*** Scarlet Witch (Wanda Maximoff) ***

Unknown

edit - this power might work differently than I thought, didn't realize the countdown was destroyed

5 purple tiles in 8 - there are 56 possible combinations (8C3) = 8*7*6/(3*2*1)
Of these, only 4 of them will give you a crit outright (>7.14%) without help of any other tiles:

:purple: X2



X2

If the tile is up against the wall and there is a purple above or below, you're getting a crit for sure. The odds are at least 25% on that. Eg on left wall:

:purple:



OR

However, this doesn't count external tiles or having purple already around the countdown tile, if you look at the game play, the Arcane Incantation was surrounded by 2 not overwritable purple already. The odds of making a crit are then 100%!

While I do think this is mildly overpowered for a passive, I think the video really highlights Xavier's blue power. There's no way one of these 2 powers isn't getting a nerf eventually.

Unknown

There's only a 29% chance that none of the 8 surrounding tiles are purple. Just working from the 1 existing purple you get 71% * 78.5% = 56% chance to create a match 5, and that's not counting any purple that may exist that's not immediately adjacent.

notamutant

daibar wrote:

5 purple tiles in 8 - there are 56 possible combinations (8C3) = 8*7*6/(3*2*1)
Of these, only 4 of them will give you a crit outright:




However, this doesn't count external tiles or having purple already around the countdown tile, if you look at the game play, the Arcane Incantation was surrounded by 2 purple already. The odds of making a crit are then 100%!

With 1 surrounding tile, you're getting 6 purple tiles in 8, 28 combinations. You only don't get a crit on these combinations:
X4



X2



Crit chances:
With 2 or more purple: 100%
With 1 purple: > 22/28 ~= 78.5%
With 0 purple: > 4/56 ~= 7.14%


While I do think this is mildly overpowered for a passive, I think the video really highlights Xavier's blue power.

Thanks for doing all the images out. Now it is somewhat random for me when you have matches made with tiles that drop, so I am not sure what order actually happens, but wouldn't you need to consider the blue tile disappearing when the countdown goes off? So for example, in your two sets that don't make a match 5, the blue tile disappears and the top purple tile would fall into the center. If there is a purple above that top tile, it would create a match 5. So it isn't just the question of if there are other purples in that 3x3 area, but also if there are other purples in that whole area surrounding it, I guess 5x5. So if you start off with this:







Even your two examples would create







At least in your first example of one surrounding tile. So you need to look at the bigger picture. I think that really makes a huge difference. And that is only talking about automatic match fives. The player will usually be able to make a match five even if it isn't automatic with just a single purple in that 5x5 area.

Phaserhawk

So when did Beast's old blue ability become overpowered.

Unknown

Phaserhawk wrote:

So when did Beast's old blue ability become overpowered.

Well, if Beast's old ability cost no AP to use, that'd likely have been quite overpowered.

Unknown

I saw the mistake, corrected and shortened it. We definitely need a simulator that is able to detect when you have a crit possibility with Prof X gaining notoriety and more characters getting transformative skills.

Scarlet Witch as is goes well with Mystique/ProfX, even with no yellow active and nothing on red.

notamutant

daibar wrote:

I saw the mistake, corrected and shortened it. We definitely need a simulator that is able to detect when you have a crit possibility with Prof X gaining notoriety and more characters getting transformative skills.

Scarlet Witch as is goes well with Mystique/ProfX, even with no yellow active and nothing on red.

Prof X has an active yellow. I would still probably rather have Deadpool to just get out the Whales! super fast, rather than have an extra activation of Master Plan from Infiltration, mainly because Deadpool has an active red that is really good and can keep SW alive longer with his black, to make this team super annoying on defense (for shield).

Unknown

Phaserhawk wrote:

You can check out my post on PX

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=28289

But seriously any team that can create match 5's becomes broke with Xavier. Instead of Match 5 of purple, on a 14AP skill, it's match 9 and 4K dmg. Honestly I think having pX create CD tiles that generate AP in the strongest color is a much better route. Anytime a Passive is uncounterable you have a problem.

Good Passive's

---

Blade
Captain Marvel
Deadpool
etc.--these are passive's where you can just play around

Bad Passive's
================
Prof X--blue
Iron Fist
Luke Cage
Hood
etc.
these are passives that cannot be played around or to do so requires so much time and effort it warps the game. The solution to these are to either have low hit points for the character or very expensive skills.

Prof X is running into Hood territory with his blue passive in that it is unstoppable and game warping, add to the fact he has 9K hit points and he is a problem.

Scarlet Witch, a passive on a 3CD tile that gets her some purple I'm kinda okay with, but yeah Prof X needs to have the AP boost on his blue tweaked, the dmg is okay IMO the AP insanity not so much.

I don't necessarily think that bad = uncounterable. It makes some characters unique.

I also don't think it's coincidential many of the characters you listed have massively OP passives.

Then again, I'm writing this under the expectations D3 cares about Rock paper scissors. Hint: They basically don't

Unknown

I think passives are generally overpowered even in fairly straightforward cases, like compare Unbreakable to protect tile generators or Exquisite Technique to attack tile generators.

Unknown

Phaserhawk wrote:

So when did Beast's old blue ability become overpowered.

When it doesn't cost 9 in the same color it produces. Anything that produces something for nothing is set up to be OP.

Unknown

Lerysh wrote:

Phaserhawk wrote:

So when did Beast's old blue ability become overpowered.

When it doesn't cost 9 in the same color it produces. Anything that produces something for nothing is set up to be OP.

You know, I wouldn't be surprised if this is why we have such massively overpowered passives. It really does look like they look at Beast's old blue and say 'well everyone said that sucked, so surely if it cost nothing to use it'd still suck'. In their budget for abilities, it looks like having to spend AP to do stuff doesn't actually get you very much additional power.

Unknown

Rework idea: Change the active area to 12 surrounding tiles. You could even increase the skill at max level to 6 purple tiles.






Still powerful, still a good chance of being a crit maker. Not guaranteed unless you have more than 4 purple already within the 12. Even in a bottom corner, you'd have a 100% chance of getting a crit if 3 tiles above was a purple, a more reasonable limitation.

Phaserhawk

Phantron wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

Phaserhawk wrote:

So when did Beast's old blue ability become overpowered.

When it doesn't cost 9 in the same color it produces. Anything that produces something for nothing is set up to be OP.

You know, I wouldn't be surprised if this is why we have such massively overpowered passives. It really does look like they look at Beast's old blue and say 'well everyone said that sucked, so surely if it cost nothing to use it'd still suck'. In their budget for abilities, it looks like having to spend AP to do stuff doesn't actually get you very much additional power.

You may be more correct than you know.

Passive's really have been coming out like crazy, I mean a majority of the last 10 characters have passives.

Iron Fist, Khamala, Luke Cage, Xavier, King-Pin, Quicksilver, Scarlet Witch, Cyclops, not to mention Loki and Doom Reworks

Only KingPin and Cyclops plus Rags don't have Passive's and now Hulkbuster, just seems like a lot lately and some of them are just getting annoying. You can't play around Cage, IF, Khamal, Xavier or Scarlet Witch and even Doom. They either come back or require you to stop the team from using skills which is impossible.

Defensive type passives I'm okay with, like Cage, Khamal because they are unique as someone said and they don't directly hurt you. They slow the game, but they aren't slowly whittiling down your health like IF, or oops I got a match 5 and you are dead.

Oh well, I can always quit if it is an issue right?

Unknown

daibar wrote:

Rework idea: Change the active area to 12 surrounding tiles. You could even increase the skill at max level to 6 purple tiles.






Still powerful, still a good chance of being a crit maker. Not guaranteed unless you have more than 4 purple already within the 12. Even in a bottom corner, you'd have a 100% chance of getting a crit if 3 tiles above was a purple, a more reasonable limitation.

I think it should just add 5 purple tiles to the entire board. An ability that's just straight up 5 AP to add 5 tiles to the board would still be a pretty good color generator (Mystique is 10 AP for 9 tiles added and in different colors) let alone free. This ability should have a threshold cost and drain some blue AP when it does activate, say require to hold 5 blue AP and drain up to 3 blue AP when CD resolves. That'd basically be a 3 blue AP for 5 tile ability that you can try over and over (no AP is drained if the tile gets matched).

ThatOneGuyjp189512

Having played with my 132 5/3/5 SW, her passive is bordering on OP. At least once per match it went off and created a critical, and 14ap isn't much when you're constantly get at least a match 3 when it goes off.

OzarkBoatswain

notamutant wrote:

daibar wrote:

Scarlet Witch as is goes well with Mystique/ProfX, even with no yellow active and nothing on red.

Prof X has an active yellow.

Prof X's active is purple.

Mawtful

I was just running my 1/1/1 SW through some prologue goon nodes to check out animations, etc.

I haven't seen anyone mention this yet, but her blue countdown can target adjacent purple tiles - resulting in no change. I suppose that only re-inforces the need to go to rank 5, but even then it is actually possible for 0 ap to be generated by this ability.

Unknown

notamutant wrote:

This just in from your friendly neighborhood youtuber. My newest videos are out for Scarlet Witch. The first video I discuss her skills and provide some basic analysis. My second video shows her in action. After playing three matches with her, I unfortunately have to say that I am almost certain she will be nerfed. I think D3 needs to remove Prof X from the game because he is destroying every other character team up. Compare her to my original Iron Fist, Prox X, and Mystique video I also released to show how overpowered that team was before the nerf, and she makes that team look like pudding. I got 14 purple AP by round 5, and I would've had more if my Prof X wasn't max level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lO47DvUW7QY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m14VbxOFQCA

In the video, blue goes off 10 times.
Summarized results:
7 crits. (70%) (3 of them had 100% crit chance!)
2 match 3s (20%)
1 no match (10%)

Most interesting results:
10:12 100% crit chance off left wall
16:06 100% crit chance off right wall

Fuller Results:

Everytime the blue passive goes off: 2:15, 3:35, 5:00, 6:06, 8:35, 10:12, 12:43, 13:22, 14:46, 16:06
13:49, blue passive automatically matches itself.

2:15 Crit, (2 purple below, not targeted, 14/21 = 66.7% chance)
3:35 match 3, (top left corner, next to purple)
5:00 Crit, (lucky, next to 2 purple, 6/35 = 17.1% chance)
6:06 Crit, (next to 2 purple, 1/3 = 33.3% crit chance)
8:35 no match, (top right corner, If he brought it down one row, it'd be 100% crit chance.)
10:12 crit, (left wall, pink above, 100% crit chance)
12:43 match 3 (bottom)
13:22 crit (100%)
14:46 crit (lots of surrounding pink, 22/28 = 78.5% crit chance)
16:06 crit (right wall 100%)

Wall crits: (left wall example)





If you have a purple in any of those 4 spots, it's an automatic 100% crit chance. One of these purples has a pretty good chance (46.0%) of existing if the countdown is in the middle 4 rows.

Mawtful wrote:

I was just running my 1/1/1 SW through some prologue goon nodes to check out animations, etc.

I haven't seen anyone mention this yet, but her blue countdown can target adjacent purple tiles - resulting in no change. I suppose that only re-inforces the need to go to rank 5, but even then it is actually possible for 0 ap to be generated by this ability.

Confirmed. In the video notamutant posted, this happens as 10:12 and 14:46. Consequences?
Future Sim/Gauntlet nodes: Her with iso-8 mutants (the ones that generate multiple purple iso-8 countdowns) and Elektra (purple strike tiles) are more likely to generate crits.

jojeda654

Mawtful wrote:

I haven't seen anyone mention this yet, but her blue countdown can target adjacent purple tiles - resulting in no change.

I guess for a passive that's ok. I remember Thor's Yellow used to not check if the tile was already green before changing it, but that was fixed after a while.

TheHueyFreeman

So, for those of us without Professor X, who else is a good partner?