Start a dupe 4 or swap?

LavaManLee

@dianetics said:

@LavaManLee said:
But none of this has to do with the target at hand. Whom, exactly, are the 4*s actually worth ascending? If I'm missing any, beyond the ones I mentioned, I'm happy to learn.

Polaris, M’Baku, Juggs, and America with a side of Black King and Deathlok if you are randy.

Thanks. I have all except Deathlok ascended and still don't use any of them unless required. They aren't at 550 though so maybe that will change if I can get them there. Appreciate the response.

trenchdigger

Really interesting to read everyone's thoughts and opinions, but still unclear exactly what to do, and resorted to my default solution of when in doubt create a spreadsheet!

So my mpq workbook now has a new sheet "4* dupe or swap" in which I recorded the details of each 4* in my roster and tried to decide on an approach for each (swap/don't swap/maybe swap). To simplify the task, I split the 4s into 5 categories:

1. Not yet max champed (48/157 = 31%) - surprisingly more than I expected, and easy to deal with as no choice, got to keep adding covers

2. Max champed, no dupe yet (22/157 = 14%) - quite easy to decide, 13 covers before I get any rewards, and years to max champ again. Will swap covers for all except Vulture and a couple of others who I enjoy playing and might have some value either as lower level ascended 5s or as a result of future changes to the game.

3. Dupe is not yet champed ie less than 13 covers (23/157 = 15%) - hard to decide to effectively waste covers already applied to these dupes (and harder the more covers are on the dupe), but really, do I want to throw more good covers after bad and add to Super Skrull's 6 covers on his dupe? Will continue to add to Beast, Blob, Spider-man India, and have quite a few maybes including Elektra with 12 covers who will probably get at least 2 added for the LT at 271.

4. Champed Dupe (57/157 = 37%) - this took the bulk of my time, I have currently chosen to swap 17 of the 57 toons (I'm looking at you Anti-Venom and Invisible Woman), not to swap 18 and on the fence about the remainder. Factors to consider include how high is the dupe as better rewards will be forfeited nearer 370, are they close to an LT/5* cover ie. current lvl ends in a 9, are they a good 5/do I enjoy playing with them. Most of the maybes will probably become don't swap as I can't afford to swap them all anyway.

5. Already ascended to 5 (7/157 = 4%) - easy, keep levelling up the 5.

I have since pulled more tokens to add more levels to Agatha. This added levels to Polaris who is currently favourited. I also did about 80 swaps from the definite nos and have got Polaris to 547, and despite these swaps I still have about 15,000 more gold than when I started pulling a few days ago. So I definitely think there is merit in a focussed approach to 4* swaps.

I still have 147 covers in my inbox to apply/use to chase the next 4!

KGB

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

LavaManLee

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

entrailbucket

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

This is where I get a bit lost too.

It's a perfectly understandable playstyle -- max out the best characters in each category, then use them for everything. But once you've reached that point, where do you go? All the rewards the game gives out are used to build your roster, which is something that no longer matters for you.

Maybe you're just into pure competition, and what you enjoy is seeing your name on top of the leaderboard, independent of the rewards you'd earn? Maybe you only enjoy the gameplay of those characters?

Another obvious answer is "hoard everything for the next "meta" guy," but there's another poster (I'm sorry, I forgot who) who frequently points out the problem with that right now: the top characters right now are, objectively, insanely strong. How do you get faster than turn 0 in PvE? How do you get better than "beats any team of any level, every time" in PvP?

entrailbucket

@LavaManLee said:

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

I don't think the way you play is odd or uncommon at all. I suspect that among high level players it's more common than any other strategy.

DAZ0273

Isn't 4/5 Rocket/Groot in the running? I ascended mine to run with 4/5 Juggs and as I am not bothered about placement that team pretty much does all PvE for me with a few matches at most. I imagine the strikes must be pretty lethal at 550.

entrailbucket

@LavaManLee said:

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

I guess I'm confused then. I also want everything to get to 550, so I open tons of classics (which are way cheaper, if you want everyone) and ascend everyone immediately. It sounds like there are lots of characters you don't want, though? And how will anyone get to 550 if you don't ascend them?

I guess my question is, if that's your goal, how is what you do getting you closer to your goal?

LennoxHC

@DAZ0273 said:
Slight deviation from exact topic but:

I think ascension has become one of, if not the hardest aspect of this game to know what choices are best. Especially around the 4* tier.

Personally, I think this discussion illustrates the things I have liked about ascension and cover swaps. Those additions give more options on how to move forward building a roster. However, the flexibility comes with costs (either real costs or opportunity costs), and for me, trying to optimize every single choice is not always worth the effort.

For me, once I built a toolbox of characters to handle most situations and I got everyone rostered, I decided my ultimate goal was to champ and ascend everyone. So I'm not concentrating my resources into the characters I use the most, and I'm likely am not as competitive as I could be. But for me, that's fine; I'm content with the placements in PvP and PvE I get now.

With my long term goal in mind, I've been waiting to max-max ascend everyone. I don't feel the need to rush someone to use them, so I wait to maximize resources that I can use to lift everyone up.

To the OP, I guess I would suggest letting go of the need to min-max everything. It sounds like your roster is advanced enough that you don't need to squeeze every single margin out. If you like using your ascended Polaris, and you think adding more levels to her would be more fun, then go ahead and swap to your heart's content. If you don't need the HP for roster slots (and it definitely doesn't sound like you do), then what else are you gonna be spending that HP on?

LavaManLee

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

I guess I'm confused then. I also want everything to get to 550, so I open tons of classics (which are way cheaper, if you want everyone) and ascend everyone immediately. It sounds like there are lots of characters you don't want, though? And how will anyone get to 550 if you don't ascend them?

I guess my question is, if that's your goal, how is what you do getting you closer to your goal?

What is confusing? Just because I don't want to use them doesn't mean I don't want them. That's why in my above post I mentioned that not everyone plays like I do. Yet I seem to really confuse people with how I play.

I never said I won't ascend anyone. I said I won't PLAY most of the ones that I ascend. Where did I ever say I won't ascend them?

WhiteBomber

Lava said he wants ascended Antivenom ASAP, purple monkey dishwasher.

WhiteBomber

I hope I didn't let @Scofie down... If anyone needs me to repost my rough important tiers list, I can. Antinvenom, unfortunately, didn't make the list. Though I wish he did as he could be the one dedicated healing character this game has!

entrailbucket

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

I guess I'm confused then. I also want everything to get to 550, so I open tons of classics (which are way cheaper, if you want everyone) and ascend everyone immediately. It sounds like there are lots of characters you don't want, though? And how will anyone get to 550 if you don't ascend them?

I guess my question is, if that's your goal, how is what you do getting you closer to your goal?

What is confusing? Just because I don't want to use them doesn't mean I don't want them. That's why in my above post I mentioned that not everyone plays like I do. Yet I seem to really confuse people with how I play.

I never said I won't ascend anyone. I said I won't PLAY most of the ones that I ascend. Where did I ever say I won't ascend them?

Sorry, maybe I was confusing you with someone else posting here.

LavaManLee

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@KGB said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@LavaManLee said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
I’m not max-max ascending. It’s going pretty good for the most part.

It's suboptimal in terms of rewards math, but the question I always have is what would you DO with the extra rewards?

Like a bunch of folks say "I'd never use those characters anyway." And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then? Are you targeting those other characters with the extra rewards you're getting?

If your strategy is "get the most rewards" without some kind of larger goal, then I just don't understand that.

I know my playstyle and yours are not in sync, but very glad to answer the question "And that's fine, but which characters WOULD you use, then?".

Ascended 550 4Jugs, Polaris, Grocket and M'Baku are probably the only ones I would use. All the other 4s (again, this is just to me), I would doubtful ever play in PVE or PVP unless required.

Is that list based on power level, or your favorites from comics/movies, or something else?

If it's power level, how do you know that some other character isn't that powerful at 550? M'baku really wasn't on any power level lists until a few months after ascension. How does someone get added to the list?

Power level. I don't know about others because, for whatever reason, the devs don't want us to know everything. But I do look at what others play and what I attack and haven't seen others anywhere near as powerful in PVP or PVE.

I know you don't value speed (at least from some of your other comments) but I do. And there is absolutely nothing in the 4* Ascended, that I can tell, that is faster in PVE than what I use with AM/Emma/Thanos. And for PVP I haven't seen any others beyond what I listed above.

Totally understand if people enjoy others, but I don't and don't see any ascended 4s worthwhile besides what is mentioned in the above list.

Of course I value speed!

In PvP.

I'm looking to beat enemies as many times as possible, as fast as possible. I couldn't care less about PvE, that's boring and it's solved. The fastest team is Aunt May plus whoever, and you win everything turn 0.

In PvP I'm looking for the fastest possible team with decent defensive value, and it's almost always lvl650+ boosted characters, often ascended ones. I don't bother running anything under 600 or so, and unboosted enemy teams of any composition are generally just a speed bump.

Interesting. In PVP I just run my 550 SC/MT no matter what with boosts. Can tear through everything, including defensive teams with boosted characters. Not a problem at all. So, again, nothing 550 Ascended 4* really matters to me.

And with Leapfrog and Eros, I rarely get attacked from a defensive standpoint or, if I do, I win defensively about 50% of the time.

If this is all you ever run in PvP, does your PvE look much different other than maybe 1-2 other specialty PvE characters being used?

The reason ask is because in another active thread here related to the seasonal vaults you have been very vocal about not getting guaranteed access to the 3-4 ascended character. But if all you ever use is SC/MT, why do you care about ascension of any character at all? For you the roster part of the game is technically 'over' because you've achieved max level (550) with the only 2 characters (or maybe 1-2 more others you use in PvE). Technically nothing else matters roster building wise (unless another better Meta character gets released some day but presumably with cover swaps you could 550 that easily since you don't need to waste resources on anything else).

KGB

Because it's fun. I enjoy the collecting part no matter what. I want everything to be at 550 if I can get it. Doesn't mean I'll use them all (or even a fraction) but that's what makes the game enjoyable for me. And who knows what might happen with buffs/nerfs so this way I am covered (no pun intended).

Obviously, I play the game differently than many but it doesn't make the game "over" for me.

I guess I'm confused then. I also want everything to get to 550, so I open tons of classics (which are way cheaper, if you want everyone) and ascend everyone immediately. It sounds like there are lots of characters you don't want, though? And how will anyone get to 550 if you don't ascend them?

I guess my question is, if that's your goal, how is what you do getting you closer to your goal?

What is confusing? Just because I don't want to use them doesn't mean I don't want them. That's why in my above post I mentioned that not everyone plays like I do. Yet I seem to really confuse people with how I play.

I never said I won't ascend anyone. I said I won't PLAY most of the ones that I ascend. Where did I ever say I won't ascend them?

Sorry, maybe I was confusing you with someone else posting here.

No worries. Appreciate you responding in a kind fashion. There's a lot of faceless people here so the names can blend together.

trenchdigger

@LennoxHC
Like you, I do already have a toolbox of characters to handle all situations.
I don't think it is a lack of patience on my part that is pushing me towards rushing a particular character through the use of swaps, but a desire to broaden that toolbox.

I've almost created a rod for my own back by getting many of the metas to 550, as it is quite a hill to climb to get another character into that toolbox (a 4xx will pail into insignificance against a 550 meta team).

I've done a quick tot up, and guess I currently use about 12 characters in 99% of my fights. I'd love that figure to rise to 20 or 30 great characters to choose from but I want to be fast in PVE (Aunt May) and using sub optimal teams against dual 550s in PVP isn't an option.

I guess my objective is to increase my fun from the game by having more viable teams that can compete at the highest levels. So for me, cover swaps is a god send, but as you say it comes with a cost and for me it is trying to get that balance right which makes it interesting. And I fully appreciate that the right balance will be different for everyone, which is why it is so useful to get a full range of views from the forum.

And just to clarify, I do only max-max ascend, hence currently only 7 4ascended 5s.

entrailbucket

@trenchdigger are you not playing boosted characters at all? A 4xx plus 120 levels will often trivially stomp all over the "meta" 550s.

Borstock

@entrailbucket said:
@trenchdigger are you not playing boosted characters at all? A 4xx plus 120 levels will often trivially stomp all over the "meta" 550s.

Trench is probably playing against 672s, though. And most of them don't help there.

trenchdigger

@entrailbucket I will use boosted if they are viable, but usually this is only at the start of an event. After the first 10 - 20 matches, depending on whether I am able to start right at the beginning of an event, I am typically facing 672s or close, and at that point I find that boosted 4xxs either die quickly or limp home to a far from resounding win.

Although I have approx 20 550s, my roster falls off quite quickly, so I don't have the depth of your roster and I suspect what is often for you, is probably at best occasional for me.

I would really love it if we had more events forcing us to only use certain characters. I know we can impose those restrictions on ourselves, but in reality we don't, particularly if it just results in loss after loss.

entrailbucket

@trenchdigger said:
@entrailbucket I will use boosted if they are viable, but usually this is only at the start of an event. After the first 10 - 20 matches, depending on whether I am able to start right at the beginning of an event, I am typically facing 672s or close, and at that point I find that boosted 4xxs either die quickly or limp home to a far from resounding win.

Although I have approx 20 550s, my roster falls off quite quickly, so I don't have the depth of your roster and I suspect what is often for you, is probably at best occasional for me.

I would really love it if we had more events forcing us to only use certain characters. I know we can impose those restrictions on ourselves, but in reality we don't, particularly if it just results in loss after loss.

Ah, so you're fighting maxed out boosted characters, but haven't got the same? Now I understand.

I can certainly sympathize there. Going all-in on a limited pool used to be the best method of competing, before 5* boosts, but now it's put you into the very top matchmaking bracket without the same tools as those others. I don't envy trying to catch up at this point, either.

I suppose I'd just take the "it's a marathon" approach at this point -- it's nice that those "meta" guys can beat 672s consistently, but I'd be pretty bored using them for everything.

GrimSkald

I generally use boosted 5★s unless the boosted list is particularly bad. Trouble with a Max-Min 4|5★ ascension is that a 450 doesn't do me a lot of good -- I want my boosted 5★ to be in the high 400s at the very least if I'm going to use them in PVP. Also, as I've gone into on that linked thread, the rewards for leveling a 4★ are so much better than the 4:1 you're getting on leveling them as a 5★, so I'll almost certainly never do a max-min ascension on a 4★. If I "favorite" them, I'll get them sooner or later, and so far no 4|5★ has proved to be essential (I survived 4|5★ Juggernaut week back before I had him, I really doubt it's going to get any worse.)

I have a pretty advanced roster, though. As I said above, actual use trumps virtually everything else. If you're going to use the character, that can definitely justify loosing out on some rewards.