, zero anything.
I'm just curious if vaulting has been more positive than negative from a devs point of view. Has it fixed the issues they intended it to fix? Has it created new problems? Has the overall acquisition of 4 stars meet the expectations of the developers? Are there any plans to create new vaults? Maybe monthly vaults with different combos of old and new?
I mean seriously I want some data, some charts or even an acknowledgement.
I can see the benefits of vaulting and the negatives. I have been able to build up current 4 stars kinda quickly, but with that I see the same teams over and over again in pvp.
Ive poked around the forums enough to see vaulting has mixed reviews and the people it hit hardest was the folks in the 4 star transition when vaulting happened. Veterans who had plenty of 4s beforehand are OK and new players can earn new 4 stars Okay. I feel the middle ground players got hit the hardest as most of there iso was dumped in characters they can earn in a bluemoon.
Would increasing the bonus hero rate by 10 or 15 percent help?
So many questions but no solid answers.
I'm just curious if vaulting has been more positive than negative from a devs point of view. Has it fixed the issues they intended it to fix? Has it created new problems? Has the overall acquisition of 4 stars meet the expectations of the developers? Are there any plans to create new vaults? Maybe monthly vaults with different combos of old and new?
I mean seriously I want some data, some charts or even an acknowledgement.
I can see the benefits of vaulting and the negatives. I have been able to build up current 4 stars kinda quickly, but with that I see the same teams over and over again in pvp.
Ive poked around the forums enough to see vaulting has mixed reviews and the people it hit hardest was the folks in the 4 star transition when vaulting happened. Veterans who had plenty of 4s beforehand are OK and new players can earn new 4 stars Okay. I feel the middle ground players got hit the hardest as most of there iso was dumped in characters they can earn in a bluemoon.
Would increasing the bonus hero rate by 10 or 15 percent help?
So many questions but no solid answers.
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Comments
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I really dont get it! Why they dont run more stores including only vaulted chars or a third 20cp store again with vaulted 4*.4
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Vaulting has served its purpose and only till ZERO people buy from that 3600 HP store nothing will change. Vaulting was nothing but a cash grab. There are 5 ways to solve dilution their way made them money.
Until they stop making money on vaulting nothing will ever change.1 -
They will wait until there are 24 5* in the classics tokens and THEN create the new super classics token where the oldest 5* go to die.
So we'll have
LT 3x5* and 12 latest 4*
CT 12x5* and 12 latest 4*
SCT everyone else1 -
I think you should be more specific in what you want to see. We did get feedback before, in a 8 questions about vaulting thread, and the lead designer answered them. While I would be interested in some sort of data and charts, I wouldn't even know what stats to I'd want to see. If they had data that the bonus hero rate is actually closer to 7% than 5%, would that mean anything?
http://forums.d3go.com/discussion/64069/answers-to-the-8-questions-about-vaulting-5-2-17/p1more opportunity to use their iso-8I took a couple quotes from their response that I think lays out their goals. They wanted people to enter and compete in 4* land faster, and to have more places to spend iso. Given that this was what they set out to accomplish, I would guess they have a positive view on it. Probably why they have leaned more on nonvaulted characters as pve progression rewards, to help jump start the new metagame.
make faster progress on 3-star and 4-star Heroes. This should make you more competitive in events faster
Given that they have answered directly to 8 questions before, I would suggest listing out some specific questions. My 2 questions are
1. Why isn't there a third or fourth LT option with the older characters?
2. What is being done to address duplicate 4* and 5* covers?
Given how heros for hire was nerfed to sync up with the 5 day Crash, a third token option thats more diluted shouldn't hurt H4H sales. Dupes are not necessarily related to vaulting, but they mentioned it in the 8 answers thread.
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They are greedy thats why! they keep the older chars vaulted only cause they want more people to buy HFH
cmon people they dont do this to help us or something, its all about the money its obvious that thats how things work here
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Evilplayer said:They are greedy thats why! they keep the older chars vaulted only cause they want more people to buy HFH
cmon people they dont do this to help us or something, its all about the money its obvious that thats how things work here
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A business is about money AND respecting your clients, listening to what they want, to their suggestions etc.
P. S
i "liked" your comment, hope that makes u feel smart and funny3 -
Evilplayer said:A business is about money AND respecting your clients, listening to what they want, to their suggestions etc.
P. S
i "liked" your comment, hope that makes u feel smart and funny1 -
mohio said:Evilplayer said:A business is about money AND respecting your clients, listening to what they want, to their suggestions etc.
P. S
i "liked" your comment, hope that makes u feel smart and funny
My guess is they are waiting until 5* dilution is enough of a problem that they need to solve that and then we'll get an option with the oldest 5*s and the oldest 4*s.1 -
My only concern with the current vaulting system is how the game will change once I get all 12 latests done, which should be within the next 30 days, and latests comprise most of my champed 4*. Do I basically just go on cruise control hoarding until the next 4* is released, since I'm really only pulling for champ levels at that point (and hoping for the odd BH)? Or am I forced to play more in the events that have vaulted 4* for rewards so I can continue to develop my roster? Both options seem like less to look forward to than I have now. Based on everything I read I'm not going anywhere near 5* land anytime soon.3
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farlus said:My only concern with the current vaulting system is how the game will change once I get all 12 latests done, which should be within the next 30 days, and latests comprise most of my champed 4*. Do I basically just go on cruise control hoarding until the next 4* is released, since I'm really only pulling for champ levels at that point (and hoping for the odd BH)? Or am I forced to play more in the events that have vaulted 4* for rewards so I can continue to develop my roster? Both options seem like less to look forward to than I have now. Based on everything I read I'm not going anywhere near 5* land anytime soon.
If your focus is more on just champing everyone and less concerned about competitiveness/max champ and/or if you want to start chasing 5*s then is when you'd want to focus more on hoarding once you get all 12 champed.2 -
mohio said:Evilplayer said:A business is about money AND respecting your clients, listening to what they want, to their suggestions etc.
P. S
i "liked" your comment, hope that makes u feel smart and funny
And who still appear in the roots of every part of the game (Behemoth burrito, pvp teams)
They chose to solve the problem in a way that has glaring holes and have made no true efforts to fixing that issue. So now we have a growing 75% (now closer to 80%) of characters locked away and that number continuously grows.
They also chose an extreme example of the 5 star token issue people have called out ever since the 6th 5 star was introduced in the classic vs latest legend situation.
It's nice that they managed to make the 4 transition faster. We've had months to see this is evident. We've also ha months to spot the inefficiency in this system.
The issue is (especially with 2017 changes) they seem to be especially hesitant to rush any change that entirely positively effects players {scl based scaling} while they IMMEDIATELY release things that have obvious downsides that need to be addressed before release and have been leaving them unfinished. {Vaulting, 5 clears, HFH 40 day to Year + rotation change especially are the huge ones that come to mind}
It's definitely tough, but that totally should have been worked out before the change.
The palpable player frustration kinda has merit in that regard.9 -
If they're taking the SCL-scaling conversation and turning it into the fixing SCL-based rewards to prevent SCL-sandbagging by having the SCL8 rewards be enough better to be worth the time delta....
Then they SHOULD be slow-rolling that change (and the scaling changes last year were repeatedly tested before rollout).
*looks at your list of obvious downsides that need addressed*
Only the HFH change from Behemoth to Crash seems like it's a negative change in what you've listed.1 -
There's 3 pages of people saying they are burned out or fear burnout like 5 threads down thanks to 5 clears.
This is literally a thread about the downsides of vaulting and how it's incomplete.
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broll said:This ultimately depends on what your goals are. If your goals are to be as competitive as possible, especially in PvP, I would think you'd keep pulling champ levels because they higher they are before they get vaulted the better off you will be when they are featured.
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dstann said:broll said:This ultimately depends on what your goals are. If your goals are to be as competitive as possible, especially in PvP, I would think you'd keep pulling champ levels because they higher they are before they get vaulted the better off you will be when they are featured.
Level aside, you also need to consider the 3* tier is overall weaker than the 4* tier. 3* tier is mostly older chars and power creep is a real thing when you consider 4*'s that were released this past year.
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New players can transition to 4 star play faster, but should they? A 2 star player can easily inflate their shield rank and quickly build up a 4 star roster completely skipping the 3 star tier. But that would and probably has wreck their scaling to have champed 4s before they are ready.
More than fixing scaling for 5 star players, upcoming scl based levels fixes this for player jumping into the 4 star tier faster than they really should.
Was moving into 4 star land slow before vaulting? Absolutely, but it was considered a marathon. It took me a year and a half to transition. 14 champs when vaulting hit.
Today, I have 32 champs. 9 out of the current 12 champed. 11 of 12 maxed covered. 8 more former 12s or vaulted characters champed.
But it is no longer Marathon. It is a rare. A race to champ each of the 12 as fast as possible before they are vaulted away into oblivion.
Sorry for typos. 3 am and I'm too lazy to go edit.0 -
dstann said:broll said:This ultimately depends on what your goals are. If your goals are to be as competitive as possible, especially in PvP, I would think you'd keep pulling champ levels because they higher they are before they get vaulted the better off you will be when they are featured.1
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GurlBYE said:Vaulting has shifted this problem in exchange for a larger one, now there is an ever growing percentage of characters locked away, who appear once every 3 to 4 months as an essential (while still being boosted an unobtainable)
And who still appear in the roots of every part of the game (Behemoth burrito, pvp teams)smkspy said:
Was moving into 4 star land slow before vaulting? Absolutely, but it was considered a marathon. It took me a year and a half to transition. 14 champs when vaulting hit.
Today, I have 32 champs. 9 out of the current 12 champed. 11 of 12 maxed covered. 8 more former 12s or vaulted characters champed.
But it is no longer Marathon. It is a rare. A race to champ each of the 12 as fast as possible before they are vaulted away into oblivion.Its a race, but it looks like you are winning. I am at 7/12 champed, with maybe 5 more seasons to champ (Coulson, fully covered) before he gets vaulted. Thats not a very daunting task. And a vaulted champ is hardly in oblivion.
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Straycat said:GurlBYE said:Vaulting has shifted this problem in exchange for a larger one, now there is an ever growing percentage of characters locked away, who appear once every 3 to 4 months as an essential (while still being boosted an unobtainable)
And who still appear in the roots of every part of the game (Behemoth burrito, pvp teams)
So now I have an ever growing number of characters that won't be champed without intervention?
I'm perfectly fine with being contrary and covering multiple perspectives but this is one thats super obvious.
The change only negatively effected your champ levels if you already had them all champed.
If you were part of the Very large amount of people who didn't have all the 3's/4's champed. The problems clear as day.
For everyone i have between 1 and 6 covers?
Well yeah. no. I can't clear their clashes, in pve they aren't as useful as someone fully covered and in pvp they are a huge liability no matter how boosted without being fully covered.2
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