Update to Supports (7/3/18)



  • Blindman13Blindman13 Posts: 504 Critical Contributor
    So, now the perks are more powerful, but there's less perks.....so a net gain of nearly nothing?
    I like supports. On the rare occasion that they do something, it's a nice little addition. I assumed they would be getting some sort of re-work, but this feels like the wrong solution to the right problem.  As others have said, more Red-ISO and/or more tokens would be the first change I would have made.
  • FreelancerFreelancer Posts: 119 Tile Toppler
    While you're making changes, can you update the supports tab to display the characters thumbnail on any equipped supports, please. The interface is so clunky, that the hassle of determining which support is attached to which character makes me not even want to bother.
  • venyveny Posts: 834 Critical Contributor
    edited July 2018
    Briefly said, having 4* Support is no longer way better than 3*, so super lucky/rich players with 5* Supports get huge advantage over players with 4* Supports, that are a bit easier to obtain.
    IF supports are stronger overall with unchanged RISO/supp token economy, it makes game more pay to win, which could multiply existing problems once they become part of PvP.
    Anyway, thanks for trying to fix the issue... lets wait for results.
  • HoundofShadowHoundofShadow Posts: 2,563 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2018
    The real problem is accessibility of Support Token. Time to open the Support Store. It has been under renovation for close to two months.

    The small amount of Red Iso-8 gained in PvE or PvP can be overcomed by duplicates of Support Tokens. A Rank 3 Support Duplicate gives 12000 Red Iso-8 or 6 times the amount of a 5* cover.

    If Support Store is opened for business, should it be purchased using HP, CP or a new currency? The vets would definitely favour HP over CP, while new players might favour CP over HP. If not, a new currency might be out, which won't be a surprise to me.

  • DyingLegendDyingLegend Posts: 710 Critical Contributor
    I think if you were listening to the same feedback that I've been reading, the overall consensus is that supports are worthless and should have never been implemented and the implementation of support has been nothing but a mess.

    I still feel like the time spent on supports could have been spent at coming up with a dilution fix, character re-balances ETC.

    I have yet to equip a support and i don't plan to. They don't benefit me in any way. What benefits me more is earning 4 stars and 5 stars easier. That makes me feel stronger, supports do nothing for me. 

  • therightwayetherightwaye Posts: 459 Mover and Shaker
    Supports are fine. I haven't leveled supports because I hate another variant of RnG. Getting covers is already random enough. Adding supports should have never been a buy a coin, put it in the slot machine. You're already doing that with covers. 

    I'd rather see supports earned through fun side nodes. Leveled up with just RISO. I'd even spend a couple of dollars every so often for a unique support that comes attached with the right character cover in HfH.

  • zulux21zulux21 Posts: 249 Tile Toppler
    edited July 2018
    not that I can get red iso or supports in general to even care about supports.

    but all I see here is a further devaluing of the support tokens that give a 4* or 5* support.
    removing the 4* power means that the 4* version isn't any better than the 3* version. Sure you can technically level it higher but well not if you don't have red iso.

    so it means you effectively only have 3 tiers to care about... which given there are 3 tokens it really feels like you should drop the 5 tiers, make it just 3, and the tokens given you at each the tier.

    given the rate you are releasing supports there is no need for the carrot on the stick for people trying to chase 5* versions... even if the master tokens gave nothing but 5* tokens it would still be basically impossible to get all of the supports right now.

    Logically supports should be something fun extra to chase and play with.... not something that is the hardest thing in the game to make have any meaning, that you don't want to spend iso to level up on because the iso is so rare it means you can only really level one support period.
  • alaethalaeth Posts: 446 Mover and Shaker
    edited July 2018
    I honestly don't know if Supports are any good because I cannot use them- the UI is terrible.

    There's no way to traverse from character to support and back... even with adding a button to get to Characters from the supports screen, what we really need is:

    * The ability to navigate seamlessly between
    ** generic supports page, each applied support showing they've been assigned...
    ** a specific support (again, indication who it's assigned to via a button that navigates to...
    ** the character it's applied to
    ** the overall roster
    (back and forth).

    As it stands, given the details of the supports, the nuances of synergies, my legs have literally gone numb as I sit on the porcelain throne trying to decide (and then remember/navigate the UI) to apply a single support.
  • JaedenkaalJaedenkaal Posts: 3,340 Chairperson of the Boards
    moss04 said:
    Since 5 star supports basically can't be acquired, this change actually makes supports worse. Now you can only realistically get 2 perks on any support, and most likely the most useful perk will be the third one if the newest "improved" perk is a good example of future designs.  At least some of the old supports had good perks at 2, 3, or 4.
    Imagine that with the change, perk 2 is equal to perk 3 AND perk 4 from a support today. Possibly with improved numbers. That's what I'm reading here. I'd say that makes 3* supports better than today, and 4* supports, at the very least, more or less the same.
  • HeartbreaksoupHeartbreaksoup Posts: 231 Tile Toppler
    I'm with @purplemur .  Good reply, that.

    I like Supports a lot.  I enjoy deciding who gets equipped with what as I assemble my PVE team, also finding the right gear for the required characters in the essential nodes.  I really like this part of the game, it makes the missions more creative and imaginative.  And I do love Okoye starting off with extra yellow AP thanks to Avengers Tower.

    It's made my nightly roster maintenance more fun instead of a chore. I like having the freedom to decide whether to keep levelling up Wong or spreading the wealth - ha! "wealth"! - among other Supports.  The whole thing's just great fun...

    Except, look.  You devs... you have this so backward that you think Wyoming comes first when you alphabetize the states.  The vault should not be a 120 item vault.  It should be 80 *at most*.  The Wasp Gauntlets should be one of those items, not fifteen tokens which each have a 1:25 chance of getting the Wasp Gauntlets.

    Most importantly, you really need to drop the number of 2* covers.  Those are NOT why we consider spending money in a Support vault!  In a normal vault, sure, those are fine.  Everybody understands that if you spend HP in a normal vault (Partners in Crime, Unstable ISO-8, etc) then you are fishing for covers.  Makes sense that most of THOSE are 2* covers.  We know that before we click the button.  If it's a Support vault, then certainly a 4* cover will make most people smile, but we get more than enough 2*s everywhere else in this game.

    In the Wasp Gauntlet vault, the 2*s are booby prizes.  And the odds are better than 50% that you'll get one.

    Yes, we need more sources for Red ISO and yes, there should be more chances to get Supports via progression, but those 120-item vaults with 63 2*s are really insulting.  If you made it almost exactly the same in an 80-item vault and just knocked the number of 2*s down to 23, even that would be a mammoth improvement.

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