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Give mono green some actual removal

BlorbleflorpBlorbleflorp Age Unconfirmed Posts: 47 Just Dropped In
Have you ever tried to play mono green, then discover there's no way to remove threats outside of combat? Green is my favorite color, but the days of playing it by itself are long over. Please add green removal cards like beast within and the like so I can actually play this color without losing 75% of the time. 


  • SlypenslydeSlypenslyde Age Unconfirmed Posts: 32 Just Dropped In
    Creature destruction isn't part of green's color pie. Sure, we can find a few cards in history with "destroy target creature", but when considering green as a whole that's not how it deals with threats. Green deals with threats by putting big threats on the battlefield faster. Green "removal" comes in the form of "fight cards" like Prey Upon and Hunt the Weak. Since there's not a lot of "destroy target creature" in recent MtG sets, I don't think we'll see it in MTGPQ sets.

    An out-of-combat fight card would be cool, but probably a new mechanic for MTGPQ. I think it'd be more reasonable to expect to see more Berserker/Vigilance spells since that feels more or less like what "fight" cards do.

    BTW, I do play mono green, I'm a newbie Nissa. That means I'm not facing too many very large threats yet. But I learned real quick 4/4s are my bread and butter, and the sooner I can reinforce them the better off I am. That means ramp, deck filtering, fetching, etc. I've got one buff that gives Berserker, and Ahn-Crop Champion can be a clunky board clear when it pays off. 

    If you're also relatively new, learn from that. Look for the cheapest 4/x creatures you can find, preferably with upsides. Pray for spells that give vigilance or Berserker. Add spells/supports that aggressively ramp your mana. Rhonas' Monument is crazy good for my deck. I've got mostly green creatures and a couple of vehicles they fuel. In one turn I might end up getting 5-8 mana on top of whatever I match! That's enough to put another creature on board and reinforce. 

    If you're way past me and wielding blinged-out green decks with Mythics, well, I can't help you because I'm not there yet. Maybe when I get there I'll agree. But right now I'm chuckling at rounds where I deal 35 damage trampled through the opponent's board.
  • BlorbleflorpBlorbleflorp Age Unconfirmed Posts: 47 Just Dropped In
    My Green deck is mostly mythics and rares, and I agree at the beginning it was easier. Nowadays, people run red and black only and blow up everything you try to stick on the board. They can, and do, fill half their deck with removal and the other half with win conditions, and make it nearly unbeatable by green. Green needs non creature reliant removal badly. You can't play it without another color. 
  • wereotterwereotter Posts: 2,059 Chairperson of the Boards
    Mono green doesn't have creature removal because paper magic doesn't do creature removal in green. They ought to add elements to green creatures that fit its identity. So:

    Green needs more creatures with hexproof. With so much targeted removal, green could stand up to black and red decks by making sure its creatures can't be targeted. Hexproof should be added as a consistent ability to creatures that have to activate an ability to gain it.

    Green should get more creatures with regenerate. They've already shown how they are willing to add it to creatures that don't have the effect on their paper cards with Linvala. Give green creatures that regenerate so they can more easily survive red burn spells along with:

    Give green more creatures with berserker, and don't make them cost more than similarly sized creatures in other colors.

    Lastly print fight effect cards. Prey Upon, as my main example, has been printed twice in paper magic since this game launched but never made it into to game.
  • SlypenslydeSlypenslyde Age Unconfirmed Posts: 32 Just Dropped In
    I've been thinking about this a lot as my Nissa deck gets better, and I sort of came to the same conclusions as wereotter.

    In paper Magic, green doesn't get direct creature removal for several reasons that aren't true in PQ. Paper Magic lets you have as many creatures as you want on the board and doesn't have reinforcement. So 2 Outland Colossus is still 12/12 of power, but it threatens to become 24/24 spread across 2 blockers where in PQ you only get 18/18 and one blocker. This makes effects like Overrun weaker, as well, as they have a cap in PQ. Also, damage isn't persistent in paper Magic. If you can't deal 6 damage to Outland Colossus, it doesn't die, and it's a 6/6 again next turn. In PQ, you can chip away at it 1 damage at a time over several turns and eventually kill it.

    This nullifies a lot of green's advantages. Green's most consistent removal in MtG as of late is "fight cards" like Hunt the Weak. They're designed to let you deal damage using your creature's power outside of combat, when your opponent might not be prepared. The best ones give your creature a permanent buff to sweeten the deal. You can often use them to snipe something that survived combat via a trick. This actually stinks as-is in PQ, as throwing a 6/6 at a 5/5 turns it permanently into a 6/1 and now it's going to die to any form of removal.

    I think that also applies to Berserkers. I expect them to last, at most, 2 turns. Same with defenders, vigilance, and any other ability that involves creature combat. I worked damn hard to get a 6/6 on the board. I don't want to spend more mana making sure it dies before it does significant damage!

    So I think an ideal fight card in PQ would read something like:

    "Target creature you control gets +1/+1. That creature gets Berserker, [First Strike,] and Regenerate ? until the beginning of your next turn."

    This lets your creature "punch up" and gain you some mana advantage. It gives the creature an advantage in combat. First Strike is an optional ability that might not be provided except on higher-rarity cards: it accomplishes the same effect as some fight cards that are "...deals damage to target creature opponent controls equal to its power." The regenerate number could vary. I'd expect a common version of this card to be no more than 1. Rarer versions ought to be at least 3, because I'm likely to be throwing a high-mana creature at another high-mana creature and I'd like to get some of my investment back.

    Overall it feels like green needs more Regenerate and Hexproof, even if it doesn't get actual removal. I get tired of building my ramp so I can quickly deploy 15-mana creatures only to see them obliterated by 7-mana spells.

  • Grenade110Grenade110 Age Unconfirmed Posts: 53 Match Maker
    edited August 2017

    I think this is what green needed.
  • HypnoticSpecterHypnoticSpecter Age Unconfirmed Posts: 190 Tile Toppler
    Also Overcome.
  • GilescloneGilesclone Posts: 735 Critical Contributor
    In paper Green has bigger creatures for a given cost than the other colors and blue has smaller ones.  Here they ignored that and left Green at a big disadvantage and blue a general advantage. 

    With the way they implemented 2 color walkers, rebalancing green creatures would likely make Kiora and Samut crazy overpowered so I doubt that will happen.  But better green spells and abilities would be a step in the right direction. 
  • CaemanCaeman Posts: 47 Just Dropped In
    A creature with Reach and Berserker should also be able to attack a flyer.
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