Yelena / Apocalypse / Onslaught OR Apocalypse / Onslaught / Killmonger? (as first 5*s champs)

Hi guys :) i am asking in behalf of a friend of mine

he has no 5* champs, and since apoc is in the mix, he will open his hoard.

he has around 290 pulls. and he already has a cover and some shards for both yelena and apocalypse.


Should he pull for yelena, apoc and ons? or wait for apoc, ons and kill?

one advantage of kill is he can wait to see the next hero, if BY CHANCE the next hero is better than apoc hahaha (i dont think so)

considering he wont have any other 5*s, that would be his team.


if its yelena + apoc + ons, should he bonus for yelena? or for apoc?

thanks :)

Comments

  • jp1jp1 Posts: 699 Critical Contributor
    Personally I like Yelena. She isn’t everyone’s cup of tea, but she is great for goon nodes and with Peggy she does passive damage and AP denial pretty reliably. Considering that, I would pull for Yelena, Apoc, Onslaught.

    Definitely favorite Apoc, the extra levels on him are way more valuable. Even better if you have a good fourth option available, sharget then instead and maybe make it through with an additional champ.
  • Daredevil217Daredevil217 Posts: 2,834 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 19 July 2020, 20:17
    This one is tough. Meta being what it is, I probably wouldn’t transition with either trio. Apoc is too slow without an accelerator like Thor/BRB. But I would definitely want him max-covered for when I do transition. I feel like these three would be eaten alive by Hulkoye, BRBitty, teams and it wouldn’t be a fun experience. I do think Onslaught/Apoc could take out Bishop teams though, especially with a starting match-4. 

    As for Yelena vs. Killy, that one is tough. Killmonger is better for a newer player because his damage output is so much higher than Yelena’s. He can nuke on both red and purple, and add crits to the board. Whereas Yelena does the small chip damage and AP manipulation. In a vacuum or if I could only have one, I’d take Killmonger. 

    However, Yelena is pretty much an ideal pair with Apocalypse. She has the single most useful skill between her and Killmonger (the red passive) and has no active overlap with Apoc. Adding Onslaught creates a perfect rainbow with only purple overlap b/w Yelena and Onslaught. Killmonger overlaps both purple and red.

    This is very similar to Havok vs. Carnage. Havok is the better damage stick, so a better solo character. While Carnage is more unique and is thus seen on more teams. Killmonger (like Havok) is one that is really good, but becomes less effective the wider your 5* roster gets, as there’s not enough to set him apart from other damage sticks. Yelena’s red will make sure she always has a use while Killmonger’s crit tile “niche” is more of a “cool if it works out” rather than something you can build upon. 
    If you want the character that will be the best for your roster as it develops and the one that pairs best with the other two characters, I’d go Yelena and not look back.
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    This one is tough. Meta being what it is, I probably wouldn’t transition with either trio. Apoc is too slow without an accelerator like Thor/BRB. But I would definitely want him max-covered for when I do transition. I feel like these three would be eaten alive by Hulkoye, BRBitty, teams and it wouldn’t be a fun experience. I do think Onslaught/Apoc could take out Bishop teams though, especially with a starting match-4. 

    As for Yelena vs. Killy, that one is tough. Killmonger is better for a newer player because his damage output is so much higher than Yelena’s. He can nuke on both red and purple, and add crits to the board. Whereas Yelena does the small chip damage and AP manipulation. In a vacuum or if I could only have one, I’d take Killmonger. 

    However, Yelena is pretty much an ideal pair with Apocalypse. She has the single most useful skill between her and Killmonger (the red passive) and has no active overlap with Apoc. Adding Onslaught creates a perfect rainbow with only purple overlap b/w Yelena and Onslaught. Killmonger overlaps both purple and red.

    This is very similar to Havok vs. Carnage. Havok is the better damage stick, so a better solo character. While Carnage is more unique and is thus seen on more teams. Killmonger (like Havok) is one that is really good, but becomes less effective the wider your 5* roster gets, as there’s not enough to set him apart from other damage sticks. Yelena’s red will make sure she always has a use while Killmonger’s crit tile “niche” is more of a “cool if it works out” rather than something you can build upon. 
    If you want the character that will be the best for your roster as it develops and the one that pairs best with the other two characters, I’d go Yelena and not look back.
    ty for ur help. as i said, is a friend of mine. we both are free players tho :( so not so much options like max 5*s etc. in his case, its either opening now for apoc, or wait till another one comes thats better than apoc. and i think thats not easy, to get a better than apoc nearby :( 

    his scl10 game is though with only 4*s :( so idk what to recomend him :(
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    edited 20 July 2020, 06:10
    This one is tough. Meta being what it is, I probably wouldn’t transition with either trio. Apoc is too slow without an accelerator like Thor/BRB. But I would definitely want him max-covered for when I do transition. I feel like these three would be eaten alive by Hulkoye, BRBitty, teams and it wouldn’t be a fun experience. I do think Onslaught/Apoc could take out Bishop teams though, especially with a starting match-4. 

    As for Yelena vs. Killy, that one is tough. Killmonger is better for a newer player because his damage output is so much higher than Yelena’s. He can nuke on both red and purple, and add crits to the board. Whereas Yelena does the small chip damage and AP manipulation. In a vacuum or if I could only have one, I’d take Killmonger. 

    However, Yelena is pretty much an ideal pair with Apocalypse. She has the single most useful skill between her and Killmonger (the red passive) and has no active overlap with Apoc. Adding Onslaught creates a perfect rainbow with only purple overlap b/w Yelena and Onslaught. Killmonger overlaps both purple and red.

    This is very similar to Havok vs. Carnage. Havok is the better damage stick, so a better solo character. While Carnage is more unique and is thus seen on more teams. Killmonger (like Havok) is one that is really good, but becomes less effective the wider your 5* roster gets, as there’s not enough to set him apart from other damage sticks. Yelena’s red will make sure she always has a use while Killmonger’s crit tile “niche” is more of a “cool if it works out” rather than something you can build upon. 
    If you want the character that will be the best for your roster as it develops and the one that pairs best with the other two characters, I’d go Yelena and not look back.
    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    also all other good 5* would also need thor - beta? 

    that means for new players it would be too hard to get to 5*, only by special store 300 cp pulls? :(

    thank you for the info :)

    edit: if he decides for yelena apoc ons, should he bonus yelena just in case? or go for apoc bonus in case he gets lucky and get like 5 or 6 covers on the other 2 heroes and 13 on apoc, so he just stops pulling and saves cp and lts,for a new future hero, while getting apoc? :)

  • BlackBoltRocksBlackBoltRocks Posts: 2,304 Chairperson of the Boards
    Akroma said:
    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    also all other good 5* would also need thor - beta? 

    that means for new players it would be too hard to get to 5*, only by special store 300 cp pulls? :(

    thank you for the info :)

    edit: if he decides for yelena apoc ons, should he bonus yelena just in case? or go for apoc bonus in case he gets lucky and get like 5 or 6 covers on the other 2 heroes and 13 on apoc, so he just stops pulling and saves cp and lts,for a new future hero, while getting apoc? :)

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :(
    He's good, but slow to get going by himself. Let's assume you have him at 3/5/5. His Black only does damage when there are friendly Protect tiles (which Bill instantly creates). In order for Poccy to create his own Protects, you either have to a) double-cast his Black or b) set up with his Yellow.

    For a), that requires 14 Black AP. And even then, you only get 3 hits (again, Poccy is at 3/5/5). And if you didn't use his Yellow prior, you won't get the bonus damage.

    For b), you need 7 Yellow. Then you need to hope at least 2 Repeaters survive the next two turns, so that Poccy can create at least 4 Protect tiles. And even then, you need 7 Black to take advantage of that.

    that means for new players it would be too hard to get to 5*, only by special store 300 cp pulls? :(
    It's almost always been like this. Save up ~300 pulls for Latests, or wait for a special store featuring a character you want to cover.

    if he decides for yelena apoc ons, should he bonus yelena just in case? or go for apoc bonus in case he gets lucky and get like 5 or 6 covers on the other 2 heroes and 13 on apoc, so he just stops pulling and saves cp and lts,for a new future hero, while getting apoc? :)
    See how he pulls as he goes along. E.g. If he gets a bunch of Poccy covers, then of course switch sharts to Yelena.

    Of course, he can always wait to see who the next 5* is. Assuming the next 5* is after Misty, that 5* will be announced on 28 July, and numbers will be revealed on 30 July. By then, Killmonger will have replaced Yelena though.
  • jp1jp1 Posts: 699 Critical Contributor
    Apoc is strong, there are 4 stars that can pair well with him due to his yellow. Yelena and Peggy will be helpful in SCL 10, Nico can sub in for Kitty at this level of play.

    Its a pretty big gamble hoping for something better soon. Of course the next 5 out could be meta, but they have had a pretty decent string of good/great characters lately so I wouldn’t hold my breath.

    Mixing with 4, I stand by the recommendation to pull now. Put as many levels on Apoc as possible. It’s a pretty versatile group with a lot of niche uses as well as being fairly strong. You could do much worse.
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    Akroma said:
    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    also all other good 5* would also need thor - beta? 

    that means for new players it would be too hard to get to 5*, only by special store 300 cp pulls? :(

    thank you for the info :)

    edit: if he decides for yelena apoc ons, should he bonus yelena just in case? or go for apoc bonus in case he gets lucky and get like 5 or 6 covers on the other 2 heroes and 13 on apoc, so he just stops pulling and saves cp and lts,for a new future hero, while getting apoc? :)

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :(
    He's good, but slow to get going by himself. Let's assume you have him at 3/5/5. His Black only does damage when there are friendly Protect tiles (which Bill instantly creates). In order for Poccy to create his own Protects, you either have to a) double-cast his Black or b) set up with his Yellow.

    For a), that requires 14 Black AP. And even then, you only get 3 hits (again, Poccy is at 3/5/5). And if you didn't use his Yellow prior, you won't get the bonus damage.

    For b), you need 7 Yellow. Then you need to hope at least 2 Repeaters survive the next two turns, so that Poccy can create at least 4 Protect tiles. And even then, you need 7 Black to take advantage of that.

    that means for new players it would be too hard to get to 5*, only by special store 300 cp pulls? :(
    It's almost always been like this. Save up ~300 pulls for Latests, or wait for a special store featuring a character you want to cover.

    if he decides for yelena apoc ons, should he bonus yelena just in case? or go for apoc bonus in case he gets lucky and get like 5 or 6 covers on the other 2 heroes and 13 on apoc, so he just stops pulling and saves cp and lts,for a new future hero, while getting apoc? :)
    See how he pulls as he goes along. E.g. If he gets a bunch of Poccy covers, then of course switch sharts to Yelena.

    Of course, he can always wait to see who the next 5* is. Assuming the next 5* is after Misty, that 5* will be announced on 28 July, and numbers will be revealed on 30 July. By then, Killmonger will have replaced Yelena though.
    thank you very much for the info. i guess he can get ap boost for yellow-red that way he is only 2 matches away for yellow :D

    he has almost 300 pulls, also i think that number is different now because of shards. but he has 300 pulls with latest, 300 pulls by cp for special stores is really hard :(

    is you recomendation  yelena instead of killmonger too? :)

    thanks again
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    jp1 said:
    Apoc is strong, there are 4 stars that can pair well with him due to his yellow. Yelena and Peggy will be helpful in SCL 10, Nico can sub in for Kitty at this level of play.

    Its a pretty big gamble hoping for something better soon. Of course the next 5 out could be meta, but they have had a pretty decent string of good/great characters lately so I wouldn’t hold my breath.

    Mixing with 4, I stand by the recommendation to pull now. Put as many levels on Apoc as possible. It’s a pretty versatile group with a lot of niche uses as well as being fairly strong. You could do much worse.
    tyvm for the info :D ill tell him that :D the yelena case is getting stronger.

    for me sadly, ill have enough covers after yelena rotates, so ill be stuck with apoc - ons - kill. but i have other 5* tho, he has no 5*
  • Daredevil217Daredevil217 Posts: 2,834 Chairperson of the Boards
    Akroma said:

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    I wouldn’t say that at all.  My statement was more about the 5* game in general and how now is not the best time to transition in an un-fun meta full of slow slogs and healthpack killers as opponents. At some point, those will be the only teams he can drum up, and your friend will be getting hit by them often because he is not running them himself.

    Apocalypse is actually one of the better (maybe the best?) standalone 5. So he’s for sure good alone. The problem is the game requires teams of 3. So while Poc is great on his own, and plays very well with many others, I think he’s not the best matchup for the current meta teams (sans Bishop).  At least not without proper partners. So I just assume 4* PVP is probably more fun than 5*. If he’s looking to improve in PVE, absolutely take the leap!

    I’m even stronger in the Yelena camp after today. I wrecked both the final/hard nodes yesterday and today with her in the third slot for Welcome to Shield. The opponents tend to have higher cost powers, so she can make sure they are mostly (or completely in the case of yesterday) hitting you with just match damage. Since the opposing team is always the same in Shield Training, having Yelena will pay dividends as beating those nodes = a Legendary pull. So that’s some pretty big value even on a roster as wide as mine (39 5* champs). 
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    Akroma said:

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    I wouldn’t say that at all.  My statement was more about the 5* game in general and how now is not the best time to transition in an un-fun meta full of slow slogs and healthpack killers as opponents. At some point, those will be the only teams he can drum up, and your friend will be getting hit by them often because he is not running them himself.

    Apocalypse is actually one of the better (maybe the best?) standalone 5. So he’s for sure good alone. The problem is the game requires teams of 3. So while Poc is great on his own, and plays very well with many others, I think he’s not the best matchup for the current meta teams (sans Bishop).  At least not without proper partners. So I just assume 4* PVP is probably more fun than 5*. If he’s looking to improve in PVE, absolutely take the leap!

    I’m even stronger in the Yelena camp after today. I wrecked both the final/hard nodes yesterday and today with her in the third slot for Welcome to Shield. The opponents tend to have higher cost powers, so she can make sure they are mostly (or completely in the case of yesterday) hitting you with just match damage. Since the opposing team is always the same in Shield Training, having Yelena will pay dividends as beating those nodes = a Legendary pull. So that’s some pretty big value even on a roster as wide as mine (39 5* champs). 
    tyvm for the info. i have only 1 more question :( i hope you can see this in time :(

    when will yelenea leave LL?

    thanks :D
  • Daredevil217Daredevil217 Posts: 2,834 Chairperson of the Boards
    Akroma said:
    Akroma said:

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    I wouldn’t say that at all.  My statement was more about the 5* game in general and how now is not the best time to transition in an un-fun meta full of slow slogs and healthpack killers as opponents. At some point, those will be the only teams he can drum up, and your friend will be getting hit by them often because he is not running them himself.

    Apocalypse is actually one of the better (maybe the best?) standalone 5. So he’s for sure good alone. The problem is the game requires teams of 3. So while Poc is great on his own, and plays very well with many others, I think he’s not the best matchup for the current meta teams (sans Bishop).  At least not without proper partners. So I just assume 4* PVP is probably more fun than 5*. If he’s looking to improve in PVE, absolutely take the leap!

    I’m even stronger in the Yelena camp after today. I wrecked both the final/hard nodes yesterday and today with her in the third slot for Welcome to Shield. The opponents tend to have higher cost powers, so she can make sure they are mostly (or completely in the case of yesterday) hitting you with just match damage. Since the opposing team is always the same in Shield Training, having Yelena will pay dividends as beating those nodes = a Legendary pull. So that’s some pretty big value even on a roster as wide as mine (39 5* champs). 
    tyvm for the info. i have only 1 more question :( i hope you can see this in time :(

    when will yelenea leave LL?

    thanks :D
    Most likely on Monday (27th). 
  • AkromaAkroma Posts: 63 Match Maker
    edited 22 July 2020, 02:40
    Akroma said:
    Akroma said:

    so basically apoc is no good by himself :( 

    I wouldn’t say that at all.  My statement was more about the 5* game in general and how now is not the best time to transition in an un-fun meta full of slow slogs and healthpack killers as opponents. At some point, those will be the only teams he can drum up, and your friend will be getting hit by them often because he is not running them himself.

    Apocalypse is actually one of the better (maybe the best?) standalone 5. So he’s for sure good alone. The problem is the game requires teams of 3. So while Poc is great on his own, and plays very well with many others, I think he’s not the best matchup for the current meta teams (sans Bishop).  At least not without proper partners. So I just assume 4* PVP is probably more fun than 5*. If he’s looking to improve in PVE, absolutely take the leap!

    I’m even stronger in the Yelena camp after today. I wrecked both the final/hard nodes yesterday and today with her in the third slot for Welcome to Shield. The opponents tend to have higher cost powers, so she can make sure they are mostly (or completely in the case of yesterday) hitting you with just match damage. Since the opposing team is always the same in Shield Training, having Yelena will pay dividends as beating those nodes = a Legendary pull. So that’s some pretty big value even on a roster as wide as mine (39 5* champs). 
    tyvm for the info. i have only 1 more question :( i hope you can see this in time :(

    when will yelenea leave LL?

    thanks :D
    Most likely on Monday (27th). 
    ty :)


    i opened :( got yelena 14 covers, 12 covers on ons (still some shards events for him i think) but only 5 covers on apoc :(:( i have 2 bonus levels shardswise, so 8 covers on him, and i have 44 pulls left :( ill wait till yelena rotates :( to try to get apoc :(
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