For those upset over the nerfs

wirius

So your character was nerfed and its the end of the world. You feel that pit in your stomache, you feel like quitting, yelling, and generally expressing emotional discomfort. A few steps to help you out.

1. The game is not catered to you personally. As such, neither are the nerfs, don't take it personally. This was about design fixes for things that broke the way the game was intended to be played.

2. The characters are still great. Just not overpowered.

3. You may FEEL diminished, but you're actually on more even footing with other players now.

4. Recall perspective. This is a match 3 game. You will never win a nobel, or be recognized by anyone worthwhile in society for your accomplishments here. Its a time waster. Don't get so attached.

5. So you spent lots of money? Consider the advantage you had over other charcters your reward. If you thought you could get ahead gambling they wouldn't nerf an obviously OP champ, sometimes you lose at gambling, don't be mad at the house.

Dauthi

wirius wrote:

So your character was nerfed and its the end of the world. You feel that pit in your stomache, you feel like quitting, yelling, and generally expressing emotional discomfort. A few steps to help you out.

2. The characters are still great. Just not overpowered.

No, 4* Thor is mediocre at best. This is a slap in the face to those who did not spend money to get her.

3. You may FEEL diminished, but you're actually on more even footing with other players now.

This is assuming the nerfs were legitimate and not overboard. This is like saying dumping all your ISO and HP into spidey before his nerf put you on even footing afterwards. Nay, it dropped you below the floorboards. Perhaps not to that extreme, but this definitely isn't even footing after wasting all the resources for leveling up a a 4*.

5. So you spent lots of money? Consider the advantage you had over other charcters your reward. If you thought you could get ahead gambling they wouldn't nerf an obviously OP champ, sometimes you lose at gambling, don't be mad at the house.

It wasn't that the champ was necessarily OP, she worked best with XForce who is still OP. Players didn't have a choice but to level her up, and then get completely boned for doing so.

NighteyesGrisu

Dauthi wrote:

It wasn't that the champ was necessarily OP, she worked best with XForce who is still OP. Players didn't have a choice but to level her up, and then get completely boned for doing so.

I didn't level her and somehow did OK (she wasn't that good on defence, all those charged up tiles for me to collect). But then I didn't think her OP or in need of a nerf to begin with. In most cases I don't see the need to nerf anyway.

If you really think that 'players didn't have a choice but to level her up' then you are actually making an argument in favour of a nerf.

Unknown

Thor's place in PvP is weird because MPQ is a game where perception is reality. If you can convince everyone else that you have no chance winning when attacking a maxed IW + Elektra successfully in PvP then those two are now the most overpowered characters in the game because anyone without them will skip when faced against the two, getting a de facto victory for the defender (nobody wins on defense with any regularity, so any skips should be considered a defensive victory). I don't think she's as powerful as people think but since everyone else clearly avoided fighting Thor and I'd prefer to see less of 'you were attacked by lots of people' I ended up using that combination. In terms of real gameplay advantage she's pretty good at keeping PvE sane so that you don't get tired of hitting 25 abilities in a row to take out some level 395 guys and thus freeing you up time to do something else instead. For that matter, in really competitive brackets you'd find that 4 hours isn't always enough time to beat everything down to 1 even if the opponent never fought back so this is where Thor comes in handy and prevent you from falling asleep from boredom. But I don't think that was what people got Thor for based on how people described her.

ballingbees

I’m just confused whatever happened to the “vaulting characters allows us to work on them away from the spotlight” stance. Well, actually no, coz we already know it was a hoax to vault characters for no apparent reason. Certainly don’t recall 4Thor, IronFist or Mystique being vaulted for change.

Would prefer to see some consistency. And suggest that character balances be limited to close season updates.

Unknown

For those people telling me how to feel about the nerfs for god knows what reason as if they know something I don't...

1) I make a decision about playing a game based on whether I enjoy it. I don't give a **** what other ppl think about any given change because them having fun or feeling it's a good change doesn't make me want to play it. I'm not going to play something because YOU enjoy it. Therefore if changes are made that make me find the game dull or... more to the point... pointless due to there being ZERO progression i'll stop playing it.

2) 4thor is not great post nerf.. not even good. she is meh. If you think she is you don't know what you're talking about.

3) If you were using any of the characters you ARE diminished, regardless of how you feel. You are also now on a more even footing with 3* players if you were a 4* player which is ****. Why progress when there is no progression?

4) If you aren't attached why post your condescending and valueless post?

5) If you spend lots of money on something you generally expect to keep it. It's like buying a ferrari then they come along later and swap it's engine for a fiesta. Would some idiot come along and say "why are you complaining... you got to use the ferrari for a while. Instead look on the bright side you are now more balanced towards Fiesta owners. That's a good thing... right?"

Incidentally gambling is regulated and there's no way what they are doing would be legal if it were in a similarly regulated field.... basically it's not gambling and when you purchase something you should have faith it'll retain it's value... or at least retain it's use.

Thanks for the topic though... it's nice to know how I SHOULD feel and for someone who normally comments on posts about being impossible to get 4*s... therefore presumably doesn't use a 4Thor and has no idea about end game PvP telling me she just fine so it's all ok....

Unknown

wirius wrote:

You may FEEL diminished, but you're actually on more even footing with other players now.

We may be on more even footing with other players now, but those other players didn't lose several hundred dollars to be on even footing. Why wouldn't someone feel diminished to have paid several hundred dollars to be on a similar footing they could be if they had spent no money and been free to play?

Xenoberyll

All this overpowered talk is wrong imho. I think 4stars should be more powerful than 3stars. The fact that people are using their 3stars over Fury, Starlord, Elektra, Invisible Woman just shows that those 4star characters are too weak.

Square

bonfire01 wrote:

2) 4thor is not great post nerf.. not even good. she is meh. If you think she is you don't know what you're talking about.

I've been building my 4hor, and she's at 4/4/4 right now. She is very good now. I lose on defense, mainly to 5/3/5 4hor players, but I've been hit way way less than before. The new five blue will be the old four. It's not meh. I put 10,000 ISO into her today, partly because I came in second in PVP using her. I'll be continuing to get her up to 270.

She won't be what she is now, but let's not exaggerate about the nerf.

Unknown

Square wrote:

bonfire01 wrote:

2) 4thor is not great post nerf.. not even good. she is meh. If you think she is you don't know what you're talking about.

I've been building my 4hor, and she's at 4/4/4 right now. She is very good now. I lose on defense, mainly to 5/3/5 4hor players, but I've been hit way way less than before. The new five blue will be the old four. It's not meh. I put 10,000 ISO into her today, partly because I came in second in PVP using her. I'll be continuing to get her up to 270.

She won't be what she is now, but let's not exaggerate about the nerf.

You've probably been hit way less because of the scarecrow effect. Ppl don't check cover specs as much as they should and just hit skip seeing a levelled 4Thor. Where is the scarecrow effect when they know that an optimally covered 4Thor isn't much of a threat?

One of the ppl in my alliance has an otimally covered XForce but only at lvl 165 (IIRC). She takes loads of hits from ppl with bad teams and gets way more defensive wins than I do with my better team because of it. It's cause they don't check the spec... same deal really.

Arondite

bonfire01 wrote:

For those people telling me how to feel about the nerfs for god knows what reason as if they know something I don't...

2) 4thor is not great post nerf.. not even good. she is meh. If you think she is you don't know what you're talking about..

Top 10/5 is "not even good"? Lol.

It's upsetting, but that's a huge overreaction.

Unknown

bonfire01 wrote:

1) I make a decision about playing a game based on whether I enjoy it. I don't give a **** what other ppl think about any given change because them having fun or feeling it's a good change doesn't make me want to play it. I'm not going to play something because YOU enjoy it. Therefore if changes are made that make me find the game dull or... more to the point... pointless due to there being ZERO progression i'll stop playing it.

2) 4thor is not great post nerf.. not even good. she is meh. If you think she is you don't know what you're talking about.

3) If you were using any of the characters you ARE diminished, regardless of how you feel. You are also now on a more even footing with 3* players if you were a 4* player which is ****. Why progress when there is no progression?

I know you don't give a **** what I think, but personally, seeing almost 100% of my opponents from 600 points up be XF-4Thor makes for a boring and **** game. Same issue people had with Sentry-Hood/Daken a few months ago. I am looking forward to end game PvP much more in 10 days than I am now

While there is a big difference between how something is on paper and how it plays, I guarantee that 4Thor is still a top10 character and is most likely still a top5. She is just no longer #1.

****? Only idiots call things **** on the internet. Having top5 characters is still considered progression, not being able to trivialize every character in the game is reasonable, and if your chances of beating a 3 star team have dropped from 99.99% to 99.8%, then yes you are now on more even footing with 3* players.

Unknown

Taking out your anger on other forumites. Is this really what we have devolved to?

GrumpySmurf1002

The_Valeyard wrote:

Taking out your anger on other forumites. Is this really what we have devolved to?

This doesn't really read differently than the conversations after the true healing, cMags and Sentry nerfs. People lose their minds, threaten legal action, then go back to matching gems.

simonsez

papa07 wrote:

I guarantee that 4Thor is still a top10 character and is most likely still a top5.

I'd love to see the rationale behind this opinion. 19AP for 7k damage has no place in high end PvP. She's devil dino who can't dance.

Trisul

simonsez wrote:

I'd love to see the rationale behind this opinion. 19AP for 7k damage has no place in high end PvP. She's devil dino who can't dance.

If the ability was indeed "19 AP: Do 7k damage" then yes, you are right.

However, both blue and red abilities still accelerate AP (albeit not at the ridiculous pace it did), and the damage combo ramps up with the charged tiles as well.

So it's more like "19 AP: Do 7k damage, and accelerate future combos by dumping 10 charged tiles on the board" rather than "19 AP: Do 12k damage, and super-accelerate future combos by dumping 17 charged tiles on the board".

The fundamental problem here is giving skills inherent AP generation. I feel it was a mistake for charged tiles to generate 3x AP. Either they should have eliminated extra AP gain, or at least reduced it to 2x. This is why Xavier will be a headache for them for a while; they gave him AP generation on his match-5.

Also keep in mind that the stun isn't trivial, since stun counters a whole boatload of mechanics (including those **** ninjas that leave attack tiles on death). Back in the day, some people speculated that if 1* BW's stun was straight up given to a 3*, that'd instantly make them viable.

Arondite

simonsez wrote:

papa07 wrote:

I guarantee that 4Thor is still a top10 character and is most likely still a top5.

I'd love to see the rationale behind this opinion. 19AP for 7k damage has no place in high end PvP.

Good thing that's not her ability, huh?

simonsez

Arondite wrote:

Good thing that's not her ability, huh?

How so? Does surge/smite do more damage or cost less AP?

Unknown

simonsez wrote:

papa07 wrote:

I guarantee that 4Thor is still a top10 character and is most likely still a top5.

I'd love to see the rationale behind this opinion. 19AP for 7k damage has no place in high end PvP. She's devil dino who can't dance.

It's 10 and 9, much easier to get than 19 in one color.

Characters that can do 7k damage to an opponent in 1 shot

4Thor
Fury
Cage

Conditionally
XForce
Cyclops
Doom
Mystique
Patch

That is still exclusive company. Add in the fact that you get a 3 turn stun and you just killed one member and stunned a second. Plus you just added 16 AP to the board in colors you can use and get first shot at matching them.

Plus the 16K health that is highest in the game and the scarecrow effect that is not going to go away and this is still a top5 character.

simonsez

Trisul wrote:

So it's more like "19 AP: Do 7k damage, and accelerate future combos by dumping 10 charged tiles on the board"

If you're thinking, "First I'm going to collect 19AP, and then once I do that, it's going to slightly accelerate my FUTURE combos... ", your shield hops are going to yield a mess of red type.

Doc L

simonsez wrote:

papa07 wrote:

I guarantee that 4Thor is still a top10 character and is most likely still a top5.

I'd love to see the rationale behind this opinion. 19AP for 7k damage has no place in high end PvP. She's devil dino who can't dance.

Not to distract from your thread, but I would love to see the option of 4* Thor doing the arm jive. Maybe for the second anniversary, they could mix up a few characters powers...