Progression for Strange Sights is higher than normal!

SummerGlau

i made it this time

GrimSkald

apmonte wrote:

Yea, I came to find out why I'm 10k short for full progression. The real problem here is that there's no consistency between events. Why is it so hard for the Devs to do simple math?

You're not being fair. There is consistency, which is why we know that this is a problem. This has only happened, what, twice before? I recall once ("Enemy of the State,") and they definitely made it up to us - the rewards we would have gotten were distributed.

djpt05

I am surprised more people haven't posted about this being a problem.

I'm concerned it's not going to be addressed because of that.

Jam_Adams

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

Time to do the math:

snip

Total = 56457. Clearly short of goal, even factoring in the 100pt unlock nodes and Kaecilus

snip.

i'm going with Grumpy's math, and shoot for 58ish-k.

I didn't have Mordo for the first two subs, and I was at ~53.2k after 4+2. I think I can get to 58k with a few extra clears in the final sub. I don't know what else I can do.

Quebbster

GrimSkald wrote:

apmonte wrote:

Yea, I came to find out why I'm 10k short for full progression. The real problem here is that there's no consistency between events. Why is it so hard for the Devs to do simple math?

You're not being fair. There is consistency, which is why we know that this is a problem. This has only happened, what, twice before? I recall once ("Enemy of the State,") and they definitely made it up to us - the rewards we would have gotten were distributed.

The first run of Hearts of Darkness was pretty bad as I recall. I Think the devs designed it as a four day PvE with a 48 hour sub, then decided to change it to Three Days with only 24 hour subs, but didn't adjust the progression Points needed.

GrumpySmurf1002

Vhailorx wrote:

They have offered compensation in the past when similar issues occured. The player-base clearly believes that clearing everything until the timers start is sufficient for max prog (obviously not every single player, but players as a whole). So no matter what the correct answer is, some feedback and/or compensation from the devs seems appropriate.

Again, the compensation they offered was related to a clear mistake in their calculations, not for the gap between player expectations and developer/publisher expectations. I don't think they've ever offered compensation for the latter. ( I guess Galactus 1.0 counts, but I don't even remember if we got compensation for that or just a re-run.)

If this was the first rodeo, I would agree that feedback/compensation should occur, but we've had multiple runs of PvEs since first Strange Sights that have included waves, and this conversation comes up every time. At some point it's on the players to stop assuming things that aren't true.

Vhailorx wrote:

I had thought that they had already given a definitive statement that matched my understanding (start refresh timers on all repeatable nodes, get max prog), but you seem to think they said something different grumpy. Brigby, we await your input to end the debate!

Yes, a definitive answer is needed, but my recollection of that previous announcement was that they said 4 times is enough for progression. The forum made the leap to not take it literally and assume it means "start timers."

Vhailorx wrote:

(Ps. 4 times every node is stupid. Pve takes up enough time already. Why punish us with extra grinding for each wave node, which are each 2-6 times as long as a regular node)?

Here, I agree with you. I also think 4 times even w/ no waves is stupid. I also think grinding to 1 is stupid, since nodes only have 6 rewards. I think having PvE be a race against the clock is stupid. A lot of it is stupid.

Straycat

I went back thru the news and announcements to find the relevant statements on this. From "meet rocket and groot event details" sep 20, 2016:

This Story event does not have S.H.I.E.L.D. Clearance Levels. Future runs of this event will have Clearance Levels.

• Starting in this event, we would like to better define the score to achieve progression rewards.
o The 3-Star Progression reward will take approximately two clears of each mission.
o The top Progression reward will take approximately four clears of each mission.
o We will be attempting something similar for S.H.I.E.L.D. Clearance Levels."

And from "enemy of the state rewards update" Nov 4, 2016:

"The score to achieve the top three progression rewards for the Enemy of the State Story event that started on October 27 was set higher than what we want them to be. The rewards required scores that were higher than four clears of each normal mission. We have reduced the scores required to achieve the top three progression rewards for future runs of the event.

Players that scored high enough to receive these rewards on this run of the event will receive the Iso-8, Tokens, and Command Points they would have received later today. Players who achieved a score higher than the current top progression reward will receive an extra Enemy of the State Vault token. We thank everyone who participated in the event and appreciate the feedback we received."

So 4 clears should do the job, although they dont mention wave nodes. But in our experience 2 clears of wave nodes should be enough to reach progression. Even in 2 day subs, they don't require us to do more than the 4 clears per node. For this event, I did 4 clears and 2 for waves and ended up a little shy of the 58k level. I was able to get the last 9k by getting a green check on almost everything in the last sub tho. Only the last progression reward is higher than expected, so hopefully they award it for anyone who got to 58k

Magic

Just open up the other nodes and let us clear the waves two more times...


It's a shame that I will be missing out on the max progression. Still - enjoying the event a lot.

Quebbster

Straycat wrote:

I went back thru the news and announcements to find the relevant statements on this. From "meet rocket and groot event details" sep 20, 2016:

This Story event does not have S.H.I.E.L.D. Clearance Levels. Future runs of this event will have Clearance Levels.

• Starting in this event, we would like to better define the score to achieve progression rewards.
o The 3-Star Progression reward will take approximately two clears of each mission.
o The top Progression reward will take approximately four clears of each mission.
o We will be attempting something similar for S.H.I.E.L.D. Clearance Levels."

And from "enemy of the state rewards update" Nov 4, 2016:

"The score to achieve the top three progression rewards for the Enemy of the State Story event that started on October 27 was set higher than what we want them to be. The rewards required scores that were higher than four clears of each normal mission. We have reduced the scores required to achieve the top three progression rewards for future runs of the event.

Players that scored high enough to receive these rewards on this run of the event will receive the Iso-8, Tokens, and Command Points they would have received later today. Players who achieved a score higher than the current top progression reward will receive an extra Enemy of the State Vault token. We thank everyone who participated in the event and appreciate the feedback we received."

So 4 clears should do the job, although they dont mention wave nodes. But in our experience 2 clears of wave nodes should be enough to reach progression. Even in 2 day subs, they don't require us to do more than the 4 clears per node. For this event, I did 4 clears and 2 for waves and ended up a little shy of the 58k level. I was able to get the last 9k by getting a green check on almost everything in the last sub tho. Only the last progression reward is higher than expected, so hopefully they award it for anyone who got to 58k

I would argue that "four clears of each normal mission" might exclude survival nodes as they are not normal missions. On the other hand I am not a developer, so I can't say for sure that was what they meant.

Magic

They will check how many people participated compared to other PvE. Then they will check how many made the max progression and how many didn't. They will compare these figures to the numbers from other PvE. If the difference is substantial they will compensate. If not - it's working as intended.

JVReal

I love survival nodes, and I love the points they give. I always clear those things 4 times... it helps catch up on any nodes I didn't have time to green check in the previous sub. I clear those twice right away in the initial run, then I clear them first on my grind so that I can have the Health Packs for my ideal teams for them... I can scrounge up odd teams for single nodes, but trying to limp through a survival node with 2nd or 3rd string lineup is horrific.

I agree with Grumpy, 4x is pretty straight forward, they did not say clear until you see a timer and you are good for max progression.

As a side note I still think it's odd that people are complaining about what they assumed to be 'minimal' effort for 'maximum' progression. I imagine going to an instructor, asking for the score ranges for A-D, setting your goal to barely clear a C, then be upset when your calculations for assignment and test values were off and you dropped to a D. "Where's my C? I did my absolute best to hit your minimum threshold... even though it wasn't enough, and I could have done more..."

Jam_Adams

but haven't we had several events in the new rewards structure where only 4+2 achieved max prog?

tgibbs40

GrimSkald wrote:

apmonte wrote:

Yea, I came to find out why I'm 10k short for full progression. The real problem here is that there's no consistency between events. Why is it so hard for the Devs to do simple math?

You're not being fair. There is consistency, which is why we know that this is a problem. This has only happened, what, twice before? I recall once ("Enemy of the State,") and they definitely made it up to us - the rewards we would have gotten were distributed.

Bolded by me. I disagree with this. I play PVE, every event, to get the 15 CP at the end. I would have grinded harder to get that had there been an initial communication letting me know I needed to do more to achieve that reward. But there was not one because it took everyone by surprise. Once I realized that I could not reach the only goal I am really after, I chose not to grind for rewards I didn't care about. Had there been communication to continue to grind for compensation I would have done just that.

It is what it is. I made a decision with the (lack of) information I was provided. But a little bit of communication, at any point, and I would have reached that 15 CP.

Jexman

Has this been resolved yet? I will hit my usual 4 clears per regular nodes / 3 clears per wave nodes & will not hit max progression with that. It'll be close but not good enough. This is irregular & thus I hope it is resolved (also important for those of us in alliances where max progression is a minimal condition of membership).

Evilgenius_9

tgibbs40 wrote:

GrimSkald wrote:

apmonte wrote:

Yea, I came to find out why I'm 10k short for full progression. The real problem here is that there's no consistency between events. Why is it so hard for the Devs to do simple math?

You're not being fair. There is consistency, which is why we know that this is a problem. This has only happened, what, twice before? I recall once ("Enemy of the State,") and they definitely made it up to us - the rewards we would have gotten were distributed.

Bolded by me. I disagree with this. I play PVE, every event, to get the 15 CP at the end. I would have grinded harder to get that had there been an initial communication letting me know I needed to do more to achieve that reward. But there was not one because it took everyone by surprise. Once I realized that I could not reach the only goal I am really after, I chose not to grind for rewards I didn't care about. Had there been communication to continue to grind for compensation I would have done just that.

It is what it is. I made a decision with the (lack of) information I was provided. But a little bit of communication, at any point, and I would have reached that 15 CP.

I was at 15k after the first day WITH 4 clears on each wave node. I knew tight away it was going to take that to get full progression. Maths is kinda hard, but if you are at 12k near the end of day one and the target is 67k at the end of 3 - you should know you are going to need more.

GrumpySmurf1002

Straycat wrote:

o The top Progression reward will take approximately four clears of each mission.

Right - which is the point where everyone began assuming waves is 2 clears, though it doesn't distinguish that fact. It's a fair assumption based on all prior experience, but it's proven to be the wrong assumption, so it's up to us to stop assuming it.

"The score to achieve the top three progression rewards for the Enemy of the State Story event that started on October 27 was set higher than what we want them to be. The rewards required scores that were higher than four clears of each normal mission. We have reduced the scores required to achieve the top three progression rewards for future runs of the event.

So 4 clears should do the job, although they dont mention wave nodes. But in our experience 2 clears of wave nodes should be enough to reach progression. Even in 2 day subs, they don't require us to do more than the 4 clears per node. For this event, I did 4 clears and 2 for waves and ended up a little shy of the 58k level. I was able to get the last 9k by getting a green check on almost everything in the last sub tho. Only the last progression reward is higher than expected, so hopefully they award it for anyone who got to 58k

So I had the timeline wrong, EotS was first, Strange Sights was where they fixed the error, not vice versa. Oh well. Anyway, during that Strange Sights run, people kept saying the error was still there, that they were starting timers and not getting progression. You can find that thread here: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=54437#p595664

The 'higher than 4 clears' came from them neglecting to account for deterioration of the waves. Not from counting 4x waves. 4x waves is their intent. I did the math then, like now, to prove it. Whether that's wrong to intend is debatable, but simple fact is that's the current requirement.

Maybe there's enough confusion to give people @58k the rewards, but I wouldn't hold my breath on it.

GrimSkald

tgibbs40 wrote:

GrimSkald wrote:

apmonte wrote:

Yea, I came to find out why I'm 10k short for full progression. The real problem here is that there's no consistency between events. Why is it so hard for the Devs to do simple math?

You're not being fair. There is consistency, which is why we know that this is a problem. This has only happened, what, twice before? I recall once ("Enemy of the State,") and they definitely made it up to us - the rewards we would have gotten were distributed.

Bolded by me. I disagree with this. I play PVE, every event, to get the 15 CP at the end. I would have grinded harder to get that had there been an initial communication letting me know I needed to do more to achieve that reward. But there was not one because it took everyone by surprise. Once I realized that I could not reach the only goal I am really after, I chose not to grind for rewards I didn't care about. Had there been communication to continue to grind for compensation I would have done just that.

It is what it is. I made a decision with the (lack of) information I was provided. But a little bit of communication, at any point, and I would have reached that 15 CP.

Oh sure, the exact same thing happened to me on EotS. I basically gave up and just went for tokens in the last few subs, so I missed the compensation. Had I played normally, I would have been compensated. Still, that was a conscious decision on my part, though, so I wasn't particularly angry at D3 about it.

Regarding this event, I usually hit the nodes until check marks for about 90% of them - I'm not particularly strict about it. I generally get the 15 CP at the beginning of my clear of the final node. This time I did the same, and I got the 15 CP after my full clear (and beating Kaecillus, in fact, which was thematically appropriate.) It's definitely harder than normal, and I find it very likely they will give us some kind of compensation.

Jam_Adams

now that the event is over, has anyone heard anything from demi regarding progression?

Brigby is there a way to bring this to demi's attention?

deadtaco

Jam_Adams wrote:

now that the event is over, has anyone heard anything from demi regarding progression?

@Brigby is there a way to bring this to demi's attention?

That should work.

Yoik

I made progression on this on the last day. 76k in total in the end. I never play optimally. IN fact I never play the same way. I always take the last bracket and ill always clear each node 6 times. That could be a few here and a few there or all in one go. The easy ones first or the hard ones first. All I ever do is clear them 6 times. That’s it.

SO if progression is all you are after follow the above. I’ve never not made it .