Why are none of the Spider-People great MPQ characters?

heybub

I always loved Spider-Man in the comics, and he is one of my favorite super heroes.  I have found it quite disappointing that they can't get him right in the movies, no matter how hard they try, and MPQ really haven't done him justice.  For that matter, I don't think any of the Spider-Men/Women or even Venom or Carnage have really been positioned as great characters in the game.

I mean Spider-Man is Marvel's #1 guy, and one could argue, that Venom is one of the best villains in the MCU.  These guys should be given some respect.

Any thoughts on what should be done to improve them?  I really think 3* SM should be revamped to make him shine, along with 4* Venom.  SM should be more of a star player, and not a support guy.  And 5* SM (Black Suit) should be the 2nd top tier character in the game behind OML.

Here is the list of Spider People in the game.
1* SM
1* Venom
2* Bag-Man (really?)
3* SM
4* Venom
4* Venom (really, another Venom?)
4* Carnage
4* Spider-Gwen
4* Spider-Woman
5* Spider-Man Back in Black (*auther's note, I don't have him covered, so he might be awesome...)

What do you think?  Are you satisfied with their representation?  What would you like to see in the game?

Milk Jugz

Funny was having a conversation about this yesterday with some alliance mates. Heard a rumor we are getting another Spiderman (Peter Parker). Hopefully they get him right..... 

iron-n-wine

For completionists, 4* Miles is also missing from your list

Skrofa

Spiderwoman is a good character in my opinion. Purple at 5 can clear pesky enemy specials or place some very dangerous traps on ANY tile.
Red is excellent (when it starts working again)
Black is great damage evasion.

AV is quite underrated too IMO.
Invisibility to allies with a rather good AOE. Very cheap black with damage and a good attack.

Haven't played much with gwen and miles (both undercovered) but they do seem to have some good synergy with web tile users.

The rest... well... I agree the spider-man we all know and love has gotten no love whatsoever from the people responsible for his designs

escart85

I'm only going to write about the Peter Parker chars.

Someone on the forum (can't remember now sorry) wrote that the devs in fact did a good spidey char that represents the classic 60's Spiderman very well and that is actually the 1* Spiderman. I agree with this.
Good power combination and synergy - Red dmg, Blue stun and Purple special. On top of it, each power has an additional effect that makes use of the created web tiles. Unfortunately, unusable once you move to the 3* tier.

When it comes to the 2* version, well...only one power creates web tiles, only one power makes use of them and it's not the same power. Powers that cost 18 and 17 ap at level 5 which is ridiculous (2* bullseye looks better here). A variant of 2* Black Widow timer increase which is not even that good because it affects 1 cd tile or 2 (if you have it at level 5) and she's got a heal in there also. Strategy? "Spectacularly" wear the opponent down and win using match damage the day after you started the fight...

The 3* version has a team heal which I think is a miss and they didn't have clue what to do here because unlike 3* Beast he doesn't have an AOE attack to balance that. Well he doesn't have any attacks really. You get a cheap stun and a purple power that is a rip off from 2* Bullseye but it only works if you match the purple tiles so it's even worse. 

This character (3* spidey) is stuck in the same corner of supporting chars that the 3* Falcon was just not long ago. Let's be honest, "supporting" here translates to "useless, especially in solo battles".  Falcon got a rework to his purple power and now in my opinion he's somewhere in the mid-tier 3*'s. One could argue that I forgot about 1* and 2* Black Widow but in my opinion that is not the case because the 1* version has ap steal and a long stun with a team stun at level 5, 2* version has active and passive ap steal with a cd timer increase / team heal.  

The person who thought that creating a Spiderman character where the only way to win would be through match damage was drunk or I don't know how to explain this... More so, it happened more than one time. At the moment, most players spend the longest in the 3* tier and having such an iconic char reduced to a weak support is a joke.

We needed a 4* Miles Morales to have a 2nd Spiderman char that deals any damage with an active power.

After playing 1,5 yrs I finally decided to roster 3* Spiderman only because I had 4 of his covers waiting in my rewards queue and we're getting a Spiderman movie this summer which gives me some hope that they will do a rework instead of a new character release or both but they will release another spidey villain which would be great.

TPF Alexis

heybub said:

I always loved Spider-Man in the comics, and he is one of my favorite super heroes.  I have found it quite disappointing that they can't get him right in the movies, no matter how hard they try, and MPQ really haven't done him justice. 

Altho I didn't like the way he was shoehorned into CACW, I actually really like Tom Holland as Spider-Man, and I'm looking forward to Homecoming, especially since they're not doing yet another Origin Story flick for him.

As for MPQ, escart85 nailed it. 1* Spidey is actually pretty good, and I miss him being relevant now that I'm in 3* land. Wouldn't have minded at all if he'd just gotten a 3* Lazy version.

Agent Venom is apparently pretty good in the right team once you've got him fully Covered, but I really feel like it's a shame how bad the classic Eddie Brock version of Venom is, and the DA version is just laughable.

heybub

iron-n-wine said:

For completionists, 4* Miles is also missing from your list

You are correct...although I don't think he counters the argument .

heybub

escart85 said:

I'm only going to write about the Peter Parker chars.

Someone on the forum (can't remember now sorry) wrote that the devs in fact did a good spidey char that represents the classic 60's Spiderman very well and that is actually the 1* Spiderman. I agree with this.
Good power combination and synergy - Red dmg, Blue stun and Purple special. On top of it, each power has an additional effect that makes use of the created web tiles. Unfortunately, unusable once you move to the 3* tier.

I have heard that 1* Spidey is pretty good, but I've never used him...He came out after I was well into 3* land, and I haven't had the need for a 1*. With that said, I think that aligns with Spidey getting the shaft. 3* characters are probably the most used characters out there, so sticking him 1* land essentially makes him useless.

This character (3* spidey) is stuck in the same corner of supporting chars that the 3* Falcon was just not long ago. Let's be honest, "supporting" here translates to "useless, especially in solo battles".  Falcon got a rework to his purple power and now in my opinion he's somewhere in the mid-tier 3*'s.

I agree with him being stuck in a support role, but atleast Falcon had a GREAT supporting role. I mean enhancing special tiles is very, very useful, and removing enemy speacial tiles helps as well. The only good thing about 3* Spidey is his stun for 5ap. His purple is meh. And his yellow costs too much and doesn't really go with his character. When did he ever web up somebody's wounds? He needs a really great attack, either a single enemy damage or AOE.

heybub

TPF Alexis said:

Altho I didn't like the way he was shoehorned into CACW, I actually really like Tom Holland as Spider-Man, and I'm looking forward to Homecoming, especially since they're not doing yet another Origin Story flick for him.

We'll see about Tom Holland. I think he might be the best, but we only got to see him for a few minutes. I think the issue with the other SM's was they could only get 1 aspect of Peter Parker or SM. I mean the dude is a complete dork science geek as Peter, but a total smart-**** wise cracker as Spider Man. Hopefully they can do him justice in Homecoming.

carrion_pigeons

3* Spidey is underrated: he's slow and ought to be more interesting, but doesn't exactly need a buff.  Gwen and Eddie need reworks though. 

Jaedenkaal

carrion pigeons said:

3* Spidey is underrated: he's slow and ought to be more interesting, but doesn't exactly need a buff.  Gwen and Eddie need reworks though. 

In what world does a 9.3k damage power for as little as 6 AP need a rework?

escart85

Jaedenkaal said:

carrion pigeons said:

3* Spidey is underrated: he's slow and ought to be more interesting, but doesn't exactly need a buff.  Gwen and Eddie need reworks though. 

In what world does a 9.3k damage power for as little as 6 AP need a rework?

My guess is that the other two are just plain weak. Symbiotic fury half the time does next to nothing and Carnage and/or Medusa are required for it to actually do anything more. Edit: the black passive is just tinykitty for a char that is supposed to be in the same tier as carnage.

spatenfloot

They need to give Spidey a Hostess Fruit Pie power that distracts the entire enemy team so that they can't make matches.

escart85

What I personally want is for the 3* spidey:

- to add a web tile with each power like the 1* version.

- Have a blue or green power - like a web slingshot double foot kick move that sends the one enemy in front airborne for 2 turns and when that enemy lands it does AOE dmg and/or stuns all of them for an additional 1 turn. That would be a cool finishing move. Probably costing at least 13-14 ap

- The other move could be a dual power like Spider-woman has - f.eg. Choose either to transform 2 random enemy special tiles to crit tiles (amount of crit tiles based on no. of web tiles on board) or lock 2 selected tiles for 1 or 2 turns (no of tiles based on no. of web tiles on board). This power would represent Peter Parkers fighting prowess and smarts and on the other hand the ability to hinder his enemy's plans. You could go for dmg or lock out selected tiles to deny a match that would allow them to activate a power without having to lose a move to deny the ap gain.

- the third power could be yellow or purple - something related to his techie side, that would give an edge during the fight or maybe an active to become airborne so he can't be targeted by any attacks or a passive in the vein of 5* Black Panther Move or be moved - if spidey would be dealt dmg over a specified amount then his spider sense allows him to react and escape with little to no damage and become airborne for 2 turns


If the dual power would seem a bit OP for a 3* char then instead of choice I would suggest an ant-man style transition - use ap to lock tiles - the locked tiles have a timer, then this power becomes the spectacular strategy and you have to  spend AP again which will transform those locked tiles into crit tiles, depending on how many will be still on board.

What do you think? I'm afraid that if I suggest a good build then they will never actually use it

Jaedenkaal

escart85 said:

Jaedenkaal said:

carrion pigeons said:

3* Spidey is underrated: he's slow and ought to be more interesting, but doesn't exactly need a buff.  Gwen and Eddie need reworks though. 

In what world does a 9.3k damage power for as little as 6 AP need a rework?

My guess is that the other two are just plain weak. Symbiotic fury half the time does next to nothing and Carnage and/or Medusa are required for it to actually do anything more. Edit: the black passive is just tinykitty for a char that is supposed to be in the same tier as carnage.

Oh, I agree Venom could use some work. I was talking about Spider-Gwen

Milk Jugz

Jaedenkaal said:

escart85 said:

Jaedenkaal said:

carrion pigeons said:

3* Spidey is underrated: he's slow and ought to be more interesting, but doesn't exactly need a buff.  Gwen and Eddie need reworks though. 

In what world does a 9.3k damage power for as little as 6 AP need a rework?

My guess is that the other two are just plain weak. Symbiotic fury half the time does next to nothing and Carnage and/or Medusa are required for it to actually do anything more. Edit: the black passive is just tinykitty for a char that is supposed to be in the same tier as carnage.

Oh, I agree Venom could use some work. I was talking about Spider-Gwen

I agree with Jaedenkaal. Gwen already got a rework and is much better. Cherry bomb can hit for 20k when she's boosted for 6 ap with web tiles out

SpringSoldier

I don't want a 5th Spider-Man, I want rework on the older 3*
one:
-the blue power should stun, but also cause damage, like Dr. Strange
-purple should me more powerful; Luke Cage level at least
-his yellow should be cheaper, so that you can to kill him before you everyone else

Considering how popular Dr. Strange and Kamala Khan are in PVP, I think that with these change, Spiderboy 3* would become an A-lister.

About Spidey 5*, he's not bad at all. I only have 3 covers, but I like him already: his blue is very cheap- it stuns and does some damage and his green is a little slow but it throws a car on your enemy dealing about 2000 damage and stunning for 2 turns ! If it were a little cheaper, it would be great.

Bag-Man is also ridiculous, but I haven't played with him enough to say what I would want to improve. Same with Miles and Gwen. And I thought Spider-Woman wasn't related to Spider-Man at all. She's not a great for a 4*, but not very bad either. She can win a fight with some strategy, but played but the AI, she's far from great.

zodiac339

Let's see. 3* powers do need tweeking, that's for sure. Bird Strike turning into a decent AOE while still keeping protect tiles was unexpectedly cool. So, what changes to Spid3y?
Blue should probably remain unchanged, or have the base stun go up to 2 (probably still cap at 3) at level 4/5, or make 2 web tiles at level 4/5.
Purple could have an active to make web tiles based on number of purple protect tiles (up to 3 or maybe 5 at rank 5), or a second passive to make a web tile when a friendly protect tile is matched (would be insane partnered with Falcon or Magneto though).
That would leave yellow to stop making bandages and start doing damage. We already have damage increased by web tiles (Miles) and cost decreased by web tiles (Gwen), so perhaps keep his utility by also removing enemy special tiles per web tile, consuming web tiles in the process,  2/3 at rank 1 and unlimited at 5. Damage as single target probably?

heybub

Thanks for all the great comments, and I think we are on the right track.  The consensus seems to be: Make 3* Spidey top tier, and I wholeheartedly agree.  And we all seem to be saying the same thing: Get rid of his yellow, and give him a good damage power as well.  

I agree, Blue is pretty cool, and cheap, and his most useful feature.  Purple isn't great, but I think I could live with it if his yellow was scrapped for a damage power.

Maybeescart85 said:

- the third power could be yellow or purple - something related to his techie side, that would give an edge during the fight or maybe an active to become airborne so he can't be targeted by any attacks or a passive in the vein of 5* Black Panther Move or be moved - if spidey would be dealt dmg over a specified amount then his spider sense allows him to react and escape with little to no damage and become airborne for 2 turns

I really like this idea, as it uses his great comic skill: Spider Sense.  I'm wondering if it would be better as a black (just to match his costume colors), and it would replace his purple.  Then scrap yellow for a high damage red damage (again to match his costume colors) that hits the target for alot, but then also AOE for some amount.  I'm thinking it could be a pretty powerful and cheap red, which would be offset by not being able to use him while airborne due to his black (as I've proposed it).  This would also make him a rare red/blue/black character, which might fit a nice little niche.

In fact, perhaps the powers could work as so: black negates damage above some cutoff, creates a countdown/special tile (3 turn?) and makes him airborne for 2 (less than the countdown).  His red would be a two part power: cheap red moderate damage normally, but when the countdown/special is on the board, his red is a cheap AOE nuke.

What do you all think?

Another idea might be to scrap yellow for a damage (doesn't have to be great, but at least do damage), and then modify his blue to not only stun, but also to improve special tiles.  This would keep him in a support role, but far more useful.  Maybe the number of special tiles scales with number of web tiles?  If his purple stays as is, it strengthens these, but would also improve allies' strike/attack tiles.

Anon

I feel like the only person who thinks Carnage and Miles are actually really good.

Jaedenkaal

Not just you. Carnage (lately) is great. I think Miles is fine, there's just a LOT of other 4*s who do similar things with (arguably) less hassle. He does generate Web tiles like a champ, though.