Forum Thread

mohio

Jumping in here on the classics/latest debate...

A quick illustration to show why people are hoarding and pulling latest tokens instead of classics, and it's just a simple example of someone with exactly average luck.

Average Joe has saved up 3000 cp. In the time span it takes to save this much cp I think it's reasonable to expect him to have at least 50 latest tokens saved up as well, so we'll give him 50 latest tokens. Let's see what happens if he opens his hoard - first using cp on classics and second using cp on latest.

CP on classics : Joe opens 150 classic tokens, and since he has perfectly average luck, he gets 22.5^ 5* and 127.5 4*. His 50 latest tokens yield 7.5^ 5* and 42.5 4*. Divvying up all the pulls equally among the 4*/5* gives Joe 2.5 covers for all 12 5* and roughly 4 covers for each 4* (170 4* total).

CP on latest : Joe opens 120 latest tokens from cp and all 50 latest tokens he has saved, giving him 25.5^ 5* and 144.5 4*. Since there are only 3 5* possible here, he gets an average of 8.5 covers per 5* and about 3.5 covers per 4*.

Breaking it down, sure opening classics gives more covers - Joe got roughly 30 5* and 170 4* from his hoard instead of 25.5 5* and 144.5 4*. But looking more closely, he only got 2.5 covers per character, which even being generous, means he's left with 12 5* characters at 1/1/1. By opening latest tokens only, he gave up on ~4.5 5* covers and about 25 4* covers (not even 1 per character!), but he's now left with 3 5* that each have 8.5 covers, and might actually be somewhat usable. Double this exercise and see where you'd rather be (hint - 5-cover 5* characters are not usable, 17-cover 5* characters are game-changers).

^ - of course half covers are not a possibility - we're using average numbers - feel free to round up or round down or assume half at 2, half at 3, etc.

Vhailorx

I think ghe counter-argument mohio, is that som may not like the game changes that 17 cover 5*s produce (i.e. very high 5* scaling and mmr matched to a very limited 5* roster).

As i said above i think there are reasonable arguments in favor of both strategies (i.e. open classics onnly; Dont sweat the 5* tier at all at focus on 4*s. Or hoard cp + LT to go nova on a set of 3 5*s).

smkspy

I just pull classics. Not because they are cheaper but because my highest 5s are all in classics (jean, cap, banner, bolt, and goblin) and I'm in no hurry to build them. I don't even intend on leveling them until the game makes the full move into the 5 star tier.

PorkBelly

This is certainly not a new suggestion but a way to ameliorate the 5* dilution problem is to have two variants of the Classic Legends tokens.

GrimSkald

aesthetocyst wrote:

mpqr7 wrote:

... a TEN MINUTE hop ....

Apologies, I was not specific enough. Bless yo' swee' lil pea-pickin' heart.

That's 10min total time. Being 'out' for 10min at a relatively high score, particularly late in the event would be .... unwise. There is more to it than just hopping.

10min total time every so many hours. A few min to pick up a target or two. A few min to take them down. The higher the score and the later it gets, the more of that 10min spent finding a target, and the less of that 10min hopping. The more likely that hop is a single fight against a well-chosen target.

There is an inverse relationship between strength of roster, length of hops and current score, time left in event. That should be obvious, but complaints on the forum indicate that complainers are unable or unwilling to accept PvP for what it is and do what it takes to play it well, or just lower expectations, or just leave it alone.

PvP in MPQ is a misnamed, money-sucking pile of ****. You either sink money into roster to save on shields, or burn money on shields a/o heals a/o boosts, to essentially buy the prizes. Or learn to stop worrying and t love playing it casually.

Though it is a pile of ****, it can still be played like a fiddle if you're willing. Or ignore hits don't bother with shields and just farm.

I was wondering about this too. I definitely have trouble with double hops - even when I do them quickly it's frequently a toss up on how much points I actually get from them. Speaking for myself (and my 34 Champ 4* Roster with no max-leveled 5*s,) I can get to 1200 but it takes time, planning, and I do have the occasional wipeout particularly against Phoenix...

You know what, maybe this would be best off in it's own thread? I may do this.

LordXberk

I'll weigh in here as a Day 650er w/ some money spent and several max covered 5*s (Thanos, IM46, BW), a couple champ 5*s (OML, BB), and 25+ champed 4*s.

First, I totally agree w/ Fightmaster above in that the diversity of 5*s way outweighs getting a couple 5*s at 470 and the extra 4*s. Second, I'm a total believer in the hoard and bust mentality (how I covered BB and Thanos) and will continue to do that as long as Classics are diluted.

What I debate is given my current roster that requires I use OML, BB, Thanos in every PVP and every PVE, would I go back and not level them up to 450 (440 on Thanos)?

On one hand, I do appreciate being able to late climb if necessary to get 1.2k and then use 1 or 2 shields. Plus, it's just a ton less stressful and I don't have to plan my schedule around playing PVP. On the flipside, I am at the point now that many of you warned me about and reaching a burnout point w/ using the same characters over and over and over. I mean, when I don't use OML and/or BB, I find myself waiting a split second at the start of my turn anyways for their passives to trigger. And, I just don't give a rip about new 4* characters - I'm actually kind of angry at the Riri release, as it seems way too soon to the last one (although, I know it isn't) and I just wish they'd do anything different than just jamming new characters down our throats and breaking new stuff w/ every release. As great as C4rol is, she is almost completely worthless in 5* realm. I am really considering skipping the Riri PVE. It's also a bummer that the 25+ 4*s I built rarely get used (I will concede that having the 5*s have allowed me to win more 4*s than I would've otherwise, though).

Flume

Vhailorx, good point on no dupes for latests. I can appreciate that is a significant difference at +5 covers.
Below 5, it obviously has no benefit.

Per the comment above I'm certain I understand what you call "dilution" just fine.
I consider classics diversification for long term, more effective gains (mpq Buffett?!).