Character Updates: Negasonic (Modern), Beast (AoA), Yellowjacket (Live 4/27)

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  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
    edited April 2023
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    To clarify my issue with this:

    Beast was amazing at his colors, and I would often bring him if he would tank any one of his own colors. He would work well with a huge list of characters, I'm not even going to waste the time trying to list them all.

    Now, he requires support to get going instead. His blue has to fire first for anything to happen for him, his green is an "only fire" after his blue has been going for a bit, and there's no way for him to fuel his own black now.

    Before, his powers cycled into each other powerfully and smoothly. Fire his green first? No problem, you've got blue charges out to work with. Catch those, throw blue, then don't hesitate to match away your own attack or protect tiles as things keep going. By the time his blue CD's ticked through, you'd often have the green to fire again, and boom, more blue charges.

    This was so flexible and easy hitting, and yet he never really overcame too many other characters. I'd rotate him through with plenty other 4 star's, but was a favorite for a while.

    He's just... So much slower. Now you have to wait for SAP's to be out before you can throw green to any benefit, blue now feels so much more expensive without those charge tiles to fuel it, and his doesn't generate black on his own, making him stronger.

    The end result feels like they wanted him to be more of a team player, but that's not Dark Beast's style, that's not how he worked, and frankly even with this edit he sucks at that role. Tried him with Apocalypse was just like..... Eh? So what? Doesn't bring any oomph. Tried him with BRB, that was mildly more interesting except for the color overlap. So my overall opinion is:

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

  • ThisisClemFandango
    ThisisClemFandango Posts: 690 Critical Contributor
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    @Alex502 said:
    Change Beast back!!

    This change is horrible! He was one of the best self fueling 4 star characters before, and how he's just.... Limp! Weakened. He doesn't start cooking off for himself any more, and his black AP pooling doesn't work as well! He wanted a waiting supply of black, it made him stronger! Everything stops and waits until you get his blue fired off, and then you're just behind the 8 ball over and over again.

    This isn't better, and weakening him was completely unnecessary.

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    Can't disagree with any of the above, a bizarre change that seems to make him considerably worse

  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
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    I'm literally so irritated with this change to Beast. I might post blast to CHANGE BEAST BACK!

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

  • Omegased
    Omegased Posts: 582 Critical Contributor
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    @mdreyer93 said:
    @Omegased his blue passive was adding 6500 match dmg to each color when invisible, so a match 3 would do about 21000 dmg. Now it only adds about 2100 to each and he does about 9000 dmg on a match 3. I say ask CS for a refund, this stinks. Total bait & switch. Punisher & I surely aren't the only ones upset.

    I can't see a change to the post, was it just a mistake it was doing that much damage?

  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
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    I want to know who they play tested this change for Beast with? What teams did they think were effective? Did they ever use this Beast against the old version of himself? Did they run the same matches with his old version and his new one?

    STOP BREAKING THE GAME I HAVE PLAYED FOR YEARS AND CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    Could you all seriously just consider getting a QA team to properly test your ideas before they go live??? I know some developers that might take the gig, but they wouldn't be happy to be joining a sinking ship. In the meantime:

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

    CHANGE BEAST BACK!!

  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
    edited April 2023
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    Okay, so instead of throwing the protest style fit I want to keep doing, how about a real suggestion to not hamper him, but give him more flexibility:

    Change his Blue Ability to create Blue, Green, OR Black Attack tiles, prioritizing which ever color has the least SAP's, rounded down. Then, change his Black Passive to create Blue OR Black protect tiles, whichever color has fewer SAP's.

    This rounds out his color creation, balances what colors his makes the next round of SAP's in, and ultimately means he makes tiles in all of his own colors actively to fuel his powers, without pigeon holing him into making overlaping colored SAP's.

    More flexibility, not less. PLEASE SERIOUSLY CONSIDER CHANGING WHAT YOU'VE DONE TO BEAST!!!!

    Or, and hear me out on this: Just change him back.

  • marvel075
    marvel075 Posts: 124 Tile Toppler
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    aye, even with the slight nerf (i honestly dont see it as a nerf, his heal and output damage stayed the same, he got more max health, his base match damage was bumped, he still tanks all colors, all just from losing 4k something in bonus match damage), i've been running through these chasm teams with chasm, kang, and yellowjacket.

  • dianetics
    dianetics Posts: 1,482 Chairperson of the Boards
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    It is an unintentional nerf.
    I don't think the dev's really used him or played much with him. So my guess is they looked at it and tried to analytically turn him into a self feeding machine, but kneecapped him instead.
    If they did use him regularly then they would have known he was already very good and didn't need a rework.
    Getting rid of the blue charged tiles really screwed up his kit. When using him in certain groups those charged tiles really sped up the match and created a snowball effect.

  • mdreyer93
    mdreyer93 Posts: 144 Tile Toppler
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    @entrailbucket said:
    It says in the description that it's like 1700 at 5 covers. Did they have it set wrong on the initial change and then fix it the next day?

    The description in game changed. Like the description in this post, on the first day it said:
    "While invisible, Yellowjacket's powers ignore Protect tiles and his matches and powers deal 6580 more damage."
    Now, it reads:
    "While invisible, Yellowjacket's powers ignore Protect tiles and deal 6580 more damage, and his base match damage is increased by 2191."

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,104 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @dianetics said:
    It is an unintentional nerf.
    I don't think the dev's really used him or played much with him. So my guess is they looked at it and tried to analytically turn him into a self feeding machine, but kneecapped him instead.
    If they did use him regularly then they would have known he was already very good and didn't need a rework.
    Getting rid of the blue charged tiles really screwed up his kit. When using him in certain groups those charged tiles really sped up the match and created a snowball effect.

    This.

    People hate this idea -- for whatever reason, some players want to imagine the developers as all-seeing, all-knowing overlords who are playing 8 dimensional chess with character design.

    The reality is much simpler -- they don't play the game like we do, as much as we do, they don't understand the deeper synergies and combo potential in the game, and most importantly, characters are only good or bad by accident. The longer you're around, and the more closely you observe the stuff they do, the more obvious it becomes.

  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
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    I posted "Revert Dark Beast" in the Suggestions and Feedback forum, I suggest we carry our protest on there, as its targeted towards the dev's.

  • SuperCarrot
    SuperCarrot Posts: 178 Tile Toppler
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    I will complain on any thread needed about them messing up AOA Beast.

  • LavaManLee
    LavaManLee Posts: 1,322 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2023
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    Here's what I don't understand: there are so, so, so many worse 4s that need help. Why Dark Beast? How about Talos? Or Puck? Why did the team look at all the 4s and think "You know who we should spend time changing? Dark Beast!"

  • BoyWonder1914
    BoyWonder1914 Posts: 884 Critical Contributor
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    @LavaManLee said:
    Here's what I don't understand: there are so, so, so many worse 4s that need help. Why Dark Beast? How about Talos? Or Puck? Why did the team look at all the 4s and think "You know who we should spend time changing? Dark Beast!"

    @IceIX do we have any kind of insight into who, and when characters are chosen for updates? I don't believe it would hurt the game in any of kind of way to have these updates prioritize characters that the fanbase has voted (in whatever format) need the most attention.

  • Wolvie171
    Wolvie171 Posts: 170 Tile Toppler
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    This is reminiscent of the stealth nerf for 5* Captain Marvel due to her popularity and usage as a catalyst for winfinite matches.

    Did Dark Beast receive the same treatment and this wasn't so much a rebalance due to his own powers as much as his ability to synergize with other characters? For example, acting as a blue battery for Kang :*

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,104 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I can't imagine them going after Beast as a blue battery when we have like 100 other blue batteries that are way faster and more efficient than he ever was.

    Again, this is not 8 dimensional chess being executed according to some sort of nefarious secret plan. Sometimes it's nice to think that, but there is very little evidence to support the theory.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I think the only guy who thought that the devs have plans inside plans inside plans and know everything has been banned.

  • pepitedechocolat
    pepitedechocolat Posts: 204 Tile Toppler
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    @Bowgentle said:
    I think the only guy who thought that the devs have plans inside plans inside plans and know everything has been banned.

    maybe devs dont have, but maybe the dark powers behind them have !