Update to Supports (7/3/18)

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Comments

  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Heartbreaksoup said:
    Actually, you know what would be lovely?  You know that node in Webbed Wonder that rewards a Howard cover?  How about adding an optional node to each PVE story that does not award any points whatsoever, just a Support token.  That way, the players who enjoy Supports can play it for a prize that we want, and the players who seem offended by the very existence of the things and want our fun toys taken away from us can skip the node and not worry about earning one.
    If they do that make it 0 points so i can skip it and not hurt placement.
  • BoyWonder1914
    BoyWonder1914 Posts: 884 Critical Contributor
    It was pretty disheartening to read "starting with Wasp Gauntlets", and then to not see that any kind of changes are being made to the availability of supports. I don't flat out hate supports, on the contrary I actually enjoy their effects - when they ACTUALLY trigger. I care about speed, but not to the point that I'm one of those people who blows a gasket every time a banner comes across the screen. My PVP experience, and PVE rankings will be just fine. 

    In addition to increased availability, but aside from the perceived "strength" of the supports, I was actually hoping all the % chances would be addressed. I don't think the odds on any of these abilities should be less than 1 in 4, or 25%. It's way too much of a struggle to get supports in the first place, let alone level them to 100/250, just for you to have a 17.77% chance of gaining 3 Black AP at the start of the battle. If you're going to make them that hard to acquire, it's only fair that the use of the perks shouldn't be so highly relegated to chance. 
  • Richyyy
    Richyyy Posts: 305 Mover and Shaker
    Just to add on to the comments about lack of availability, I bought the 100HP daily deals for the recent vault, and actually got an 'Advanced' Support token. Yay! It's gold! You get it and think you might get something decent. We're used to gold symbols at least meaning a 3* cover in the rest of the game. But no. I got a 2* support of some kind (can't even remember which one), which went on the pile with the rest.

    Even when you get these tokens - which is pretty damn rare - their offered rewards are stingy. The 'Advanced' ones give you 2* supports more often than not (that's not hyperbole - according to the posted numbers nearly 60% of Advanced tokens give you a 2*). It's ridiculous. The flow of riso is so low to start with, and the flow of actual supports - especially at a decent level - goes right along with that. These are the key issues here. Why should any of us care about them with the way you've set them up?
  • Rockwell75
    Rockwell75 Posts: 268 Mover and Shaker
    Tensuun said:

    Supports...strictly-better-than-before features
    It's by no means clear yet that supports qualify as a "strictly better than before feature".  If they evolve into mostly character specific-features that should have been present with characters upon release then I would argue they're going to be a "strictly not better than before feature".  It's far from decided at this point, but I will admit that some of the early signs trouble me.
  • JHawkInc
    JHawkInc Posts: 2,605 Chairperson of the Boards
    Rockwell75 said:
    Tensuun said:

    Supports...strictly-better-than-before features
    It's by no means clear yet that supports qualify as a "strictly better than before feature".  If they evolve into mostly character specific-features that should have been present with characters upon release then I would argue they're going to be a "strictly not better than before feature".  It's far from decided at this point, but I will admit that some of the early signs trouble me.
    I don't even think we've seen early signs beyond the typical doom and gloom of forum pessimists. I mean, if you pretend these things "should have been present with characters upon release" and put those features back on the character, you'd end up with a broken character.

    I can see some issues with RNG and whaling in regards to collecting the character and their associated support, but I don't think there's a worry balance-wise, it's not like they're giving us 90% of a character at launch and carving off 10% for the Support, leaving the character "incomplete" otherwise.
  • Reecoh
    Reecoh Posts: 210 Tile Toppler
    In addition to being able to get more tokens, I'd like to see the cover saving feature rolled into supports to replace the riso you get for dupes to let the saved dupe supports be cashed in for the next level (perhaps with more being needed as you level up).

    Then up the amount of riso we get from playing the game to more than compensate for the loss from duplicate payouts now. I'd rather have a regular flow of riso than the trickle + occasional burst I get now.

    That would make them more interesting to me as a build-over-time feature.

    The UI to manage them still needs a LOT of work as well though. That's a big barrier for my using them as well.
  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
    edited July 2018
    I'm actually okay with copies giving riso if the obtain rate increases, but it draws question to the leveling. I just got a second copy of Kimoyo Beads at rank 4, and could only level it from 23 to 27? That's terrible. A rare drop like a rank 4 copy should provide a lot more of a boost.

    So, attaining them needs to be more available, leveling them needs to rebalanced, and god help us if they are going to only send out 3 powered supports, be ready to rework them all. Leaving the others at 5 either dilutes them or makes them stronger (if any of us could get to the potential they offer). All things that have been said before me, but putting them all together paints a quick fix picture. Hopefully they just give the Wasp Gauntlets some new ranks, leave them at 5 powers, and just start making them rain, even if its rank 1. OH!

    Maybe once a support reaches its max level, have it rank up from copies obtained. That would be cool. Getting a fifth copy and it finally ranking up would be a relief.
  • Player1575
    Player1575 Posts: 253 Mover and Shaker
    @Brigby any chance you can see if the devs could loosen the equipping restrictions on some of the already existing supports? Ex: change astral plane from BP only to Heroes, like how the royal talon fighter is.
  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
    I think that focusing in on the affiliations like XMen, Young Avengers, and Defenders, thatst a great idea for the supports. Change the Wasp Gauntlets to "Pym Tech" characters, change the "Spider Sense" to all spider-verse characters. This would provide a lot bigger variety. Like the Milano for Guardians, the Sync up power should really be for any Guardians, not just Gro/cket.
  • Player1575
    Player1575 Posts: 253 Mover and Shaker
    Player1575 said:
    @Brigby any chance you can see if the devs could loosen the equipping restrictions on some of the already existing supports? Ex: change astral plane from BP only to Heroes, like how the royal talon fighter is.
    Please @Brigby can you bring this up to the devs? Some of the supports would be amazing on certain characters, but can't be used with them because of the restrictions. And then you have others (all Children  of Thanos for example) that are completely worthless because they can only be equipped to a certain few characters.
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
    Player1575 said:
    Player1575 said:
    Brigby any chance you can see if the devs could loosen the equipping restrictions on some of the already existing supports? Ex: change astral plane from BP only to Heroes, like how the royal talon fighter is.
    Please Brigby can you bring this up to the devs? Some of the supports would be amazing on certain characters, but can't be used with them because of the restrictions. And then you have others (all Children  of Thanos for example) that are completely worthless because they can only be equipped to a certain few characters.
    Did you have any specific Supports you had in mind? I know some of them can get rather specific, whereas others are rather general and open.

    Knowing which ones you were looking at would help in relaying this suggestion to the team. Thanks!
  • Player1575
    Player1575 Posts: 253 Mover and Shaker
    @Brigby I guess a specific list would include Astral Plane, The Dora Milaje, Spider Sense, and The Carol Corps; with a possible expansion to the Children of Thanos because of how few villains there are, though I can understand them bring equip to villains only.

    It just doesn't make sense why Astral Plane etc. are only equipable to a specific character while other supports like Quantum Realm, Royal Talon Fighter, and Wasp Gauntlets can be used by "heroes" (basically everyone) or everyone. What makes Astral Plane so different from Royal Talon Fighter that only BP can use Astral Plane, while anyone can use Royal Talon Fighter? Same question for Spider Sense only being allowed to Spider Man while anyone can use Quantum Realm.

    It just doesn't seem fair that certain supports that could be really good can't be used with anyone except a certain person, who may or may not even be worth using depending on the tier you play in. 

    Personally, I'd live to put Astral Plane on my Jessica Jones, but I can't. At the same time though, I could put Quantum Realm on a number of characters outside of ghost (or other Ant-Man movie characters) that it can benefit greatly, such as Daredevil.
  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 183 Tile Toppler
    One thing I see with a few choices they made: the Astral Plane is specifically tied to how Black Panther communicates to his ancestors. This is why he has such high awareness, and his strength can be powered by this too. So, while martial arts and tech are his forte in general, in reality his power is specifically this Astral Plane connection. My issue? It can only be equipped to ONE of Black Panther versions. Spider Sense should be open to any Spider verse character capable of it, like Spider Woman. This is how I want these to expand.
  • boy_on_krypton
    boy_on_krypton Posts: 9 Just Dropped In
    I would love to see Descriptions on Support’s just like characters have. Understanding the relevance of a support helps one appreciate it.
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
    boy_on_krypton said:
    I would love to see Descriptions on Support’s just like characters have. Understanding the relevance of a support helps one appreciate it.
    Do you mean a Support's lore, kind of like how characters are introduced, or do you mean strategies as to how one Support could benefit a character mechanic-wise?
  • Drlex
    Drlex Posts: 112 Tile Toppler
    Three runs in, I am sick of it. Scl8 all three times. 7th, 1st, 8th. I played hard and got nothing but 2 star covers and a dupe 3 star support. This is ****. The payout is ridiculous. I really liked supports and was hopeful this would work, but I am starting to dislike them. I even spent good money on supports. I won’t be doing that anymore. It hasn’t turned to hate yet, but it is heading that way.
  • Heartbreaksoup
    Heartbreaksoup Posts: 356 Mover and Shaker
    Brigby said:
    boy_on_krypton said:
    I would love to see Descriptions on Support’s just like characters have. Understanding the relevance of a support helps one appreciate it.
    Do you mean a Support's lore, kind of like how characters are introduced, or do you mean strategies as to how one Support could benefit a character mechanic-wise?

    I read that as meaning if you "scroll" to the far right on a character, you learn who the character is.  Maybe a little blurb on a support might explain who the Tinkerer or the Carol Corps are.
  • limonade
    limonade Posts: 41 Just Dropped In
    edited February 2019
    After nearly a year with Support cards, I'd like to point out the clear limited accessibility still. You can't force us to hype up these items when hardly anyone has 5* Support cards to hype about in their roster.

    Please update us on when the team decides to open the floodgates of Support accessibility. Because 1 in 20 in Master Support and 1 in 100 Advance Support for a 5* Support card is still a rough go with little way to attain them.

    They're not that important or hyped to the overall core gameplay mechanics so I don't get this move to keep this away from normal players of MPQ. Unless, the team is deciding to scale back support cards... which I hope you guys do as well.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    0 turn to fire power and 0 turn to put Vulture to the sky is game changing. There are many more gamechanging.

    Advance support didn't have Rank 5 supports at all. But they added in.

    Asking for increased Rank 5 accessibility now is a pipe dream. It will probably take another 1-2 years. 

    Let's start small and ask for increased assessibility to Rank 3 supports, which is much more realistic.

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