Doctor Octopus (Classic) - Character Update (12/12/18)

Brigby
Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
edited December 2018 in MPQ Character Discussion
Hi Everyone,

Here are the full details for Doctor Octopus (Classic)'s character update set to be implemented tomorrow, 12/13, after the daily patch update.

Character Stats

(Stats listed at level 450)
New Stats
51,627 Health
purpletilepng 83 | bluetilepng 633 | blacktilepng 712 |  358 |  90 | greentilepng 554 | yellowtilepng 76 |  4.3x

Old Stats
46,828 Health
purpletilepng 75 | bluetilepng 574 | blacktilepng 646 |  325 |  82 | greentilepng 502 | yellowtilepng 69 |  4.3x

blacktilepng Superior Science blacktilepng

<-- New Ability | Old Ability -->

bluetilepng Tentacles

<-- New Ability | Old Ability -->

greentilepng Cunning Scheme

<-- New Ability | Old Ability -->




«134

Comments

  • Basepuzzler
    Basepuzzler Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
    Looks great.  Now how do we get him?
  • TPF Alexis
    TPF Alexis Posts: 3,826 Chairperson of the Boards
    I liked the way Superior Science did the Stuns before, but the other two look significantly better now.
  • Punter1
    Punter1 Posts: 729 Critical Contributor
    Well still looks terrible and confusing.  Or am I missing something?  
    Everything still seems very expensive and damage hidden behind countdowns or dependant on getting tentacles out and keeping them out.  
  • TonyDank
    TonyDank Posts: 2 Just Dropped In
    The rework is live for me right now. Is it the same for everyone else?
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
    TonyDank said:
    The rework is live for me right now. Is it the same for everyone else?
    Just asking for due diligence, but are you looking at the values on the right or on the left? The values in the right-hand column are the old mechanics and the values on the left are the new mechanics being implemented tomorrow.
  • fmftint
    fmftint Posts: 3,653 Chairperson of the Boards
    Great,  how about a feeder?  
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
    *Added character stat comparison
  • TonyDank
    TonyDank Posts: 2 Just Dropped In
    Oops my mistake I misread the reworked abilities. I was looking at the abilities on the right.
  • babinro
    babinro Posts: 771 Critical Contributor
    I want to start out by saying that I'm very happy with these changes.  I love it when characters get buffed so any criticism I have to offer shouldn't discourage the fact that players want to see more of this.  Even if its just simple match damage updates that sort of thing could essentially 'fix' OML or Phx right now.
    The only real let down for Doc Ock here to me is the fact that his black doesn't damage upfront.  It presents a very high cost risk to the player for a skill that doesn't seem to push limits so much that it must have this drawback to balance it out.
  • Borstock
    Borstock Posts: 2,736 Chairperson of the Boards
    I mean...........better? 

    That nuclear reactor power still feels like a lot of work in a game with some straightforward options that'll get the job done. I do like the blue re-work. 
  • JHawkInc
    JHawkInc Posts: 2,605 Chairperson of the Boards
    I like it.

    I'll miss the versatility of the black's stun, the extra damage and better strikes are nice, but you've got to protect the countdown, and like, from 4 to 5 covers, I'd trade the increase in damage/strikes for even one extra turn of stun. 

    Blue's damage is just better all around, it won't stink the first time you use it, and you can create tentacles and buff it without spending AP, just a flat improvement. I'll miss the auto-matches by the tentacles, but it was hard to pull off even by design, and I'm sure I'll get way more out of the protection from stun, and I like how both have kept the theme of "the tentacles keep acting even when Doc Ock is impaired".

    The green is far less complicated, and loses the nuke and auto-damage AND the abysmal cost in exchange for repeating and penalizing the opponent for removing it. Ock will be good for keeping allies alive and being a nuisance, which kinda feels like a Doc Ock thing to do.

    He'll be fun to run with Goblin, since Gobbo can keep the countdown/repeater alive. And my Hydra Henchmen that I've equipped to Doc Ock might be more valuable since they can fortify that repeater. (side note: Goblin needs a support, I want a Goblin-only perk that throws an extra pumpkin bomb of a random color when he uses that power, make him a little more chaotic)

    Now we need another Sinister Six 5* character that has red and not black for color synergy, could be a fun team. As the only person in my alliance with a champed Ock, I look forward to getting some use out of him in this next event. And more use from him in general (though I am a crazy person who occasionally runs him in Shield Sim anyway).

    ...

    Now do Banner. :)
  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,275 Chairperson of the Boards

    blacktilepng Superior Science blacktilepng

    <-- New Ability | Old Ability -->


    So this went from a 3 turn stun to 1 turn? Is that a mistake? Thats significantly worse even at 7 AP.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    The new Dr Ock looks great, but I'm confused about how his Reactor works now.

    Questions:

    1) You create a 3-turn repeater, it countdown to 0, and it becomes Phase 2. Then it restarts again, repeater countdown to 0 and it become Phase 3, and so on and so forth? Or do you need to create a new repeater for every phase?

    2) if the repeater is fortified, is it considered "matched away" in order to trigger the passive damage dealt to enemy. I doubt not because it could be pretty broken.

    I'll miss his unique stun ability though. The cost for his black increased by 1ap, but it can be reduced to as low as 7ap.
    The damage has been increased by close to 50% and the strength of the strike tiles have been increased by about 10%.

    I like his old Tentacles more because it auto-creates one and it deals a total of 26,260 damage. The auto-matches made while he is stunned is a bonus.

    For the new Tentacles, Dr. Ock will be immuned to stun with one match-4. The total damage for this new Tentacles would be 26,331. But it's more likely to deal 18,677 damage.

    His Reactor has been greatly simplified and comes with burst healing and the starting ap needed has been reduced from 13 to 6ap.

    Immunity to Stun + Burst Healing = Thanos Wave fun. 
  • Richyyy
    Richyyy Posts: 305 Mover and Shaker
    @Brigby, again I'll ask, is there going to be any kind of sell-back 5* token option for those who don't want their Doc Oc after the changes? Like we saw when OML and Gambit were changed. Or even just an increased sale price for Doc Oc?
  • y4747
    y4747 Posts: 165 Tile Toppler
    edited December 2018
    thanks for taking on a rebalance for him. he sorely needed it. my take:

    black is... similar? slightly better or worse depending on your play style, i like it a bit less.

    blue is massively better - i never see more than one tentacle on the board with old ock, which is not the way it should be. if things go wrong with a cascade, you can easily end up with a 26k nuke for 8 ap, which is very rare in a blue power. even with only one tentacle, you're more than in line with newer 5* in the damage/ap range, and in a non-red color at that.

    green is way less complicated, for the better. with the cheap first phase, i can easily see this turning into a major nuisance and driving ock up the kill order. and with the match penalty, no easy way to get rid of it. still don't think we'll see the final phase much outside of specialized play (pve waves?), but that's ok.

    overall, this takes one of the two worst 5* and brings him into solidly mid-tier, with some unique mechanics. well done.

    ... now do banner please :)
  • JHawkInc
    JHawkInc Posts: 2,605 Chairperson of the Boards
    Richyyy said:
    @Brigby, again I'll ask, is there going to be any kind of sell-back 5* token option for those who don't want their Doc Oc after the changes? Like we saw when OML and Gambit were changed. Or even just an increased sale price for Doc Oc?
    I would guess it'll be more like the Captain America (First Avenger) and Silver Surfer 5* changes before that. Maybe an increased sell price (like they do for 3*/4* updates), but no tokens.
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 10,295 Chairperson of the Boards
    Well my 1/0/1 Doc Ock appreciates the boost, anything helps for the 5E. Maybe he can complete his cunning scheme at last!
  • STOPTHIS
    STOPTHIS Posts: 781 Critical Contributor
    huktonfonix said:
    What exactly is the point of this? I see a character who was complete trash tier before, extremely confusing and complicated to use, with some unique and fun (if bad) abilities.

    The new version is a little better, I guess? But still trash tier and I’m not sure he leapfrogs a single other 5* in the rankings. He’s also still incredibly complicated, but loses some of his unique abilities and interactions.

    Not one of his ability changes is an unconditional buff. Every improvement comes with a trade off. Why? Why not some straight up buffs with no downside instead of getting cute with this? This is not a character in danger of becoming the next Gambit.
    Not every rework needs to make a character top tier. Overall, he looks far more usable now. Sure, he doesn't break the meta, but he doesn't have to. I can't recall every rework they've done, but I'd wager that most were just okay. A bottom tier character becoming top tier is really rare. IM40, Riri, Wasp, and maybe Starlord are the only ones, off the top of my head, that got a rework that made them must haves. This feels more like a Reed or Psylocke level rework. Doc Ock might not be a must have, but now he's a bit more useful for those that do have him.

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