5* cap marvel - Powers discussion

jredd
jredd Posts: 1,387 Chairperson of the Boards
edited May 2019 in MPQ General Discussion
at this point i realize this is probably going nowhere (except the suggestions forum) but can you maybe step out of your comfort zone and fix cap marvel before she leaves latests?! she's slow (really, does nothing) and she's boring. in 11 tries on the 5* node so far you know how may times i've used one of her abilities?   1 time. yes. 1!  

here's an easy start. lower the cost of her abilities and get rid of the repeaters. that's it. how hard could that be???

Mod Edit: Changed title to reflect content.

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Comments

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,456 Chairperson of the Boards
    I have to say, Danver5 is incredibly weak on defense. When she was on that god-mode boost I was able to take a lvl 550 out with my 452 Ghost Rider (who is similarly not super fast).
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 10,283 Chairperson of the Boards
    I don't totally hate Event Horizon but it does kind'a take an extremely long time to do anything.
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2019
    The repeaters are not that bad though are they? One is just there to accelerate her green, it's a free match of green every 3 turns. Otherwise her green is a 10 cost power with decent utility.

    Her red can help gritty vs sabretooths boardshake as well. Anytime he takes out a strike with his boardshake you get 2 yellow.

    She may not be tiptop tier but I feel she gets a bit too much disdain.
  • marshall
    marshall Posts: 179 Tile Toppler
    Ina world without Gritty or Thorkoye she might have been ok.
  • pheregas
    pheregas Posts: 1,721 Chairperson of the Boards
    I don't think she's bad per say.  When boosted, her match damage is pretty wicked (as compared to older 5s at least.)  Her green scales pretty well as well.

    The real problem is that any 5 that comes with countdown tiles that doesn't fortify them is not useful in the current state of the game that seems to highly utilize board shake.  
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
    pheregas said:
    I don't think she's bad per say.  When boosted, her match damage is pretty wicked (as compared to older 5s at least.)  Her green scales pretty well as well.

    The real problem is that any 5 that comes with countdown tiles that doesn't fortify them is not useful in the current state of the game that seems to highly utilize board shake.  
    Put her green at 5 and she has no countdowns. Her red repeater though could use a fortify. I hate saving up for a power, putting a repeater out and it getting matched before it resolves.
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,822 Chairperson of the Boards
    The more characters that are added to the game, the harder it is to make new ones stand out.

    Embracing power creep would work but the game design has already reached an upper bound there, based on the characters we have gotten over the past year or so.

    I don't think CM is good because every power you use requires you to wait for something to happen (except sending someone airborne immediately, I suppose).  It's not a fun design.

    I also think it's folly to hope that the devs will rapidly rework anyone at this point in the game, where reworks are extremely rare and no one recent seems to be touched at all.

    Maybe in a couple years they'll rework 5CM for her sequel.
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
    bluewolf said:
    The more characters that are added to the game, the harder it is to make new ones stand out.

    Embracing power creep would work but the game design has already reached an upper bound there, based on the characters we have gotten over the past year or so.

    I don't think CM is good because every power you use requires you to wait for something to happen (except sending someone airborne immediately, I suppose).  It's not a fun design.

    I also think it's folly to hope that the devs will rapidly rework anyone at this point in the game, where reworks are extremely rare and no one recent seems to be touched at all.

    Maybe in a couple years they'll rework 5CM for her sequel.
    Again her green at 5 covers is an immediate effect you spend 10 green you get instant effects. No countdown, no waiting.
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,822 Chairperson of the Boards
    I forget her Green does something, but it is "good" to destroy your own specials.....which always feels wrong to me.

    And the base dmg is not nearly good enough.  My Thor does almost as much dmg, with a few more covers, to the entire team as she does to one person.
  • Waddles_Pines
    Waddles_Pines Posts: 1,229 Chairperson of the Boards
    Green should either count all special tiles as a condition on extra board destruction, not destroy your tiles (a la 5lord), or you get AP from the specials destroyed...

    That and the red really needs to start off fortified...
  • Malcrof
    Malcrof Posts: 5,971 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2019
    Her green is what we have been asking for now for 5 years, a goon ability, it generates it's own AP to fire itself or just for the team, green is fine, not too AP expensive, and i have seen it take down multiple opponents in 1 shot.  Her yellow is like 5Caps, situationally very useful, but most useful as a team up (take someone out of play so they can't get damaged while you gather ap, it then heals them and has a nuke).  The red is where i think it needs help.  Do not make it a power change / Binary skill, please don't, Binary should be it's own thing when 6* comes out, but it needs to be something. Red is the skill we associate with single target damage, and she can shoot nyan cat out of her hands, so make that a plain old nuke with a little extra, a la Okoye. 
  • Gold_Dragon
    Gold_Dragon Posts: 101 Tile Toppler
    I’m really struggling with making her work on a team. Everything takes forever to activate. 

    2 turns for the red repeater
    3 turns to get 3 green and then 2 more turns for the row destroyer (which destroys your own special tiles btw)
    2 turns for the yellow to heal and damage

    None of the cds/repeaters are fortified so they get matched/destroyed more times than not. All her strikes are on red tiles, which are probably the most sought after color in the game. I’m forced to team her with Green Goblin just for the forts and I actually find myself using his yellow to make the CDs expire faster. Then I put her with coulson for further CD manipulation. 

    But shes still achingly slow. 

    And her green destroys your own special tiles with her most powerful attack. And for it to do more damage, you have to destroy MORE of your own tiles. And have I mentioned that no matter how many covers you have, the damage stays the same? Yeah. Isn’t that great? 

    And her red passive gives you yellow AP..... but her yellow takes 2 turns after activation for the heals/damage. 

    Its like..... you want her to be with a character that creates specials.... just to destroy them? so you want to put her with someone like Carnage or medusa or maybe grocket. But there absolutely no synergy with them because honestly..... when do you even want to destroy your own stuff?

    i think she’s Wasp (Hope) bad. You have to base your entire team around her and the juice isn’t worth the squeeze. im in favor of completely overhauling her. 
  • AndiTi
    AndiTi Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    edited May 2019
    Fortifying red would be good, but better would be to have it fire immediately and then have a countdown. Then you get one guaranteed result from firing the power. If you did this, it would be a reasonable nuke with the added bonus of having it possibly go off multiple times.

    Having used her I agree--green is fine. If it appears on a green match I always match it away and bank 3 green immediately (which also protects it from the enemy matching it). But if there aren't green matches it gives a way to get green anyway. It's players call whether to have it at 5 covers and fire immediately or not with cover investment. I think that's fine.

    I personally think there ought to be some sort of bonus for using Got your Six on Marvel herself, because losing the countdown on the repeaters makes that power hard to use as a self target. Maybe she heals the whole team, or does double damage. It could also be a passive: If Marvel is stunned or flying, her repeater effects continue to process (like JJs trap tiles still go off if she is stunned).
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    While I appreciate that her design matches her MCU treatment (everything takes WAY too long to get going, even if the final product when she ultimately does show up is fine), she is just not viable.  Nor is rescue.

    5*s are SO hard to cover, even nowadays, that the negative impact to the game of one or more truly awful 5*s sitting in latest tokens is much higher than for any other tier of play. 

    It's just not acceptable for Demi to keeping on pushing out these tinykitty 5*s and letting them flounder for months/years before even attempting reworks. 

    If we felt that sub-standard 5*s would be patched in timely manner, then we would all be so inclined to hoard.

    I would love to pull LTs right now to try and get GED covers (I have had absolutely awful luck for him and still only have 1 yellow cover).  But I simply can't afford to risk getting more useless Carol covers. And I won't ever pull Carol/rescue/hela tokens because as much as I like and want hela, I really can't afford to waste resources on LTs that are 2/3 useless junk (unless the next 5* is even worse).


  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
    Gold_Dragon said:
    I’m really struggling with making her work on a team. Everything takes forever to activate. 

    2 turns for the red repeater
    3 turns to get 3 green and then 2 more turns for the row destroyer (which destroys your own special tiles btw)
    2 turns for the yellow to heal and damage

    None of the cds/repeaters are fortified so they get matched/destroyed more times than not. All her strikes are on red tiles, which are probably the most sought after color in the game. I’m forced to team her with Green Goblin just for the forts and I actually find myself using his yellow to make the CDs expire faster. Then I put her with coulson for further CD manipulation. 

    But shes still achingly slow. 

    And her green destroys your own special tiles with her most powerful attack. And for it to do more damage, you have to destroy MORE of your own tiles. And have I mentioned that no matter how many covers you have, the damage stays the same? Yeah. Isn’t that great? 

    And her red passive gives you yellow AP..... but her yellow takes 2 turns after activation for the heals/damage. 

    Its like..... you want her to be with a character that creates specials.... just to destroy them? so you want to put her with someone like Carnage or medusa or maybe grocket. But there absolutely no synergy with them because honestly..... when do you even want to destroy your own stuff?

    i think she’s Wasp (Hope) bad. You have to base your entire team around her and the juice isn’t worth the squeeze. im in favor of completely overhauling her. 
    Even if you base your team around wasp there is no juice to squeeze lol. Wasp is in her own tier.
  • Palookaville
    Palookaville Posts: 83 Match Maker
    Personally I think it would be better if repeaters did their damage as soon as they are placed, and then again after the countdown.

    You wait to get the right AP, then place the tile, then have to wait for it to count down and THEN you damage your opponent (assuming it was not matched) 

    You get the AP for an attack, you should get an attack, not the chance to get an attack in another two moves (or whatnot)
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2019
    Vhailorx said:
    While I appreciate that her design matches her MCU treatment (everything takes WAY too long to get going, even if the final product when she ultimately does show up is fine), she is just not viable.  Nor is rescue.

    5*s are SO hard to cover, even nowadays, that the negative impact to the game of one or more truly awful 5*s sitting in latest tokens is much higher than for any other tier of play. 

    It's just not acceptable for Demi to keeping on pushing out these tinykitty 5*s and letting them flounder for months/years before even attempting reworks. 

    If we felt that sub-standard 5*s would be patched in timely manner, then we would all be so inclined to hoard.

    I would love to pull LTs right now to try and get GED covers (I have had absolutely awful luck for him and still only have 1 yellow cover).  But I simply can't afford to risk getting more useless Carol covers. And I won't ever pull Carol/rescue/hela tokens because as much as I like and want hela, I really can't afford to waste resources on LTs that are 2/3 useless junk (unless the next 5* is even worse).


    My case is even worse, I decided to open my hoard (of 300 tokens), and get Doom instead of Rescue and the results were quite bad. First I got screwed by RNG as I barely pulled a 10% of 5s (this should not happen, but it keeps happening, why is luck a factor in all of this?!?!?!?). But then most everything I got was Carol. I managed to cover Hela (barely), but even though I already started with 3 Doom covers I merely got him to 10 covers. Awful, pretty 'depressing'. And even worse I have him 6/1/3, so he is almost useless :(

    I keep opening tokens in hope of at least one or two more blacks, but I just pull Carol over and over. Sometimes I hate this game. And when Doom moves to classic he will be gone forever :(


    And yeah, Carol is pretty bad, I have tried to use her in 5 teams but there is no other 5 she complements or works with. GG at least protects the repeater and dont overlap a lot in colors but that is basically it. And sure match damage is high when buffed, but what 5 doesn't have high match damage when buffed?

    I think all her powers need a bit of help, this is again one of those cases where powers try to do too many things at once but nothing great ( her yellow heals, but not too much, sends someone airbone and does damage, but also not too much either). 
  • wymtime
    wymtime Posts: 3,759 Chairperson of the Boards
    2 things number one reduce her green repeater to 2 and have to place on the board when the match starts like Gambit

    red reduce the repeater to 1 or fire the power and place strike tiles before placing the repeater tile.
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
    Palookaville said:
    Personally I think it would be better if repeaters did their damage as soon as they are placed, and then again after the countdown.

    You wait to get the right AP, then place the tile, then have to wait for it to count down and THEN you damage your opponent (assuming it was not matched) 

    You get the AP for an attack, you should get an attack, not the chance to get an attack in another two moves (or whatnot)
    If they did this I think they would either make the effects of all repeaters that had a cost weaker or increase the cost of all repeaters to offset the potential for continual gains off of it.

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