The perverse economy of CP in PVP

Gowaderacer

DrStrange-616 wrote:

Gowaderacer wrote:

Go slice 3 if you want huge points and don't care about placement, go to another slice if you need placement rewards. Easy as that.

Except that wasn't the case for me in Starfall. Oh, the top 10 had 2k+ scores, but I had a heck of a time finding good targets. Finally gave up at about 800, and got a top 100. There might have points, but they weren't there for me. So it's not that easy.

The points are there if you are willing to sacrifice a couple thousand ISO to skip targets.

madok

Malcrof wrote:

If they want to make CP fun, take them out of placement altogether.. and hide them. Randomly hide them.. hide them in different places every event, every sub, everywhere.. Don't say where, make it random.

Turn it into a scavenger hunt, but with no 2 the same. You want some CP, sure thing, 3 - 5 available each day.. Want to find them? have at it!

Could be things like, after 5th pvp battle (win or lose) get 1, random in 2 pve subs, random in a node of ddq, random after x points towards progression in x event.

Get creative with it.

That would actually be a lot of fun. It would be fun to hunt for that stuff with folks.

TheOncomingStorm

The problem with pvp is the same problem that has existed for a long time. Players who don't need covers get high placement, while players that need covers get the short end of the stick.

Can you say "leagues"?

Dragon_Nexus

For a long time PvP has had two options
1) You get in a slow bracket because you want the placement rewards.
2) You get in a hungry bracket because you want to hit 1000 or 1300.

Rarely can you get both. Placement to any worth while degree usually required going far beyond the 1300 mark.

So as a result, why not give us 1 CP for hitting 1000 points as well as the 4* cover? Then maybe a second CP for reaching 1300?

TxMoose

for the players at the top (i.e. not me), they could easily replace the 1300 LT and the pve progression with 25CP. same thing for most people, but several would prefer the cp.

Raffoon

I'm pretty sure they're not pushing that hard for an additional CP point.

Also, higher scores are generally a good thing for all players since it lets everyone else achieve the progression rewards more easily.

slidecage

everyon in my bracket all 4 stars max top 10... me noone over 100 ummm like i have a chance...

ALSO i though only the people who could attack is around the same score as you. Sheild season i was attacked i got 512 pts and was attacked by at least 3 people with 1400 or more

slidecage

Raffoon wrote:

I'm pretty sure they're not pushing that hard for an additional CP point.

Also, higher scores are generally a good thing for all players since it lets everyone else achieve the progression rewards more easily.

how when all of the teams are now 4 star max teams. i used to hit 700 to 800 easy now slamming into this max teams at 400


really PVP is not worth the hassle anymore i got all of my 3 stars covered the way they should be and no chance making 1000 without paying for sheilds so why even waste the time

pve is just getting as worse

D3 start Rank brackets (no1 higher then 2 stars , no one higher then 3 stars then 34or5 stars in this bracket only)

not only will that help more players but give people a chance to use more of their roaster.

stochasticism

slidecage wrote:

everyon in my bracket all 4 stars max top 10... me noone over 100 ummm like i have a chance...

ALSO i though only the people who could attack is around the same score as you. Sheild season i was attacked i got 512 pts and was attacked by at least 3 people with 1400 or more

If you would level your characters you wouldn't have a giant "Kick Me" sign planted on your back in PvP. You can't play the game if you don't even start.

TxMoose

slidecage wrote:

D3 start Rank brackets (no1 higher then 2 stars , no one higher then 3 stars then 34or5 stars in this bracket only)

not only will that help more players but give people a chance to use more of their roaster.

even if they did that slide, you'd still be facing 290/240/240 teams in the 3* bracket, which you'd be in. many of those 240s and 290s are as good/better than most 270s you see out there. (not in the upcoming weeks necessarily, but still)

killerkoala

DrStrange-616 wrote:

BCP I've been in brackets where 1000 points wouldn't even get you top 150. That's pretty crazy, but not the result of CPs.

On a related note, the luck of the bracket draw (in all events) is my new pet peeve. I have as many points as a person in my alliance. I am barely top 200 in the season and they are easily top 50. We will both do roughly the same amount of work, the same effort, but he will receive 20 heroic tokens to my 4. That kind of blows. The level of luck involved in rewards from the above to "spin the wheel and win 20 ISO ten times" is starting to chafe. And my butt is already sore.

lol you and ur weird visuals, thx doc

slidecage

stochasticism wrote:

slidecage wrote:

everyon in my bracket all 4 stars max top 10... me noone over 100 ummm like i have a chance...

ALSO i though only the people who could attack is around the same score as you. Sheild season i was attacked i got 512 pts and was attacked by at least 3 people with 1400 or more

If you would level your characters you wouldn't have a giant "Kick Me" sign planted on your back in PvP. You can't play the game if you don't even start.

just saying did not think something with 1400+ could even see someone with 500 thought they said the only people you see is around your same rank . That is why you dont see these easy teams you see when your down in the sub 200s

right now im border line even staying (want to see what these new features coming this year are) Then again its probally just the 1 year BLAHS ... Been here over a year and just finding it sort of boring, bad thing is you really cant take a break cause if you do you fall WAY behind now

also them running 7 day PVE and then a gaunlet does the game no favor for me as well hate both of them

aesthetocyst

slidecage wrote:

just saying did not think something with 1400+ could even see someone with 500 thought they said the only people you see is around your same rank .

Once you're "up there" the number of available targets (people within +/- couple hundred points) who are unshielded can get pretty thin.

Like....none.

Once such a player skips a few times, often all they see are what's available. The queuing system breaks, as it has nothing to serve them.

The most common unshielded target in any slice is ... players below a shielding level. 2*s, 3* transitioners, 3* and 4* players just starting a climb.

So, a player at 1400 points gets a queue full of 2* players worth low single digits to them.

And players struggling to reach 1K think they have trouble finding targets

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".

They have no choice if they want to keep advancing.

But you'll also notice they don't come here and complain about it.

No, they are too busy doing something about it.

puppychow

Stax the Foyer wrote:

Remember, there are 2 CP available per sub to anyone who plays PvE, with the caveat that you might not get it every sub. 2 CP for a top 10 finish in a PvE isn't a huge windfall, and it isn't driving the scores you're seeing there. They're not a new thing.

Plus, the CP generated within a high-scoring alliance from HP purchases needed to sustain that playstyle likely dwarfs the 6 CP/week they're pulling in for top 10 finishes. The ranking CP awards are a nice extra award, but it's almost certainly not changing anyone's playstyle.

Excellent pt re: cps available in pve. In starfall I barely played the event, basically pushed in the last 12 hours to reach 850ish. Good for t100, but not t50. I made a conscious decision to push for t10 in pve subs instead; somehow I managed to place first for the first 5 pve subs, getting 10 cps in the process. Anything I get from the pve nodes is an added bonus.

TxMoose

puppychow wrote:

Stax the Foyer wrote:

Remember, there are 2 CP available per sub to anyone who plays PvE, with the caveat that you might not get it every sub. 2 CP for a top 10 finish in a PvE isn't a huge windfall, and it isn't driving the scores you're seeing there. They're not a new thing.

Plus, the CP generated within a high-scoring alliance from HP purchases needed to sustain that playstyle likely dwarfs the 6 CP/week they're pulling in for top 10 finishes. The ranking CP awards are a nice extra award, but it's almost certainly not changing anyone's playstyle.

Excellent pt re: cps available in pve. In starfall I barely played the event, basically pushed in the last 12 hours to reach 850ish. Good for t100, but not t50. I made a conscious decision to push for t10 in pve subs instead; somehow I managed to place first for the first 5 pve subs, getting 10 cps in the process. Anything I get from the pve nodes is an added bonus.

i haven't missed a node cp yet, but I'm not playing this one optimally for anything. that might change when i start chasing LTs again in the shorter pves but there are cps out there for those that really want them.

slidecage

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".


you mean get on line and tell each other who to attack and not attack ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts.

also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen.

aesthetocyst

slidecage wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".

you mean get on line and tell each other who to attack and not attack ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts.

also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen.

(Fixed that quote for ya)


I'm going to make this a "choose your own response" response....

A.

B.

C.

D.

Clearly, I must yield to your superior experience, acute observational skills, and boundless capacity for razor-sharp inference.

So yielded. ;)

stochasticism

aesthetocyst wrote:

slidecage wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".

you mean get on line and tell each other who to attack and not attack ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts.

also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen.

(Fixed that quote for ya)


I'm going to make this a "choose your own response" response....

A.

B.

C.

D.

Clearly, I must yield to your superior experience, acute observational skills, and boundless capacity for razor-sharp inference.

So yielded. ;)

You forgot

E.

Are you playing the same game that the rest of us are.

sc0ville

slidecage wrote:

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".


you mean get on line and tell each other who to attack and not attack ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts.

also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen.

Seriously stop talking about pvp, you have no idea what you're talking about. You've made a decision to handicap your roster to focus on pve, that's fine, but it means your perspective on pvp is worthless. Life is making chooses and facing consequences, you have made the choice to keep your scaling low in pve, you therefor forfeit your right to complain about pvp.

You are doing a disservice to any player that is trying to actually understand the way the game and the current meta functions. People unfamiliar with you or your roster may mistakenly think you know what you're talking about, and pay attention to you. I can't think of anything more damaging to a new player's enjoyment or success in this game.

You demonstrate your own ignorance when you say thing's like "ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts." and "also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen." Your fundamental understanding of basic pvp principles is so lacking, yet you talk with such authority I'm stunned. Allow me to introduce you to a concept known as the Dunning-Kruger effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E ... ger_effect. The essence of which is summed up as this: Some people are so bad at the thing they're doing, that they mistakenly think themselves competent. You seem to suffer from an inability to accurately assess your own flaws, and instead attribute it to a problem with the game. Try learning from your mistakes instead of forever tilting at windmills.

I'll educate you on what Aesthetocyst is referring to: first when you say "I expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher than them" guess what? There isn't a magical point fairy that exists above the highest scorer in the shard, magically raining down points upon them. Getting to the top first is an ardous process of climbing, shielding, allowing others to climb, bouncing off of each other, and climbing some more. Yes, you can run out of targets with more points than you, if you climb early. this is most easily seen during off season pvps when people aren't wasting HP shielding. It's like treading water in quicksand to climb without the benefit of the people doing it first and expending their time and HP in the process.

As for the "also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen." comment. You are not visible to other players while shielded unless they already queued you up prior to you activating the shield. Any player that has that preshielded target queued, losses that queue after they hit it the first time with the (exception of double taps, which is much too advanced a concept to explain to you.) So no, you can't be "seen" if you're shielded. You are only visible prior to the shield and stored from that point on.

Please stop wasting everyone time with your posts.

slidecage

sc0ville wrote:

slidecage wrote:

Perhaps if those players could experience higher end play, they would understand why high scoring player "cooperate".


you mean get on line and tell each other who to attack and not attack ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts.

also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen.

Seriously stop talking about pvp, you have no idea what you're talking about. You've made a decision to handicap your roster to focus on pve, that's fine, but it means your perspective on pvp is worthless. Life is making chooses and facing consequences, you have made the choice to keep your scaling low in pve, you therefor forfeit your right to complain about pvp.

You are doing a disservice to any player that is trying to actually understand the way the game and the current meta functions. People unfamiliar with you or your roster may mistakenly think you know what you're talking about, and pay attention to you. I can't think of anything more damaging to a new player's enjoyment or success in this game.

You demonstrate your own ignorance when you say thing's like "ALSO i would expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher that is why you see people in season with 4000 to 5000 pts." and "also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen." Your fundamental understanding of basic pvp principles is so lacking, yet you talk with such authority I'm stunned. Allow me to introduce you to a concept known as the Dunning-Kruger effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E ... ger_effect. The essence of which is summed up as this: Some people are so bad at the thing they're doing, that they mistakenly think themselves competent. You seem to suffer from an inability to accurately assess your own flaws, and instead attribute it to a problem with the game. Try learning from your mistakes instead of forever tilting at windmills.

I'll educate you on what Aesthetocyst is referring to: first when you say "I expect someone with 1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher than them" guess what? There isn't a magical point fairy that exists above the highest scorer in the shard, magically raining down points upon them. Getting to the top first is an ardous process of climbing, shielding, allowing others to climb, bouncing off of each other, and climbing some more. Yes, you can run out of targets with more points than you, if you climb early. this is most easily seen during off season pvps when people aren't wasting HP shielding. It's like treading water in quicksand to climb without the benefit of the people doing it first and expending their time and HP in the process.

As for the "also dont know why you say UNSHEILD like it really means anything cause even if you have a shield on you can be seen." comment. You are not visible to other players while shielded unless they already queued you up prior to you activating the shield. Any player that has that preshielded target queued, losses that queue after they hit it the first time with the (exception of double taps, which is much too advanced a concept to explain to you.) So no, you can't be "seen" if you're shielded. You are only visible prior to the shield and stored from that point on.

Please stop wasting everyone time with your posts.

Then there is a major bug then cause i shield a few weeks ago in a PVP with a few hours to go , 10 mins later i was hit and said something like you lost an attack but because you were sheild you lost no pts I even had matches say i was attacked when i had a sheild up and gained pts. Hours later i was attacked at least another 7 to 8 times. I highly doubt these people had me in their Q for hours and just sat there waiting to attack me.




1400 pts see a ton of people who are higher than them... There is when the top in the bracket is over 5000 pts. Then why I at 500 pts are no longer allowed to see the people at 200 or 300 its just pure Max out 166 or better team yet i seen 94s or 120s on my way up to 500. I can skip 100 + times and never get a team below 166 Yet these max out 4 stars with 1400 pts can see and attack people with 500 pts with lower teams ...