A Mostly Accurate 4* Ranking (Final Update 8/11/18)

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  • D4Ni13
    D4Ni13 Posts: 745 Critical Contributor
    edited June 2017
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    I disagree about Sandman. He may not be stellar, but not garbage either. Things you may have missed:

    - more HP. 3-4k more than the average, meaning he's supposed to be some kind of tank or off tank.
    - purple move: it's a swapping ability that usually makes cascades, and after all the initial swapping is made, only then he transforms the yellow tiles. This mean 2 things: 
    A ) he can potentially create 2 wave cascades
    B ) he can set up the board for a yellow dependent hero (Example Cloak & Dagger)
    - yellow ability: you can fire it from one go, if you have a protect tile out. (C4ge, Flaptain, Gwenpool, Wasp, etc). It creates the protect tiles and then it verifies for condition. This can be pretty strategic and gives you protection or damage. 

    I say he doesnt deserve the #50 spot in your list.
  • zodiac339
    zodiac339 Posts: 1,948 Chairperson of the Boards
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    A disagreement: Sandman's green is not low calibur for his tier. It deals more base damage than any other 9AP AOE among Legendaries. It includes targeted stun.

    It can't increase in power like Red Hulk, oh well. It doesn't have a conditional heal like Blade, oh well. Its power is up front and direct. The only real sin in comparison to the other two is somewhat boring simplicity.
  • talleman
    talleman Posts: 444 Mover and Shaker
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    Did not know about Wasps rework and C&Ds value. Well havent been playing with C&D (only got 2 covers) but will use them in the future :)
  • Milk Jugz
    Milk Jugz Posts: 1,122 Chairperson of the Boards
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    talleman said:
    Did not know about Wasps rework and C&Ds value. Well havent been playing with C&D (only got 2 covers) but will use them in the future :)
    Wasp's rework made her a beast, especially teamed with Carol. Hit her yellow to place a strike and protect tile, get her ap steal going, and every turn watch Carol buff those tiles!!
  • Bulls
    Bulls Posts: 141 Tile Toppler
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    I'll say just one thing - R&G is most broken 4* atm and seeing him at 18th in my opinion can be dictated only by lack of coverage by most players. Just to back up my words - he managed to keep me in top10 in cl8 during test event allowing clears in 30-35min, in pvp for past 5 days Im keeping around 30% def wins (out of way over 100 attacks on me) with him hovering at 1.9-2k points.
  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,274 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Medusa easily belongs in the top 10 if not top 5.

    Just fight her some more, you'll see you want to kill her ASAP because she keeps hurting you, you match her CD it gets worse, you match her tiles she gets AP... she's a monster.

    Add in a strike tile generator to that hot mess for the full effect.
  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
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    zodiac339 said:
    A disagreement: Sandman's green is not low calibur for his tier. It deals more base damage than any other 9AP AOE among Legendaries. It includes targeted stun.

    It can't increase in power like Red Hulk, oh well. It doesn't have a conditional heal like Blade, oh well. Its power is up front and direct. The only real sin in comparison to the other two is somewhat boring simplicity.
    I'm not sure I'd use "any other" to refer to "the only 2 other."
    Sure... but Blade makes his own (superb) strike tiles that boost his damage, and Red Hulk generates Green AP.

    In any case, Sand Blast's 383 damage per AP (per target, at level 270) is roughly average, although fairly close to Mind Over Matter (388) or Earthquake (400), and 2-turn stuns are, I think it's fair to say, noticeably less useful than 3-turn stuns. So on the whole it's a fine, if unexciting power that has the decency to cost less than 10.

    Shifting Sands will play better than it reads, I think. You get to (potentially) make some matches before the tiles are converted to Yellow, and again after they are converted, which I think will add up to be a reasonable power. The obvious comparison to Fisk Defense seems painful, but Shifting Sands does have the advantage of affecting the board; you can actually kill someone with it (screenies if it happens, please) or destroy enemy special tiles, create more favorable matches, avoid unfavorable ones, etc...

    It's definitely not fair to rate him a dumpster fire and last place, I think. He's gotta rate at least higher than Venom, for having 2 decent moves and one that (while poorly designed) at least does (admittedly modest) damage, and isn't actively a penalty
  • Straycat
    Straycat Posts: 963 Critical Contributor
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    Thanks for the update! I like that the list is pretty positive, only one character is in the bad tier. Although I still think Eddie Brock could join Sandman in the dumpster fire. Would be fitting since they were both in the dumpster fire that was Spiderman 3.

    I do think Wasp is a little overrated, if she's not with Carol or a strike or protect maker, I don't think she is a top 10 character. But maybe I have just been running her wrong at 3/5/5. Gonna switch her to 5/3/5 and see if just those 2 tiles are enough to make her awesome. Also think Prof x is too low. Not sure how I would reorder it, but I think he is still useful and has a unique kit.
  • Starfury
    Starfury Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
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    sinnerjfl said:
    Medusa easily belongs in the top 10 if not top 5.

    Just fight her some more, you'll see you want to kill her ASAP because she keeps hurting you, you match her CD it gets worse, you match her tiles she gets AP... she's a monster.

    Add in a strike tile generator to that hot mess for the full effect.
    Take that strike tile generator away from her and she's instantly out of the top 10. She's a GREAT team player, but not on her own. Or do we put Carnage in the top 5 as well because how awesome he's with Medusa?
  • Style55
    Style55 Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
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    Starfury said:
    sinnerjfl said:
    Medusa easily belongs in the top 10 if not top 5.

    Just fight her some more, you'll see you want to kill her ASAP because she keeps hurting you, you match her CD it gets worse, you match her tiles she gets AP... she's a monster.

    Add in a strike tile generator to that hot mess for the full effect.
    Take that strike tile generator away from her and she's instantly out of the top 10. She's a GREAT team player, but not on her own. Or do we put Carnage in the top 5 as well because how awesome he's with Medusa?
    The difference, I feel, is that Carnage becomes great in only one specific pairing. Medusa teams well with a lot of characters, and can even become amazing without great teammates against an Opponent who generates a lot of Special Tiles.
    Going to have to agree with this, even as someone who is a newer owner of Medusa. She's freaking amazing with a variety of people (Iceman, C4rol, Bl4de, Patch, etc) even without someone who generates special tiles, Iceman for example, she can feed them tons of AP, plus her healing is nothing to scoff at. Also as you stated she's very good against opponents who generate special tiles.
  • Starfury
    Starfury Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
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    Starfury said:
    sinnerjfl said:
    Medusa easily belongs in the top 10 if not top 5.

    Just fight her some more, you'll see you want to kill her ASAP because she keeps hurting you, you match her CD it gets worse, you match her tiles she gets AP... she's a monster.

    Add in a strike tile generator to that hot mess for the full effect.
    Take that strike tile generator away from her and she's instantly out of the top 10. She's a GREAT team player, but not on her own. Or do we put Carnage in the top 5 as well because how awesome he's with Medusa?
    The difference, I feel, is that Carnage becomes great in only one specific pairing. Medusa teams well with a lot of characters, and can even become amazing without great teammates against an Opponent who generates a lot of Special Tiles.
    She's good with other teammates, but who else really spams enough special tiles to make her great?
  • TPF Alexis
    TPF Alexis Posts: 3,826 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Starfury said:
    Starfury said:
    sinnerjfl said:
    Medusa easily belongs in the top 10 if not top 5.

    Just fight her some more, you'll see you want to kill her ASAP because she keeps hurting you, you match her CD it gets worse, you match her tiles she gets AP... she's a monster.

    Add in a strike tile generator to that hot mess for the full effect.
    Take that strike tile generator away from her and she's instantly out of the top 10. She's a GREAT team player, but not on her own. Or do we put Carnage in the top 5 as well because how awesome he's with Medusa?
    The difference, I feel, is that Carnage becomes great in only one specific pairing. Medusa teams well with a lot of characters, and can even become amazing without great teammates against an Opponent who generates a lot of Special Tiles.
    She's good with other teammates, but who else really spams enough special tiles to make her great?
    Bl4de, C4ge, and 4*R&G immediately come to mind. I see Bl4de in particular a lot. Even against those who don't spam, but generate some tiles, like Wasp or C4rol, Medusa can make a big difference. In PvE, Daken and Bullseye show up all the time.
  • Wolarsen
    Wolarsen Posts: 326 Mover and Shaker
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    This week i used Medusa with kingpin; she provides a permanent CD for him and (not so useful) he makes attack tiles with hos goons.
  • zodiac339
    zodiac339 Posts: 1,948 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Wolarsen said:
    This week i used Medusa with kingpin; she provides a permanent CD for him and (not so useful) he makes attack tiles with hos goons.
    Strike tiles. The blue CDs make strike tiles.
  • therightwaye
    therightwaye Posts: 459 Mover and Shaker
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    Thank you, I've got Sandman was so lame. Others argued. I'm glad to see you agree.

    My quick fix for him would involve:
    Make his Green a team stun
    Increase Yellow Damage by a good jump
  • Anon
    Anon Posts: 1,455 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Now to see where Venom ends up.
  • Stick
    Stick Posts: 146 Tile Toppler
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    I disagree with the assessment that 4Thor is useless without IM40. I use her quite a bit, especially when she's boosted. (Yay sinister six event!) And I *rarely* pair her with IM40. There are other batteries that let you use a wider variety of teammates, and once she gets going she starts dropping fools left and right. In PvE, I'm especially fond of 4Thor and St4rLord + just about anyone else. (I use XFW because I have him champed, but there are other viable options, especially ones that work better with Starlord's abilities.)
  • dstann
    dstann Posts: 55 Match Maker
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    Really feel that Medusa should be much higher.  I just pushed for the 2000 points in the simulator and at the top of 4* land, every team has medusa in it.  Every team wouldn't include her if she wasn't good