Vision (Android Avenger) Updates Coming Soon

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Comments

  • RaisseRaisse Age Unconfirmed Posts: 18 Just Dropped In
    DayvBang wrote:
    Raisse wrote:
    Coupled with the fact that creating a second density: heavy tile no longer destroys the first, I expected both tiles to do what they say.
    It no longer destroys the first, but it converts it to a basic tile instead. All five changed powers were changed in this exact way. You can't stack these, even for redundancy.

    Am I failing at reading? The new version of Density: Heavy says it only removes Density: Light and the other way around. The old version destroyed any existing Density tiles.
  • "David wrote:
    Moore"]
    Density: Heavy - bluetile.png 5
    Vision alters his density, making himself heavy and strong. Creates a Density: Heavy 4-turn Countdown Tile. While this tile is on the board, Vision deals 128 more damage and his Red power becomes Heavy Strike. Removes any existing Density: Light tile.
      (Old Values: Density: Heavy - 5 AP Vision increases his density, making himself incredibly heavy. Creates a Density: Heavy Blue 4-turn Countdown Tile. While this tile is on the board, Vision deals 88 more damage and his Red power becomes Heavy Strike.
    Destroys any existing Density tile.
    ).

    Bolded for emphasis.

    It does seem like you can stack Heavy and Light tiles now, or at least have two out at the same time for security purposes.
  • Omega BlaccOmega Blacc Age Unconfirmed Posts: 69 Match Maker
    I don't think 1000 points less damage is that much protection.

    Against match damage? Sure, and that makes him a good candidate against 5* without AP to fire attacks.

    Vision is actually one of my favorite characters...and yes, he needs to be out in front. He's going to be devastating when boosted.

    Put him on defense with Kamala and Carnage. Watch people avoid him like the plague.

    A real nuke stopper is actually Colossus yellow. He just absorbs damage percentage regardless of the attack's hit points. He's like the opposite of Retribution. I wish more abilities ran off of percentages.
  • Omega BlaccOmega Blacc Age Unconfirmed Posts: 69 Match Maker
    Vision always destroyed the opposite density tile when you cast Density.

    The change is that the AI won't keep spamming the same density ability over and over again. It will still mindlessly switch between heavy and light if the AP is there.

    I imagine having both a heavy and light density tile out would be the same as his normal fighting state LOL
  • Light Disruption should be able to convert any special tiles or at least protect, attack, and strike tile.

    Make it on par or better than Bulleye's Lethal Improvisation since this requires 10 redtile.png red and you have to activate Density:Light first, which is another 5 yellowtile.png yellow.
  • YoikYoik Posts: 241 Tile Toppler
    I purposefully championed Vision recently in anticipation of the change as the past 2 updates were for me so successful.

    I welcome the extra damage and mitigation, I was however hoping for the mechanics to change slightly.

    Make his heavy or Light cost more. Then they create a 4 down countdown tile. If it’s out then the team does the extra damage or has less against them ( Not just Vision ). Then when the tile drops off the effect is gone. It would still work with his red because you would have the choice of the big hit or the extra matching damage each time. It would work with the fortified tiles. It can also be matched if not fortified so there is a way out for the opposition.

    Even making the damage less and the reduction less would be ok if the effects were for the whole team each time.

    Anyhow. That’s my 2 pence. It’s an improvement but not as thought out as the past 2 toons they mucked around with.
  • _Ryu__Ryu_ Age Unconfirmed Posts: 149
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]
    Pylgrim wrote:
    David, can you tell us whether there are more 3* upgrades planned after these three?

    I haven't heard any specifics for additional updates yet. So, as of today, nothing imminent after Vision that's ready to report. I'll definitely update if and when I have additional news.

    Whaaat? There are no changes for 3* spidy planned??? That ruins my day...
  • CT1888CT1888 Posts: 1,111 Chairperson of the Boards
    It would be way more useful if the blue made his base damage for each tile increase rather than per match ; he'd start tanking more damage and would be legit scary.
  • ArcanaMoonArcanaMoon Age Unconfirmed Posts: 72 Match Maker
    Dont get me wrong, but doing 1040 per match is a pretty nice damage, ¡Beside! They forget to mention something... Vision blueflag.pngyellowflag.png will now be fortify tiles, this mean you need get rid of each count down twice, making him more efficient no matter where the countdown lands
  • _Ryu__Ryu_ Age Unconfirmed Posts: 149
    ArcanaMoon wrote:
    Dont get me wrong, but doing 1040 per match is a pretty nice damage, ¡Beside! They forget to mention something... Vision blueflag.pngyellowflag.png will now be fortify tiles, this mean you need get rid of each count down twice, making him more efficient no matter where the countdown lands
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]With Green Goblin on the way the team at Demiurge would like to provide some info on a new gameplay feature and a few ability changes. Here's word from the devs:
      "Hey all, Green Goblin introduces a new feature called
    Fortify Tiles. Tiles that are Fortified cannot be destroyed. Because of this, a few heroes were able to gain an unfair advantage when using a power that destroyed friendly tiles. To address this, we have changed a handful of abilities from destroying tiles to converting them to basic tiles. These abilities are:
      -Punch A Snowman (Iceman) -Fisk Gambit (Kingpin) -Master Stroke (Mystique)
    -Density: Heavy (Vision)
    -Density: Light (Vision)

    You are absolutely right, I think most (me too) did overread this. Even if it is not such a great update like they did to IM40 but Vision was from the start not one of the worst characters in the game, improving his power outcome, better AI control and Fortify Tiles makes him better then ever before, so he gets a thumb up from me icon_e_smile.gif
  • BowgentleBowgentle Posts: 5,038 Chairperson of the Boards
    _Ryu_ wrote:
    ArcanaMoon wrote:
    Dont get me wrong, but doing 1040 per match is a pretty nice damage, ¡Beside! They forget to mention something... Vision blueflag.pngyellowflag.png will now be fortify tiles, this mean you need get rid of each count down twice, making him more efficient no matter where the countdown lands
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]With Green Goblin on the way the team at Demiurge would like to provide some info on a new gameplay feature and a few ability changes. Here's word from the devs:
      "Hey all, Green Goblin introduces a new feature called
    Fortify Tiles. Tiles that are Fortified cannot be destroyed. Because of this, a few heroes were able to gain an unfair advantage when using a power that destroyed friendly tiles. To address this, we have changed a handful of abilities from destroying tiles to converting them to basic tiles. These abilities are:
      -Punch A Snowman (Iceman) -Fisk Gambit (Kingpin) -Master Stroke (Mystique)
    -Density: Heavy (Vision)
    -Density: Light (Vision)

    You are absolutely right, I think most (me too) did overread this. Even if it is not such a great update like they did to IM40 but Vision was from the start not one of the worst characters in the game, improving his power outcome, better AI control and Fortify Tiles makes him better then ever before, so he gets a thumb up from me icon_e_smile.gif
    The only tiles that will be fortified are the ones Goblin makes.

    The other tiles will just turn from being destroyed to being basic tiles, that's the only change.
    So no, you don't have to match the tile twice.
  • Jam_AdamsJam_Adams Age Unconfirmed Posts: 486 Mover and Shaker
    I've never kept Vision on my roster, and I don't see that changing in the foreseeable future.

    I will stay tuned to those that do have him. sometimes things are better than they read on paper.
  • mpqr7mpqr7 Posts: 2,642 Chairperson of the Boards
    It's an improvement.
  • JVRealJVReal Posts: 1,884 Chairperson of the Boards
    colwag wrote:
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]
    Density: Heavy - bluetile.png 5
    Vision alters his density, making himself heavy and strong. Creates a Density: Heavy 4-turn Countdown Tile. While this tile is on the board, Vision deals 128 more damage and his Red power becomes Heavy Strike. Removes any existing Density: Light tile.
      (Old Values: Density: Heavy - 5 AP Vision increases his density, making himself incredibly heavy. Creates a Density: Heavy Blue 4-turn Countdown Tile. While this tile is on the board, Vision deals 88 more damage and his Red power becomes Heavy Strike.
    Destroys any existing Density tile.
    ).

    Bolded for emphasis.

    It does seem like you can stack Heavy and Light tiles now, or at least have two out at the same time for security purposes.
    I think they just messed up the description, because this theory directly contradicts the entire purpose of stopping the AI from double casting them. If you could stack the tiles for any kind of benefit, they would have let the AI continue to double cast the same ability like it used to. I think its just human error and that double casting Heavy or Light with convert the previous to a standard tile so only 1 is out at a time.
  • _Ryu__Ryu_ Age Unconfirmed Posts: 149
    edited February 2016
    Jam_Adams wrote:
    I've never kept Vision on my roster, and I don't see that changing in the foreseeable future.

    I will stay tuned to those that do have him. sometimes things are better than they read on paper.

    If you put him in the right team (Loki purple as board shaker and maybe Gamora as dmg dealer) that flavours him in all his colors that he normally owns, every match brings 1000 HP dmg, a cascade can be easily this way a deathbringer to the enemy.

    My Vision is one of few 3*s that havent maxed lvl, he is on lvl 140, I cant test him very well with others, lets see if he is boosted here and there.
  • RaffoonRaffoon Age Unconfirmed Posts: 884
    edited February 2016
    Bowgentle wrote:
    _Ryu_ wrote:
    ArcanaMoon wrote:
    Dont get me wrong, but doing 1040 per match is a pretty nice damage, ¡Beside! They forget to mention something... Vision blueflag.pngyellowflag.png will now be fortify tiles, this mean you need get rid of each count down twice, making him more efficient no matter where the countdown lands
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]With Green Goblin on the way the team at Demiurge would like to provide some info on a new gameplay feature and a few ability changes. Here's word from the devs:
      "Hey all, Green Goblin introduces a new feature called
    Fortify Tiles. Tiles that are Fortified cannot be destroyed. Because of this, a few heroes were able to gain an unfair advantage when using a power that destroyed friendly tiles. To address this, we have changed a handful of abilities from destroying tiles to converting them to basic tiles. These abilities are:
      -Punch A Snowman (Iceman) -Fisk Gambit (Kingpin) -Master Stroke (Mystique)
    -Density: Heavy (Vision)
    -Density: Light (Vision)

    You are absolutely right, I think most (me too) did overread this. Even if it is not such a great update like they did to IM40 but Vision was from the start not one of the worst characters in the game, improving his power outcome, better AI control and Fortify Tiles makes him better then ever before, so he gets a thumb up from me icon_e_smile.gif
    The only tiles that will be fortified are the ones Goblin makes.

    The other tiles will just turn from being destroyed to being basic tiles, that's the only change.
    So no, you don't have to match the tile twice.

    This.

    They didn't add fortify tiles to Vision, they took away his 1 tile board shake because it had a slightly helpful interaction with the new mechanic.
  • GrumpySmurf1002GrumpySmurf1002 Age Unconfirmed Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
    babinro wrote:
    These changes make Vision a highly niche character designed to be played by 2* transitioners and sometimes used by 3* players when the stars align.

    4* and certainly 5* players are rarely using 3s, except for maybe those with good AP acceleration skills. The reality is of the 3 buffs thus far, Quicksilver was met with the same "meh," and the only reason IM40 seems awesome now is because now he pumps out AP to use with the 4/5* characters. Nobody even cares what they changed about his red/blue, which really were 'meh' changes also.

    So Vision's function, like many of the 3*, is for exactly the people you described. I don't see a problem really with re-designing with that group in mind. Though of course w/ the change in functionality of the AI, he became a slightly bigger PITA to fight, so one can argue its not really a player friendly change, even if he's stronger for the player.
  • puppychowpuppychow Age Unconfirmed Posts: 1,453
    As a player with a champed Vision, please allow me to explain what many previous posters here missed in these announced changes to Vision's abilities. FIRST, the nominal reason is to avoid fortification of tiles in conjunction w/ Green Goblin. originally, when you throw down a second blue/yel tile, the original one on board pops; no longer the case now. But to me, the REAL REASON is to close a loophole, where you can constantly throw down blue/yel tiles to trigger Kamala's passive yellow healing. Additionally, aoe dmg (when a yel tile is on board) is reduced slightly.

    I use Vision mainly for his aoe, so these changes are negative for me personally.
  • CrowlCrowl Posts: 1,508 Chairperson of the Boards
    4* and certainly 5* players are rarely using 3s, except for maybe those with good AP acceleration skills. The reality is of the 3 buffs thus far, Quicksilver was met with the same "meh," and the only reason IM40 seems awesome now is because now he pumps out AP to use with the 4/5* characters. Nobody even cares what they changed about his red/blue, which really were 'meh' changes also.

    So Vision's function, like many of the 3*, is for exactly the people you described. I don't see a problem really with re-designing with that group in mind. Though of course w/ the change in functionality of the AI, he became a slightly bigger PITA to fight, so one can argue its not really a player friendly change, even if he's stronger for the player.

    IM40's red and blue didn't need a new mechanic, they just needed more realistic cost and damage values and got those, unlike vision who needed more changes to avoid him being a marginally better performer in his small niche of being good for 2-3* transitioners who happen to have pulled a lot of his covers.

    His yellow and blue needed to keep the flavour of the existing powers, but do something to remove the need for him to tank the colours even if that potentially meant that they needed to be reduced in power to remain balanced.

    If they were looking to push things further with a remodel, they could do something like this, allow both densities to be active:

    Blue - a 2 phase power, the first would be an improved heavy density that didn't require tanking and then the second fires heavy strike but drains red ap not blue.
    Yellow - a 2 phase power, as above except for light instead of heavy.
    Red - normal nuke with a bonus dmg or effect if both tiles were active at the time.
  • CrowlCrowl Posts: 1,508 Chairperson of the Boards
    colwag wrote:
    A Max'd 5 yellow Light is 1000 points of protect damageish.

    How strong would it have to be, in pure numbers, for you to consider it?

    I mean the idea of having a protect power be strong enough to actually stop some heavy nukes feels like it'd be pretty nice, since all Protect mechanics seem to do so far is "stop match damage" usually, and "MAYBE counter Strikes or Attacks if needed"

    A Protect strong enough to make a nuke fizzle would be pretty nice.

    I don't think they would allow a protect that was strong enough that it could negate that much, so basically anything over match damage would be overkill and thus people are only ever going to spec to that level.
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