A Modest Proposal (Post-Iso)

GrimSkald

Straycat said:

broll said:

Straycat said:

I thought soft capping meant you don't level them all the way. Thats the way we called it for keeping a 5 underleveled for scaling, right?  So a 5 at 255 is softcapped, because even at 1 cover they can go to 270. Then they would be hard capped.

Soft capping means different things to different people and I've seen several people talk about different types of soft capping.

1.  Leveling to some optimal level before the level required to champ (This is usually where ISO spend is as low as possible to get the character to a 'usable' state).
2.  Leveling to the cap imposed by not having enough covers.

I personally think both are fine uses of the term, though it's confusing for people to use both interchangeably.  Calling #2 a hard cap would be confusing in the same way IMO with 2 different definitions for the same term.  The better solution would be a totally different term.  Cover Capping?

I tend to say level maxed to avoid confusion, but I wanted to make the distinction between what I think soft vs hard cap is.

I think saying your entire roster is hard capped makes more sense, because it covers those you champed and those you are limited by covers. Saying your entire roster is soft capped sounds like you have 0 champs.

Huh.  I use "hard cap" as a more abstract term - "soft cap" is where they can be leveled to based on covers, "hard cap" is their actual level maximum (aside from champing.)  So the "iso to soft cap" is what I can spend now, the "iso to hard cap" is what I can theoretically spend based on what the character is.  I track that on the character by character basis, for each category (3*, 4*, 5*) of character, and for my overall roster.

So right now, for example, I need 2,263,310 Iso to "Hard Cap" my roster.   Most of that comes from under-covered 5*s, but I also haven't finished Dazzler or Nebula.  I haven't added Taskmaster yet (I have a separate section for Trophy characters.)  To soft cap my roster, I need... 0.  I can't spend any Iso on my roster until I get some more covers.

Basepuzzler

OJSP said:

Actually, let’s try to outline this properly:
Getting a 3* to lvl 266 requires 113 covers and we will get: 57500 iso, 2 Heroic, 5 LTs, 
1000 HPs, 50 CPs and 3 4*s. We can then sell the 266 for 105000 iso and 500 HP. We get the LT at lvl 167, 227, 239, 257 and 266 (that’s 60 lvls, 12 lvls, 18 lvls and 9 lvls apart).

Selling a 3* at 167 gives us 25200 iso. We get an LT for every 14 covers. With 112 covers, we get 8 LTs. So, compared to getting a 3* to 266, we ARE getting less resources, like we already know. But, we want to spend iso, we don’t need roster slots to keep the duplicate to 266 and we get LTs faster.

Thanks for spelling it out. 50 cp is 2 LT’s, and the 3 4’s are worth 15cp.  So selling at 167 gets you an extra 10cp. In exchange for 1500 hp plus the non-cp value of the 4* champ levels.  So if you can buy a leg token for ~4000hp it’s exactly break even.  And there’s currently a vault where you can buy a leg token for just about 4000 hp.

bbigler

Option 1 - take 3* to level 266 and sell: 5 LT + 50 CP = 7 LL tokens = 1 x 5* and 6 x 4*s, then add 3 x 4* cover rewards totaling 9 x 4*s. Plus, you get 1000 HP and 2 Heroics.

Option 2 - take 3* to level 167 and sell, 8 times: 8 LT = 1 x 5* and 7 x 4*s. In terms of covers, this is worse. Plus, the Heroics and HP from option 1 help you get more 4*covers. 

In terms of ISO consumption, option 1 takes 125k to champ, 57k in rewards and 105k when sold, which equals a net gain of 37k Iso. Option 2 takes 125k to champ and returns 25k when sold, a net loss of 100k, 8 times = 800k ISO loss. 

Clearly, option 1 is best for covers or ISO.

bbigler

OJSP said:

But, they are post-iso and looking for a way to spend it.. Getting 167 8 times will take time too, they would’ve gained that much in a month anyway.

I’ve shown it time and again how much an LT is worth in the current economy, without directly spending iso on it. So, someone give me a number: how much do you think an LT is worth?

Another thread ( https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/71031/option-to-trade-excess-iso-for-something ) mentioned 2 million iso. I suggested 500k here.. any other advances?

In a post-iso situation, 5* covers are what matter most, and 4* covers help you get more 5* covers, so that's why option 1 is best. If you're asking how much they should sell an LT for in terms of ISO, it would probably be very high since they want to limit 5* distribution. So, maybe for 100k ISO at the lowest and 300k at the highest.

Spudgutter

Yeah, but i don't think the solution is to cut off the nose to spite the face.

They want to have something to do with the iso, that doesn't negatively impact the rest of their game.  

Spudgutter

OJSP said:

Spudgutter said:

Yeah, but i don't think the solution is to cut off the nose to spite the face.

They want to have something to do with the iso, that doesn't negatively impact the rest of their game.  

It doesn’t have to be that way. I’m trying to discuss this. So far, I’m just reading criticisms and no counter suggestions.

What do you want to get for your iso?

No idea. But looking at the numbers, re-farming 3* at 14 covers seems counterintuitive.

Not everyone needs to have an idea in order to comment on another idea.  

Some people are able to come up with ideas (good and bad), some people are able to evaluate ideas, and some people can do both.  I am in the second group, and am fully aware of it.  

Spudgutter

OJSP said:

Spudgutter said:

Some people are able to come up with ideas (good and bad), some people are able to evaluate ideas, and some people can do both.  I am in the second group, and am fully aware of it.  

Well.. usually when I want to argue with someone, at least I’d have something to offer..

Well, looks like we disagree on another topic then.  

Drlex

OJSP said:

But, they are post-iso and looking for a way to spend it.. Getting 167 8 times will take time too, they would’ve gained that much in a month anyway.

I’ve shown it time and again how much an LT is worth in the current economy, without directly spending iso on it. So, someone give me a number: how much do you think an LT is worth?

Another thread ( https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/71031/option-to-trade-excess-iso-for-something ) mentioned 2 million iso. I suggested 500k here.. any other advances?

I mentioned 2 million as a way for them to buy a specific cover with a specific color, not as a price for an LT.

jackstar0

I've crossed 7mm iso.

Allowing for about 1.4mm to be spent on Doom, CM and Hela (and Talos, I guess) as covers trickle in, that still leaves me very little to do with a pile of iso that's only slowly, but surely growing.

I do like the idea of a 1mm for a 5* cover purchase. Let's do that, please.

bluewolf

Ah, makes sense now.

jackstar0

Just over a month and I'm now over 8mm iso...

Nothing? Something? Is this even being considered?

Why wouldn't you want to give more ways to deplete resources? It's your economy, you need to keep the scarcity...

Yasuru

All 5s champed besides Hela, and GED.  All 4s champed besides Taskmaster, Spider-Ham, Hawkeye, and Thanos.  My ISO number... 11,262,206.   It's gotten to the point that as I'm applying covers, I mutter, "useless" every time it's ISO.  Please give me SOMETHING to do with this stuff!

PiMacleod

I'm on day 2031...  I understand the idea of Post-ISO....  But it sounds like a problem I want to have.  I still have a handful of 4s left to champ, and plenty of 5s that need leveling.

Mind you, I've barely spent cash on MPQ.  So I've never had a big jump in resources or status of any kind.

jackstar0

Coming up on a year... and I am at 13mm iso.