Regarding Ascended characters and retro rewards

WhiteBomber

Does the level you ascend your character at actually have any relevance / impact when they change feeders, or are you rewarded only for the currently level of that characters ascended level? Hard to imagine they are saving the data you ascended your character at, rather than just giving you the total amount of levels based off it's current ascended level.

dianetics

I am sure you understand, because this hasn't been explained explicitly...it is your fault.

No questions are acceptable. Just say thank you.

entrailbucket

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:
What are some reasons you wouldn't use a powerful character like Coulson after you had him ascended?

(Actually asking, not trolling -- I'm interested in people's thoughts in this vein)

Don't have the right characters to make him effective. Coulson added to my ascended Juggs and 5* Omega team isn't going to do a ton.
Or a perception that he's not a fast as another team I use.

So, does this mean that you're only interested in acquiring characters that do work with those two (for the occasional pick-3 events/sim)?

Or, because that team is very fast and can kill everything pretty trivially, are you not interested in any other characters at all? What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

entrailbucket

@dianetics said:
I am sure you understand, because this hasn't been explained explicitly...it is your fault.

No questions are acceptable. Just say thank you.

No, seriously! I'm actually interested in what folks have to say on this, because I don't understand where they're coming from, and I want to. I've done a pretty bad job of asking for others' opinions and listening to them in the past.

KGB

@entrailbucket said:
What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

Isn't it obvious by now? He's (and most of us) turning the rewards earned into yet more rewards earned

KGB

dianetics

@entrailbucket said:

@dianetics said:
I am sure you understand, because this hasn't been explained explicitly...it is your fault.

No questions are acceptable. Just say thank you.

No, seriously! I'm actually interested in what folks have to say on this, because I don't understand where they're coming from, and I want to. I've done a pretty bad job of asking for others' opinions and listening to them in the past.

My stance is in line with the original explanation.
They softened it and caved to retro rewards. If that is their decision as the game dev's fine.

I am not a fan of the rich getting richer and if they make a choice that weakens them in some manner nobody should actually care...because they still will compete and have no real problems.
They will just have to spend more resources which everybody not on their level should want.

If you ascend a character you should not get retro rewards. Being clear I have +50 ascended toons and request no compensation from them.

entrailbucket

@dianetics said:

@entrailbucket said:

@dianetics said:
I am sure you understand, because this hasn't been explained explicitly...it is your fault.

No questions are acceptable. Just say thank you.

No, seriously! I'm actually interested in what folks have to say on this, because I don't understand where they're coming from, and I want to. I've done a pretty bad job of asking for others' opinions and listening to them in the past.

My stance is in line with the original explanation.
They softened it and caved to retro rewards. If that is their decision as the game dev's fine.

I am not a fan of the rich getting richer and if they make a choice that weakens them in some manner nobody should actually care...because they still will compete and have no real problems.
They will just have to spend more resources which everybody not on their level should want.

If you ascend a character you should not get retro rewards. Being clear I have +50 ascended toons and request no compensation from them.

Oh sorry, I completely misunderstood what you were saying. I was asking why people wouldn't use certain strong characters. You weren't answering me, you were talking about the devs' policies. Never mind!

entrailbucket

@KGB said:

@entrailbucket said:
What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

Isn't it obvious by now? He's (and most of us) turning the rewards earned into yet more rewards earned

KGB

Ok THIS is what I don't get.

Is the idea that you're saving up for some theoretical future mega-powerful guy who'll stomp everything even easier? That makes sense.

But that can't be it either, because some of these players really want the feeder shards for, like, 5* Black Widow or similar -- characters nobody would use ever.

Grizwald

@entrailbucket said:

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:
What are some reasons you wouldn't use a powerful character like Coulson after you had him ascended?

(Actually asking, not trolling -- I'm interested in people's thoughts in this vein)

Don't have the right characters to make him effective. Coulson added to my ascended Juggs and 5* Omega team isn't going to do a ton.
Or a perception that he's not a fast as another team I use.

So, does this mean that you're only interested in acquiring characters that do work with those two (for the occasional pick-3 events/sim)?

Or, because that team is very fast and can kill everything pretty trivially, are you not interested in any other characters at all? What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

Characters are like Pokémon, got to catch them all. I've got roughly 70% of the 5* champed. Even some of the not so great ones. The majority of my rewards are going towards staying current with the 5* releases. But that's taking less resources than I'm making so I have a surplus.

I'm also not trying to champion new releases as soon as they come out. So it can take me some time before they are usable to me. But it takes a lot for a new character to be more than a rewards factory.

entrailbucket

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:
What are some reasons you wouldn't use a powerful character like Coulson after you had him ascended?

(Actually asking, not trolling -- I'm interested in people's thoughts in this vein)

Don't have the right characters to make him effective. Coulson added to my ascended Juggs and 5* Omega team isn't going to do a ton.
Or a perception that he's not a fast as another team I use.

So, does this mean that you're only interested in acquiring characters that do work with those two (for the occasional pick-3 events/sim)?

Or, because that team is very fast and can kill everything pretty trivially, are you not interested in any other characters at all? What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

Characters are like Pokémon, got to catch them all. I've got roughly 70% of the 5* champed. Even some of the not so great ones. The majority of my rewards are going towards staying current with the 5* releases. But that's taking less resources than I'm making so I have a surplus.

I'm also not trying to champion new releases as soon as they come out. So it can take me some time before they are usable to me. But it takes a lot for a new character to be more than a rewards factory.

Ok, that makes sense. So your goal is to champion all the 5*, while staying current on releases?

What's the endgame? If you have 70% of them now, you're closer than a lot of other players! What will you do when you champion all the 5*?

entrailbucket

@WhiteBomber said:
Does the level you ascend your character at actually have any relevance / impact when they change feeders, or are you rewarded only for the currently level of that characters ascended level? Hard to imagine they are saving the data you ascended your character at, rather than just giving you the total amount of levels based off it's current ascended level.

Sorry I derailed the thread. You're rewarded only for the current level.

ThaRoadWarrior

@WhiteBomber said:
Does the level you ascend your character at actually have any relevance / impact when they change feeders, or are you rewarded only for the currently level of that characters ascended level? Hard to imagine they are saving the data you ascended your character at, rather than just giving you the total amount of levels based off it's current ascended level.

It’s based off your current ascended level. So a 278 ascension buddy will get you a 452 5* at the 4:1 burn ratio. So that will not result in “lots” of retro rewards. Let me see if I can find the 7-day rewards schedule someplace.

ThaRoadWarrior

Shout out to @JimboJambo who posted this on the Agatha Harkness thread. Just replace Agatha with whatever character it is at the time:

Level 451: Purple Agatha cover
Level 452: 1800 Agatha shards
level 453: 700 Agatha shards
level 454: Purple Agatha cover
level 455: LT
level 456: 5000 iso
level 457: 250 Agatha shards
level 458: 250 Agatha shards
level 459: LT
460: 5000 iso
461: 60 CP
462: 250 Agatha shards
463: 250 Agatha shards
464: 5000 iso
465: LT
466: 750 HP
467: 500 Agatha shards
468: LT
469: 100 Agatha shards
470: 400 Agatha shards
471: LT
472: 250 Agatha shards
473: 250 Agatha shards
474: 500 HP
475: LT

Grizwald

@entrailbucket said:

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:

@Grizwald said:

@entrailbucket said:
What are some reasons you wouldn't use a powerful character like Coulson after you had him ascended?

(Actually asking, not trolling -- I'm interested in people's thoughts in this vein)

Don't have the right characters to make him effective. Coulson added to my ascended Juggs and 5* Omega team isn't going to do a ton.
Or a perception that he's not a fast as another team I use.

So, does this mean that you're only interested in acquiring characters that do work with those two (for the occasional pick-3 events/sim)?

Or, because that team is very fast and can kill everything pretty trivially, are you not interested in any other characters at all? What are you doing with all the rewards you earn?

Characters are like Pokémon, got to catch them all. I've got roughly 70% of the 5* champed. Even some of the not so great ones. The majority of my rewards are going towards staying current with the 5* releases. But that's taking less resources than I'm making so I have a surplus.

I'm also not trying to champion new releases as soon as they come out. So it can take me some time before they are usable to me. But it takes a lot for a new character to be more than a rewards factory.

Ok, that makes sense. So your goal is to champion all the 5*, while staying current on releases?

What's the endgame? If you have 70% of them now, you're closer than a lot of other players! What will you do when you champion all the 5*?

Don't know yet. Maybe get the characters I use to 550? Become one of those players that complains about having too much Iso? Sell everything and start again?

GrimSkald

@entrailbucket said:

@WhiteBomber said:
Does the level you ascend your character at actually have any relevance / impact when they change feeders, or are you rewarded only for the currently level of that characters ascended level? Hard to imagine they are saving the data you ascended your character at, rather than just giving you the total amount of levels based off it's current ascended level.

Sorry I derailed the thread. You're rewarded only for the current level.

Short answer, you're given retroactive rewards for your current level, though you can get more rewards as you level them (for only a week if they're a 5★, though.) As far as I can tell, here's how the system works:

The devs have a script that they can run to have the system pull only covers and shards from the level rewards from various characters. Sometime overnight on Thursday, they change the rewards on the 4★ and 4|5★ versions for the feeder and run that script -- so Thursday morning everyone gets the rewards for whatever levels they have already passed. For example, I have a level 477 4|5★ and a level 300 4★ Nova -- that Thursday a few weeks ago I ended up with 2 covers and 10 covers worth of Shards (12 for the 475 Nova, 2 for the 300 Nova.)

If you level the character, you get those covers and shards. This includes ascending the character -- when you ascend the character excess levels on the second character get applied as levels on the new character. The same is true of the 4|5★ character for one week (so Wiccan's rewards went back to normal today.) So if you have two 370 Wiccans, you'd have gotten 12 covers worth of rewards when they ran the retro script, and if you ascended him you'd get 12 more from those first 25 levels. That's what we mean by "double dipping." It's only possible for one week.

Similarly, if you have, say, a 460 Wiccan, if you favorite him and pull another 20 covers, you'll get another cover's worth of Shards for him (and 25 cp and some Iso,) since that will level your Wiccan from 461 to 464. I know that sounds like a lot, but it's very possible with the favorite system -- that Thursday is when both the LTs and Classic characters flip, so if you're going to pull at all, pulling then is the time.

WhiteBomber

@GrimSkald said:

@entrailbucket said:

@WhiteBomber said:
Does the level you ascend your character at actually have any relevance / impact when they change feeders, or are you rewarded only for the currently level of that characters ascended level? Hard to imagine they are saving the data you ascended your character at, rather than just giving you the total amount of levels based off it's current ascended level.

Sorry I derailed the thread. You're rewarded only for the current level.

Short answer, you're given retroactive rewards for your current level, though you can get more rewards as you level them (for only a week if they're a 5★, though.) As far as I can tell, here's how the system works:

The devs have a script that they can run to have the system pull only covers and shards from the level rewards from various characters. Sometime overnight on Thursday, they change the rewards on the 4★ and 4|5★ versions for the feeder and run that script -- so Thursday morning everyone gets the rewards for whatever levels they have already passed. For example, I have a level 477 4|5★ and a level 300 4★ Nova -- that Thursday a few weeks ago I ended up with 2 covers and 10 covers worth of Shards (12 for the 475 Nova, 2 for the 300 Nova.)

If you level the character, you get those covers and shards. This includes ascending the character -- when you ascend the character excess levels on the second character get applied as levels on the new character. The same is true of the 4|5★ character for one week (so Wiccan's rewards went back to normal today.) So if you have two 370 Wiccans, you'd have gotten 12 covers worth of rewards when they ran the retro script, and if you ascended him you'd get 12 more from those first 25 levels. That's what we mean by "double dipping." It's only possible for one week.

Similarly, if you have, say, a 460 Wiccan, if you favorite him and pull another 20 covers, you'll get another cover's worth of Shards for him (and 25 cp and some Iso,) since that will level your Wiccan from 461 to 464. I know that sounds like a lot, but it's very possible with the favorite system -- that Thursday is when both the LTs and Classic characters flip, so if you're going to pull at all, pulling then is the time.

mmm, ok. So basically I would have to sit on both my Coulson's and only ascend during that window? That's definitely not going to happen, I don't have that kind of patience. I saw so many posts about not ascending them until they were certain levels because of the rewards, but it sounds like, since Coulson doesn't currently feed anyone I would only be losing out on the 4 star rewards up to X level by ascending him early.

By the logic of only getting retro rewards from the ascended level, you would think it would make more sense to ascend early since they level up faster if you pull sooner. Either way, IF I read that correctly and I would have to wait for the retros to change to ascend, I'll definitely be ascending as soon as Doupson hits 14 covers.

Thanks to everyone who continually tries to explain this nonsense.

ThaRoadWarrior

@WhiteBomber said:

By the logic of only getting retro rewards from the ascended level, you would think it would make more sense to ascend early since they level up faster if you pull sooner. Either way, IF I read that correctly and I would have to wait for the retros to change to ascend, I'll definitely be ascending as soon as Doupson hits 14 covers.

Thanks to everyone who continually tries to explain this nonsense.

It still takes 4 covers to go up a single 5* level, the rationale for not ascending until they can jump to whatever post-ascension level you want them to be is so that you don't throw away 3 out of every 4 covers for nothing but XP towards your Shield Rank, but instead get teh 4* rewards along the way.

WhiteBomber

@ThaRoadWarrior said:

@WhiteBomber said:

By the logic of only getting retro rewards from the ascended level, you would think it would make more sense to ascend early since they level up faster if you pull sooner. Either way, IF I read that correctly and I would have to wait for the retros to change to ascend, I'll definitely be ascending as soon as Doupson hits 14 covers.

Thanks to everyone who continually tries to explain this nonsense.

It still takes 4 covers to go up a single 5* level, the rationale for not ascending until they can jump to whatever post-ascension level you want them to be is so that you don't throw away 3 out of every 4 covers for nothing but XP towards your Shield Rank, but instead get teh 4* rewards along the way.

For sure, I think if I were at a different point with my roster I would do that, but since this will be my third ascended 4star, who I specifically targeted for play value and had favorited since he was only like 15 covers total (he was basically my lowest level 4star), I gotta pull the trigger.

I farm as many of the 1,2,3 stars as possible, but some I just can hold off on. Once the rest of my 4stars start naturally hitting max champ, I will likely let some of those go as long as I can afford the slots. XForce and Juggy4 are the only 2 4stars I have that are on dupes naturally, I might hold them for a while.

Karass

I thank all of you heartily for all your answers

JoeHandle

@0zfest said:
you should never spent HP or CP and NEVER open covers ... EVER !

"NEVER"? On anything?

Was this an attempt at parody of the received 'wisdom' pervasive in online MPQ circles?