Are competition brackets ever going to balance?

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Comments

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    Soft capping dupes (or primaries) would probably institute another HP throttle to the game, presumably driving some level of spend out of the player base. 

    But using SCL-based lockouts to keep players with big rosters out of lower-tier competition pools punishes the player. What you really want to do is lock out overpowered characters, not players that have them. Locking out characters by * tier also means that 4* players with partially covered 5*s they like wouldn't be able to use those at any level, but if they were say limited to 370 (max champ 4* sized), you could still comfortably run them partially built.  You'd probably still see the same dominant characters, just at a lower level where they could presumably be competed with more effectively. For instance a highly champed Jugger-Gardian team is almost certainly comparable in speed to an under-leveled Thano5 or ThorKoye team, so a true 4* player should have as much of a shot as somebody with a softcapped roster would do.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Let's not forget about Supports. They do help a lot and they are game-changing, if you are lucky to get them. Again, those who got it are lucky, whales or super competitive players.

    I remember getting booted out of no 1 spot in SCL 6 by a 3* player who got a Rank 3 or 4 Support that increased his 3* character's match damage by at least 300 to 400.
  • shinnaruto
    shinnaruto Posts: 60 Match Maker
    that is why i find it so strange when i read players comments about not leveling up supports at all.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    I do kind of wish that supports had worked out; they are great when you have them. I've gotten a couple new ones from the random standard tokens in some of the vaults in the last month or two, mostly 1*, but one or two were upgrades to existing ones I had. most of the supports I have are 2*s, nothing better than 4*.
  • shinnaruto
    shinnaruto Posts: 60 Match Maker
    i like them. i am mainly a pve player so they help with the speed of my clears

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    Ironically they were slowing mine down for the longest time - i Used to run 5* Lord with 3* elemental guns on him with 4ocket/Thano5 on easy nodes, and what would happen is that the eGuns would fortify a strike, interrupting a cascade, which would trigger court death early rather than potentially wiping the whole enemy team before I had to eat any of the damage. I just thought court death was randomly doing it, didn't realize it was the fortify causing the problem for awhile.
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,821 Chairperson of the Boards
    ThaRoadWarrior said:
    Ironically they were slowing mine down for the longest time - i Used to run 5* Lord with 3* elemental guns on him with 4ocket/Thano5 on easy nodes, and what would happen is that the eGuns would fortify a strike, interrupting a cascade, which would trigger court death early rather than potentially wiping the whole enemy team before I had to eat any of the damage. I just thought court death was randomly doing it, didn't realize it was the fortify causing the problem for awhile.
    You do have to be careful with the Supports you use.  Some of them are much more helpful for newer people who are trying to clear nodes and less worried about speed.  And then there are the ranks etc. which make a Support change from helpful to not sometimes as you add effects.

    There are a lot of factors that have worked against broad acceptance of Supports.  They are definitely pretty confusing for a lot of players, but people should look more closely at them if they haven't yet.

    I suppose it's strange that they don't make more, but it would just complicate the issue, probably, if the options expanded significantly again.
  • shinnaruto
    shinnaruto Posts: 60 Match Maker
    More options + still almost zero way to get them. (then you almost always get a dupe)
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    I think it was a real bummer how many characters were coming out feeling like they should have been built-in with the support synergy perks in those days, but also I don't really blame the devs for falling into that trap as a way to try and make supports compelling - otherwise there are only so many "add N damage to matches on this color" or whatever perks you can do.
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    shinnaruto said:
    More options + still almost zero way to get them. (then you almost always get a dupe)
    Disney Emoji Blitz' character aquisition model is not dissimilar from Supports in this game, and they sell a consumable item that forces the emoji loot box to issue you one you don't have if you enable it before you pull. There are opportunities here if anyone were inclined to think outside the (loot) box. You could do the same thing here, sell/issue pull modifiers that go either way pulling for covers. Either prioritize characters you don't have, or prioritize characters marked as a favorite from the organic pull rates rather than only leaning on bonus heroes (rip) or shards.
  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,238 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    As a 4* player I am consistently t10 (shout out to my bracket mate @skittledaddy )..

    Are you a T10 entering the initial bracket when the event first opens (the only true competitive bracket) or are you a bracket sniper who is timing flips?

    There is a vast difference since timing flips gives enormous advantage that can never be made up no matter how fast later players clear. I know at least a couple players on this thread do this in CL7, slice 5 because I'm in their same bracket every time and the only reason they finish ahead of me is because the snipe in immediately on the flip (because I can beat them at least half the time or better on the 2nd and beyond days in clear times) thanks to dedicated alliances and LINE. This is another problem that needs to be solved.

    KGB
  • jamesh
    jamesh Posts: 1,600 Chairperson of the Boards
    ThaRoadWarrior said:
    I think it was a real bummer how many characters were coming out feeling like they should have been built-in with the support synergy perks in those days, but also I don't really blame the devs for falling into that trap as a way to try and make supports compelling - otherwise there are only so many "add N damage to matches on this color" or whatever perks you can do.
    And it wouldn't have been so bad that they were doing this except for two things: (1) they never got around to enabling supports in PVP, and (2) they never fixed the supports availability problem.
  • Twomp_thaDJ
    Twomp_thaDJ Posts: 237 Tile Toppler
    KGB said:
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    As a 4* player I am consistently t10 (shout out to my bracket mate @skittledaddy )..

    Are you a T10 entering the initial bracket when the event first opens (the only true competitive bracket) or are you a bracket sniper who is timing flips?

    There is a vast difference since timing flips gives enormous advantage that can never be made up no matter how fast later players clear. I know at least a couple players on this thread do this in CL7, slice 5 because I'm in their same bracket every time and the only reason they finish ahead of me is because the snipe in immediately on the flip (because I can beat them at least half the time or better on the 2nd and beyond days in clear times) thanks to dedicated alliances and LINE. This is another problem that needs to be solved.

    KGB
    I am both.. I have waited for a flip but I also go as soon as the event opens just depends on what my week looks like.. and even with a flip you’d be foolish to think that speed doesn’t come into play or that some how the because a bracket has flipped that it’s not as competitive. I also don’t get what you’re saying about it being an advantage if you are waiting for a flip as well? How are they sniping if you are starting at the same time as them, and if you are waiting then by definition your time would be slower. Either way starting a few minutes later points could be made up on the back end during your grind. But that’s neither here nor there. My point in my original post was regardless of when I start there are rosters bigger than mine who finish with lower placement then me.
  • SnowcaTT
    SnowcaTT Posts: 3,486 Chairperson of the Boards
    Competition bracket balance is "coming soon".
  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,238 Chairperson of the Boards
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    KGB said:
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    As a 4* player I am consistently t10 (shout out to my bracket mate @skittledaddy )..

    Are you a T10 entering the initial bracket when the event first opens (the only true competitive bracket) or are you a bracket sniper who is timing flips?

    There is a vast difference since timing flips gives enormous advantage that can never be made up no matter how fast later players clear. I know at least a couple players on this thread do this in CL7, slice 5 because I'm in their same bracket every time and the only reason they finish ahead of me is because the snipe in immediately on the flip (because I can beat them at least half the time or better on the 2nd and beyond days in clear times) thanks to dedicated alliances and LINE. This is another problem that needs to be solved.

    KGB
    I am both.. I have waited for a flip but I also go as soon as the event opens just depends on what my week looks like.. and even with a flip you’d be foolish to think that speed doesn’t come into play or that some how the because a bracket has flipped that it’s not as competitive. I also don’t get what you’re saying about it being an advantage if you are waiting for a flip as well? How are they sniping if you are starting at the same time as them, and if you are waiting then by definition your time would be slower. Either way starting a few minutes later points could be made up on the back end during your grind. But that’s neither here nor there. My point in my original post was regardless of when I start there are rosters bigger than mine who finish with lower placement then me.
    I'm not waiting for flips because I'm not on Line / T100 alliance and even if I was, I'm at work when it happens. I get home at around 6 PM EST and enter my PvE slices. The bracket flip for my slice consistently happens around 4-5 PM.

    It's impossible to make up that 1-2 hr head start in point regeneration on day 1. That's because even if I beat those players by 10 minutes on all subsequent days, I can only make up 20-30 minutes of regeneration time (and I usually only beat them by less than 5 minutes).

    Time of entry to your bracket on day 1 decides your highest possible finish. If you miss the start of a flip by more than 10 minutes you have zero chance at T5 and more than 20 minutes you have zero chance at T10. It has nothing to do with roster strength or subsequent days.

    KGB
  • Twomp_thaDJ
    Twomp_thaDJ Posts: 237 Tile Toppler
    edited January 2020
    KGB said:
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    KGB said:
    Twomp_thaDJ said:
    As a 4* player I am consistently t10 (shout out to my bracket mate @skittledaddy )..

    Are you a T10 entering the initial bracket when the event first opens (the only true competitive bracket) or are you a bracket sniper who is timing flips?

    There is a vast difference since timing flips gives enormous advantage that can never be made up no matter how fast later players clear. I know at least a couple players on this thread do this in CL7, slice 5 because I'm in their same bracket every time and the only reason they finish ahead of me is because the snipe in immediately on the flip (because I can beat them at least half the time or better on the 2nd and beyond days in clear times) thanks to dedicated alliances and LINE. This is another problem that needs to be solved.

    KGB
    I am both.. I have waited for a flip but I also go as soon as the event opens just depends on what my week looks like.. and even with a flip you’d be foolish to think that speed doesn’t come into play or that some how the because a bracket has flipped that it’s not as competitive. I also don’t get what you’re saying about it being an advantage if you are waiting for a flip as well? How are they sniping if you are starting at the same time as them, and if you are waiting then by definition your time would be slower. Either way starting a few minutes later points could be made up on the back end during your grind. But that’s neither here nor there. My point in my original post was regardless of when I start there are rosters bigger than mine who finish with lower placement then me.
    I'm not waiting for flips because I'm not on Line / T100 alliance and even if I was, I'm at work when it happens. I get home at around 6 PM EST and enter my PvE slices. The bracket flip for my slice consistently happens around 4-5 PM.

    It's impossible to make up that 1-2 hr head start in point regeneration on day 1. That's because even if I beat those players by 10 minutes on all subsequent days, I can only make up 20-30 minutes of regeneration time (and I usually only beat them by less than 5 minutes).

    Time of entry to your bracket on day 1 decides your highest possible finish. If you miss the start of a flip by more than 10 minutes you have zero chance at T5 and more than 20 minutes you have zero chance at T10. It has nothing to do with roster strength or subsequent days.

    KGB
    Thanx.. I’m well aware of how it works to get placement, I guess my question to you is what was the point if your original post to me?? From what you just wrote, you would rarely, if ever place in the top 10, because you don’t join when the event starts or right after a flip.. so you could have all 5* champed or none and it wouldn’t make a difference.

    My original point was that I can consistently place t10 (flip or other) ahead of people that have bigger rosters, and that was in reply to the OP stating that locking out people from different SCL isn’t necessary.. with a side point being that PvE shouldn’t have a player competitive component at all. 
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    As long you as you can clear PvE SCL 7 within ~25 minutes, you are guaranteed a top 10 spot. I'm talking about playing in the first bracket here, and not playing the bracket starting at the first flip or whatever subsequent flip.

    Getting top 10 is not that difficult as long as you have the meta 3* and 4* team.  There are 5* players who deliberately overclear and those who take their time to clear. So, you are actually competing against a mix of high 4* and 5* players.

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