Not with a bang but with a whimper. A poll on burnout in MPQ.

DAZ0273

D3 should make rebalancing older characters one of their priorities.

Why? How would that drive new player engagement? It would just be giving Vets extra strings to their bows whilst the vast majority would get little to no benefit whatsoever.

Classic 5s are still too hard to cover.

Exactly, so why make rebalancing them a priority? Even with a special store only the top end players can afford the luxury of pursuing classic 5*.

Don't get me wrong - I like Rebalances as much as the next player but I think we have to be realistic in how often they will get done and who benefits from them.

tonypq

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

DAZ0273 said:

D3 should make rebalancing older characters one of their priorities.

Why? How would that drive new player engagement? It would just be giving Vets extra strings to their bows whilst the vast majority would get little to no benefit whatsoever.

Classic 5s are still too hard to cover.

Exactly, so why make rebalancing them a priority? Even with a special store only the top end players can afford the luxury of pursuing classic 5*.

Don't get me wrong - I like Rebalances as much as the next player but I think we have to be realistic in how often they will get done and who benefits from them.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion as is everyone else. I don't see how rebalancing would negatively impact new player engagement. If anything it would drive it some as they'd see the fruits of their labor aren't obsolete after a month, year, or even upon release as some of these 5s are.  Once they get to that tier of course.

I'm not sure what your definition of rebalance is, but I never meant to imply to bring every classic 5 or lousy new 5* to be tuned up to Apoc or Shang-Chi levels. Rather just enough of a rebalance to not be total garbage. That's really not much to ask for. And hardorce vets will always have extra strings in their bow. Tweaking Wasp, Banner or other bad 5s to not not be so putrid won't upset the balance of the universe for anyone. I think most of us appreciated the tweaks they made to a few of the characters in the past couple years, most recently 5 GR. Especially as many of the 5s could be very easily be made more well off simply by reducing power costs, tuning damage, health, rather reinvent the wheel for every character.


Based on your logic why make anything a priority ?

Just keep releasing 4*s until every character in Marvel is present or has at least 3 versions of themselves. While at the same time releasing a very small amount of good 5s a year, surrounded by others who are obsolete before they leave the LL store. Just keep rolling out the same events year in and out, with the few occasional additions they actually do make that don't add much of a lasting impact. That's not going to drive new or veteran player engagement.  

entrailbucket

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

They just ran about 12 unboosted events in a row and I saw 0 Ghost Riders.

His rebalance was nice, but utterly meaningless.

DAZ0273

tonypq said:

DAZ0273 said:

D3 should make rebalancing older characters one of their priorities.

Why? How would that drive new player engagement? It would just be giving Vets extra strings to their bows whilst the vast majority would get little to no benefit whatsoever.

Classic 5s are still too hard to cover.

Exactly, so why make rebalancing them a priority? Even with a special store only the top end players can afford the luxury of pursuing classic 5*.

Don't get me wrong - I like Rebalances as much as the next player but I think we have to be realistic in how often they will get done and who benefits from them.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion as is everyone else. I don't see how rebalancing would negatively impact new player engagement. If anything it would drive it some as they'd see the fruits of their labor aren't obsolete after a month, year, or even upon release as some of these 5s are.  Once they get to that tier of course.

I'm not sure what your definition of rebalance is, but I never meant to imply to bring every classic 5 or lousy new 5* to be tuned up to Apoc or Shang-Chi levels. Rather just enough of a rebalance to not be total garbage. That's really not much to ask for. And hardorce vets will always have extra strings in their bow. Tweaking Wasp, Banner or other bad 5s to not not be so putrid won't upset the balance of the universe for anyone. I think most of us appreciated the tweaks they made to a few of the characters in the past couple years, most recently 5 GR. Especially as many of the 5s could be very easily be made more well off simply by reducing power costs, tuning damage, health, rather reinvent the wheel for every character.


Based on your logic why make anything a priority ?

Just keep releasing 4*s until every character in Marvel is present or has at least 3 versions of themselves. While at the same time releasing a very small amount of good 5s a year, surrounded by others who are obsolete before they leave the LL store. Just keep rolling out the same events year in and out, with the few occasional additions they actually do make that don't add much of a lasting impact. That's not going to drive new or veteran player engagement.  

Rebalances offer nothing to a new player who has an ever diminishing return to obtain Classics. You yourself contradict your own point by saying how hard they are to obtain but insist that somehow improving them should be top of the list. Why would D3/Demi put effort as a PRIORITY into something that most players get no benefit/incentive to chase and just benefits long term vets who have already champed the character or have hoarded CP to chase? Are those players spending any more? In most case no because they no longer need to.

Why would the Devs ever make any meaningful rebalance to a Classic character? It makes much more sense to reserve that Dev time for new releases. Our "rebalances" for classic characters are going to be mostly limited to weekly boosts outside of the odd thematic one here and there.

Here is priority for Devs

Make new 5s
Make new 4s
Create new bundles to sell for real cash

That is the reality of it. You don't have to like it. I don't have to like it but there is no evidence that points elsewhere.

You said that you "put up with the game" because of a lack of alternatives. If I was a Dev that is gold dust to me because it tells me that your complaints are toothless - I have you as a player regardless because you (and I) have a combination of sunk cost fallacy and come too far syndrome.

Unless you spend a few hundred dollars per month on the game, sadly our complaints are just background noise. 

tonypq

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

entrailbucket said:

They just ran about 12 unboosted events in a row and I saw 0 Ghost Riders.

His rebalance was nice, but utterly meaningless.

Those running meta teams or going for high placement of course won't all a sudden be rolling 5 GR out. Rebalancing isn't going to turn every 5 into Apoc, Shang,, or BRB. I'll take any improvement over the current state some characters are in though. They certainly could have buffed GR a bit more though I agree. For some it's a why bother thing, for others some would like to see something done rather than nothing. I'd love to see someone like Banner who has a pretty cool concept tweaked enough that he's at least payable and enjoyable to use. In turn they of course would also be much better when their boosted turn comes around.

If they aren't going to make rebalancing a priority anytime soon, then at least up their game on designing some of these new 5s we've been getting. 

entrailbucket

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

Also, if they rebalanced a classic character and that character became good or useful in any way, the 550 meta hoarder/optimizers would throw a tantrum about it, and we know that the devs are terrified of them.

tonypq

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

entrailbucket said:

Also, if they rebalanced a classic character and that character became good or useful in any way, the 550 meta hoarder/optimizers would throw a tantrum about it, and we know that the devs are terrified of them.

I agree it would be silly to see Wasp suddenly rebalanced to the point whales and placement pushers would consider her for pick 2 SCL 10 PVP or tough PVE nodes. I don't think anyone in favor of rebalance is asking for that though. I've never seen a post here where anyone asked for Wasp, Banner, Starlord, or any other meh 5* to be made meta. 

Many would simply like some of the neglected or dead on arrival 5s to be bumped up to simply be more fun to use however. Some tweaks in damage, power cost, health, won't make every character suddenly meta. But it will make then more enjoyable to use across the board and when boosted. Regardless of what some of you feel on rebalance, if you're not for it cool. You don't need to get your thongs twisted because others would welcome it. If you're not for rebalance that's fine, suggest what you are in favor of. One person's opinion doesn't have to delete someone else's, this is just a discussion post after all. 

entrailbucket

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

I absolutely want the very worst characters to be as good as the very best characters.  The only people who don't want that are the hoarders.

That's called balance, and good games try to get to that state.  I don't care if they achieve it by making the bad characters better or the good characters worse.

HoundofShadow

I think weekly 5* boost is a pretty good way to "rebalance" older 5* temporarily. Logically, non-meta non-boosted 5* seldom get used in pvps. However, most of them are often chosen over meta 5*. Therefore, regular permanent rebalance of non-meta 5* is quite a waste of time and the ROI for the dev is pretty bad. Dr Ock, Archangel and Ghost Rider are real life examples of why rebalances are pretty much failures. However, a bi-annual rebalance to the bottom 5* is fine. Being able to sell costume along with the rebalanced 5* help to reduce the bad ROI.

Whether a character is good or bad depends on the skills of the players. If they are bad at looking for synergies and only know how to play BRB/Polaris or Okoye/iHulk, then no amount of rebalance will help them see the usefulness of non-meta character. This applies to majority of the characters and only a very small number of characters is really bad.

Sekilicious

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

Well, MPQ is a good game and doesn’t maintain balance so that is just plain wrong. Maintaining a small supply of great characters means that those can be targeted by new players while not worrying too much about the good or mediocre ones. If every character is suddenly equal they will only ever all be obtained by ever increasing size of whale. Unless you were lucky enough to have started 6-7 years ago that is. Besides, Hoarding is considered an optimal strategy, not a necessarily a preference. 

Kolence

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

Wouldn't reducing the gap between the very newest, hottest, power creepy 5's and the less meta oldies make the classic store more valuable? But then, even if it did, I have no clue if that's something that would be desirable for the devs by earning money better?

entrailbucket

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

There's no power creep and there hasn't been for years.  Okoye, Apocalypse, Beta Ray Bill -- they're all super old and still in the top tier.  Meanwhile we have brand new characters like Ultron, Sersi and Gamora.

The boosts do help but they're not nearly enough.  Boosts of +100 levels are just about enough for Tier 2 5* to match up with unboosted Tier 1 guys, depending.  Tier 3 5* are never useful, even with +100 levels.

DAZ0273

tonypq said:

entrailbucket said:

Also, if they rebalanced a classic character and that character became good or useful in any way, the 550 meta hoarder/optimizers would throw a tantrum about it, and we know that the devs are terrified of them.

Regardless of what some of you feel on rebalance, if you're not for it cool. You don't need to get your thongs twisted because others would welcome it. If you're not for rebalance that's fine, suggest what you are in favor of. One person's opinion doesn't have to delete someone else's, this is just a discussion post after all. 

😁😁😁 😂😂😂😂😂 Most of us wear our thongs superhero style on the outside, much easier to rebalance! 😉

Kolence

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

There's definitely power creep. 
On 5-star side, in match damage and health. 
On 4-star side, in powers, especially hard counter powers to some meta 4* and 5* abilities. 
At least that's how I look at it... 

entrailbucket

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

Kolence said:

There's definitely power creep. 
On 5-star side, in match damage and health. 
On 4-star side, in powers, especially hard counter powers to some meta 4* and 5* abilities. 
At least that's how I look at it... 

Match damage and health matter, but not *that* much. 

For example, Knull has super high health and match damage, and he's still pretty bad.

If you look at the Tier 1 5*, most of them are pretty old.  If there was power creep, the top tier would be skewed toward more recent releases.

Kolence

I am getting tired. The game has become a slog. Still playing.

@entrailbucket

I agree, and it is skewed toward more recent releases.  

Part of it perhaps is the accelerated release of 5's compared to the earlier times but still. 

And it's not just match damage. The top tier pvp 5's all have powers at a level not seen in others. 

But this is all getting a bit off topic for this thread? 

revskip

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

I've quit before when it stopped being fun and stayed away for a long time (years not months).  Came back a year ago and am still enjoying myself.   Will quit again if it stops being fun.   

Davidk777

There are a number of problems, but I deal with them.

Personal I would love to see more rebalance characters and I think it would be good for the game. Reason being this is a marvel game. People love the characters they grew up with, and making that character more playable will benefit the game. By spending resource and money so they can play the 1's they want and not the ones they have to. 
For me that's Wolverine, for others it maybe Ironman. 

All in all it would make the game funner, which might make the game more money.

Srheer0

I can see some problems, but still play regularly. I am happy with most things in the game.

Davidk777 said:

Personal I would love to see more rebalance characters and I think it would be good for the game. Reason being this is a marvel game. People love the characters they grew up with, and making that character more playable will benefit the game. By spending resource and money so they can play the 1's they want and not the ones they have to. 
For me that's Wolverine, for others it maybe Ironman. 

All in all it would make the game funner, which might make the game more money.

My idea, and I hope they end up doing this at some point is for the following;

Do a forum poll with the 10 least used 5stars (d3 have the statistics / analytics)

Fans vote on it over a week period. They then rebalance the 3 5stars that need it as per the poll. Ask fans for feedback etc if necessary on the changes they propose. Then put in an alternate LL cp store with those as the 3 "latest".  

As an example, I am a 3 year old account and don't have 5star ironman, either of the spidermans champed. Or Thanos lol. It might not make them money from the older playerbase who have everything champed, but the players who they keep targeting with the weekend deals (4star covers and some iso8 for ~£15) and the random LL deals might be interested in it. 

Havok, B5nner, Ironman and Captain America are some of the weakest 5stars and probably need improvements the most. 

SnowcaTT

I'm burning out. I've reduced my game time. Still playing.

entrailbucket said:

I absolutely want the very worst characters to be as good as the very best characters.  The only people who don't want that are the hoarders.

That's called balance, and good games try to get to that state.  I don't care if they achieve it by making the bad characters better or the good characters worse.

Well, as a hoarder I wouldn't be happy to see Wasp better than everyone else.

But then....neither would most players i encounter these days, since almost none of them have Wasp champed. Vets like you and I are getting farther and fewer in between.

To the complainers: I guess there would be a vault, spend hard and blow all your HP.

But to the OP point: I don't mind balance....and that hasn't been something we've seen done (essentially at all) for the last five years. Why start now?