PVE Scaling Feedback & New Test : Unstable Iso-8

Daiches

"David wrote:

Moore"]Hi everyone,

The MPQ dev team have been assessing user results and feedback gathered during the recent Enemy of the State Story scaling testing. We are now ready to run an additional test in the upcoming Unstable Iso-8 event.

Here’s the good word from Anthony at Demiurge:

“First of all, I’d like to thank everyone that participated and provided feedback on the Enemy of the State event we ran last week. In general, we saw better win rates and people were playing the event more. However, we also saw that missions were too difficult and reaching particular progression rewards took longer than we’d like. We’ll be testing the new system again in the Unstable Iso-8 Story event with some changes. We’ve lowered mission difficulty, and made it easier to earn progression rewards. The event after Unstable Iso-8 will return to the old system again. We don’t expect that these changes will address all of the issues we’re seeing, and we have another test planned after this. (In particular, having a high-level team isn’t providing as much of an advantage as we’d like.) Keep the feedback coming as we appreciate all that we get!

Updated Mission Difficulty Details:
• Every mission got easier.

o The easy missions more so, increasing the range of difficulty.

• Essential missions have a range of difficulty across the different star tiers

o All are easier than the previous run of the updated mission difficulty. o 2-Star Essential missions are the easiest and 4-Star Essential missions are the hardest.

Progression rewards for the 3-Star cover and Command Points have been lowered.”

The part about easier nodes is a lie. My easiest node started at 284, my hardest at 316. Where the heck are my easy nodes then? The only easy part is that they're all goons and can be winfinite'd, but that's boring.
If it weren't for the essentials I would use 3 entire characters out of an 88 character roster.

Can you please test these things in house before forcing them upon us?

This is the 4th straight PVE event that has been thoroughly unenjoyable for me.

First EotS test which garnered 30+ pages and prompted a new test.
Followed by Venom Bomb, the most reviled event you have ever created.
Then a Heroic. First sub I'm happy, because it scaled to my available roster. Second and third sub it scaled to my entire roster and nodes became unbeatable. Dropped from 1st place sub 1 to 47th by the end.
And now another test with nothing but hard nodes for Chulk rewards and a **** Vault.

Are you trying to actively kill PVE? Because I can tell you from what I hear from the vets, that you are succeeding.

Merrick

Will rubberbanding be left on for the entire event, or just for the first sub?

Ryudoz

The Bullseye/Goon/Goon node at the end of Arctic Circle with the Yelena steal team up is absolute tiny kitty. Add in scaling and "Nope, I'm done with this game."

madok

After trying the first sub with my roster a few times, I finally see it. You don't want us playing as much so you completely screw up the scaling for "fun"/"easy" nodes so we don't play PVE anymore.

I think I would actually prefer a freaking HEROIC VENOM BOMB over this. At least then I can have some fun on some truly easy nodes. I never thought something could make me wish for more Venom Bomb but you have accomplished that rare feat.



Why can't PVE just be progression based with super easy nodes to start with that slowly scale up to where you need that 4*/5* rosters to complete to get the final progression. This would allow you to even start adding 5* rewards into PVE events. This lets players of every level get rewards that go with their roster strength. You have a 3* team? You can with a little effort get a 4* cover or two. You have all 2*s? You can progress to get some needed 3* covers. Make alliance progression be like the Galatus/Ultron progression.

fmftint

Join forces nodes are not going to recharge after first hit

Linkster79

"David wrote:

Moore"] and people were playing the event more.

Do they developer realise that people were playing more because nodes had to be played more to reach final progression/good placement?

HaywireII

bataglia wrote:

In other words, now we can play when we want, but we need to play all the time.

That's been my feeling for both tests up to this point. However, I'm looking at how few points I need to get the 25 CP and I'm wondering how many people are going to get their CP and then just stop. Everyone hates TA Hulk and it doesn't sound like too many are excited about Colossus.

I'm torn because I'm ISO starved and have covers that are going to expire. I may just grind out the ISO and stop. Especially with Sub 2 being 48 hours. It doesn't feel like placement alone is worth grinding those nodes when there are no ISO rewards left.

Polares

Second sub and surprise surprise the scaling is still off the charts. I have had so much fun playing the Venom, muscle, thug node. What I love the most is that in the title says Easy, man it is like devs are laughing in our faces.

It is odd you now, because they changed the difficulty function to make it easier ... LIAR, LIAR, PANTS ON FIRE!!! Shame on you for lying at us like that!

CaptainFrugal

After playing the second test here are my thoughts.
The removal of the 8 hour wait for full points is a positive change.
This was a very nice change.

With that said that is the only positive I found.
The scaling is still terrible. I have a 2 star roster moving into the 3 star range. I have 2, 5 star characters with one cover (not useful) I have OML which has the Red cover making he nothing more than a meat shield that kills himself.
The event starts at too high of a level, it was so bad that I could only use half of my roster on the first few nodes, then after that I could only use my top leveled (powered up characters). After 2 times through it scaled so high that I only have one team that will be effective and that is limited to if I am luck to get a good starting drop.
This change does not make it fun, why scale them that high, and why increase it for no gain?
I beat the nodes with a command point 2 times and did not get the command point, now they are so hard that I cannot win the node, even with boosts.

Consider making it that you will get the command point on the first win rather than critical boost, that is almost a slap in the face.

Once again as before the major flaw is the scale, why make something so high that we are limited to 10% of our roster?
The only gain I can see is a push to influence people to purchase health packs. Why make it that if a person gets lucky with something they earned that it shoots the scale up so much? The system needs work. For an example when scaling consider removing the top 2 or 3 characters from the top and the lowest 2 or 3 as well, or start based on mode, or a variation from the median.

This does not make it better, if this version becomes the norm you can count me out.

Unknown

I'm glad they messed up the points. Looks like I'll be able to snag the CP progression from sub 2 and stop playing the rest of this train wreck.

Unknown

So you screwed up pve on the worse event possible and said you were sorry and fixed. Then figured "hey we screwed it sooooo bad let's see if we can make it worse" well you did it. After each fight the enemy gains 11-17 lvls... What is that. Some guy who has barely any covers is in top 10. Nothing like giving loyal players that have put in time and money the middle finger. 480days of pushing and grinding my way into top 100 then 50 and now top 10. I won't even waste my time on this trash. I play every 8hrs no problem over having to deal with this.

Game was popular before why mess with it. If new players join good but to demand top 10 and have you cater to them is ****.

I have always lvled guys champed all 3* and even have 220 4* yet a 2* or a 1* with two gangsters deal more damage per match then a 5* and put out 1200+ strike tiles kills 5* OML, lvl300 falcap and whatever lvl the 3* I use is (DD is lvl 181). Why are we being punished for working having earned these covers and characters.

There was an increase in game play because we have to play more just to get any rewards not because it's fun. You decreased sales of hp when you removed the ability to raise skills with hp. I have no use for hp myself so I waste it on pvp and packs. I don't buy it because I don't need it now. Iso is over priced so why would I buy it?

Scaling was fine before. I was fighting guys that were stronger but you could still beat them. Now count downs do massive damage, AI cascades like crazy and has knowledge of the next 30tiles that will drop. So it takes that match the wouldn't usually take. Bullseye doesn't use red but he takes it to get his cascade on.

Please quit messing with pve. You are ruining the game for the people that have enjoyed it for so long. pvp the drops are to random and generally favor AI so it's good for rewards but not fun.
PS I hated enemy of the state as it was anyways doing that test has made me hate it even more

fmftint

Eating 4k damage on a simple match 3 because I missed 1 treaten CD is not fun

MeatLoafX

I feel bad for the vets here. I hit max progression without even fully clearing day 2... Here is my roster:
https://mpq.gamependium.com/rosters/MeatLoafX/

Now I'm just trying to maintain top 50 for the colossus covers.

ojcAust

My biggest dislike of the new system is that it is making the lower end of my roster unplayable. Starting nodes at Level 220. Not sure where the easier nodes went, cos they are not on my game.

Yes I have an OML @ 375 and three Championed 4*, but I do not want to only use 10% of my 80+ roster. There needs to be a mix so that we can use more those earlier characters, not just the boosted 3*.

If this continues I see us all only using the boosted and upper tier of our rosters. Some would argue that is fine, but I like to use different characters and not just rinse repeat the same team for the win.

Unknown

I don't feel challenged, I feel cheated.

Are we having fun yet?

Eddiemon

cyineedsn wrote:

Eddiemon wrote:

I'm loving it and loving the scaling. Being able to play a match at any point in the day without stuffing up my final score is fantastic, plus now that you have lowered progression rewards it looks like I can achieve them with reasonable effort.

The increased scaling seems to be cutting down the grinders, so I should be able to get top 50 with only 4-6 clears of nodes depending on difficulty.

Um... if you are doing 4-6 clears of nodes I think you might quality as a grinder?

Compared to the old system where I had to clear every node 5 times at least to get a look in at top 100, its a meaningful reduction. If I tried to maintain just top 100 it would be even less.

But even if I meet your definition of 'grinder', my rank jumping up suggests that half the grinders or more have not been able to, either through scaling or anger at the scaling, which amounts to the same thing.

Eddiemon

bataglia wrote:

Come on, guys. To maximize my points I need to do a 3-4 hour rush, cleaning each node 6 times, and then 5 more times EACH before the round finishes.

In other words, now we can play when we want, but we need to play all the time.

Well no, why do you need to 'maximise your points'? You only need to beat the next guy.

I don't think there are that many obsessisives who will put in the 8 hours a day, and if they really do, well good on them, they deserve it, it's probably all they have going for them.

Eddiemon

PolarPopBear wrote:

But now with all my nodes starting at 210+ I feel like I have to take my A team (luckily for me is JG HB plus essential/other boosted 3) and every node puts a serious dent in my health packs.

JG is a great PvP defence unit but terrible for PvE. Run HB / Iron Fist / KK to significantly reduce health pack usage or a KK / Patch combo (use KK purple to overwrite purple tiles before berserker rage)

Bwanis

Maybe this was addressed in the previous 13 pages or EotS feedback but the elephant in the room for me seems to be why are the devs changing the scaling at all? Why not just eliminate the 8 hr point refresh and leave all other elements of traditional pve the same as they have been?...

It seems like this is the only positive part of the new system that players are universally enjoying so keep this and ditch the rest.

I just don't understand why the devs think anyone would want to play longer matches with a fraction of our rosters for the same (already) lousy rewards. We wipe more, get less ISO & CP just when we need it most. it's frustrating, it's salt in the wound when ISO is already so limited.

Devs, what is the logic here? Why do you think we will enjoy this? These changes do not make sense...

Sluggo

I just wiped on an "easy" node with a 180 Thor, 170 KK, and 224 DD. And this was on clear #1.

There are things I like about these tests, particularly the removal of the 8-hour clearing cycle. I also think the essential nodes and hard nodes scale pretty fairly, at least for a 3* roster, going from 120 to the 250-300 range by the time you're on your 5th or 6th clear. And thankfully max progression was lowered this time around.

But it's hard to look at this bizarre inflation of "easy" node difficulty as anything other than a cheap way to inflict more damage and cost players more health packs. It feels like a giant slap in the face to anyone who's stuck with the game for more than a few months and has started to build a decent roster.

At this point, I'd suggest lowering the easy node starting points back to the 40-60 range for everyone, run another test to get upper scaling right for people in the 4-5* range, and move on from there.