GIVE ME MY GREG BACK

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Mburn7
Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
Gotta say, out of all the balancing done with Rivals the changes to Greg are absolutely the worst.

I mean, even at his worst, he was still able to use abilities.  Now he just spams the first one no matter how charged up he is.
And he still kills his own creatures.
And he makes off-color matches now for no discernible reason.

At least he still gets match-5s!

But seriously, the better AI was nice to have.  I don't see the reason for the (as someone else here so eloquently put it) lobotomy.  Just give us back our nice semi-intelligent Greg and get rid of this hit by a semi-truck version.

Please
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Comments

  • UweTellkampf
    UweTellkampf Posts: 376 Mover and Shaker
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    The game is so so so dull again. I can move some gems randomly around and I will outsmart this piece of wood that Greg has become again. Make Greg great again!
  • bk1234
    bk1234 Posts: 2,924 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Brainly Greg was a worthwhile opponent. Lobotomy Greg is just "eh". 
  • NinjaE
    NinjaE Posts: 213 Tile Toppler
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    It was a little too ridiculous at times.
  • UweTellkampf
    UweTellkampf Posts: 376 Mover and Shaker
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    Between "little too ridiculous at times" and "way too easy always" in gaming, I'd always choose the first option. 
  • Laeuftbeidir
    Laeuftbeidir Posts: 1,841 Chairperson of the Boards
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    He takes match 5s against you? If they wouldn't have been able to actually fine-tune IXL and the current coalition event, I'd have said they only know extremes. Slow Greg is lame.
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,730 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2018
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    I dunno, Ob Nix Greg always seems to go for his ultimate and use his spells as if I was actually fighting a fairly skilled player.  I'd be interested in facing this easy Greg you all speak of.
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I dunno, Ob Nix Greg always seems to go for his ultimate and use his spells as if I was actually fighting a fairly skilled player.  I'd be interested in facing this easy Greg you all speak of.
    I faced a Samut that cascaded out her ult turn 4 and just spammed her first every turn for the rest of the game.  It was nasty, but not consistent with how I know the AI (or a player) would play it.  I've seen other walkers spam their first when the second or third is charged (Bolas, Dovin, Sorin are quick examples) as well, so I know it isn't a localized thing
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,730 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2018
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    I am noticing the AI making matches that continuously disable my creatures via the special RtO node.  It is more inconvenient than I originally had originally anticipated.
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I am noticing the AI making matches that continuously disable my creatures via the special RtO node.  It is more inconvenient than I originally had originally anticipated.
    Funny, I've been noticing the AI specifically ignoring its own activated gems.  Saw a Bolas make a white match instead of a red with an activate.
  • Lars
    Lars Posts: 33 Just Dropped In
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    Making Greg smart for just some events and not others seemed like a weird way of implementing different level, why not just make him smart for higher ranked players?
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Lars said:
    Making Greg smart for just some events and not others seemed like a weird way of implementing different level, why not just make him smart for higher ranked players?
    I don't think its such a trivial matter.  Coding different AI for different opponents, whether based on tier or ranking or whatever seems to me like its pretty difficult.  I mean, we can't even agree on how difficult the AI is when its the same for everyone (except for general terms like "better than before but not as good as it was before that").

    Trying to scale difficulty would also make the transition from one tier to the next that much more difficult, as players would need to adjust to both their new opponents having better decks and the better AI
  • Lars
    Lars Posts: 33 Just Dropped In
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    Mburn7 said:
    Lars said:
    Making Greg smart for just some events and not others seemed like a weird way of implementing different level, why not just make him smart for higher ranked players?
    I don't think its such a trivial matter.  Coding different AI for different opponents, whether based on tier or ranking or whatever seems to me like its pretty difficult.  I mean, we can't even agree on how difficult the AI is when its the same for everyone (except for general terms like "better than before but not as good as it was before that").
    Well, it's trivial to code; I mean, they've got the old Greg and the new Greg code already; possibly even more varied levels of difficulty, from the way I read the last announcement. They just have to decide who gets to face which level, which is a non trivial decision which depends on feedback from many different users as well as what kind of experience the programmers objectively want to create.
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,730 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Lars said:
    Mburn7 said:
    Lars said:
    Making Greg smart for just some events and not others seemed like a weird way of implementing different level, why not just make him smart for higher ranked players?
    I don't think its such a trivial matter.  Coding different AI for different opponents, whether based on tier or ranking or whatever seems to me like its pretty difficult.  I mean, we can't even agree on how difficult the AI is when its the same for everyone (except for general terms like "better than before but not as good as it was before that").
    Well, it's trivial to code; I mean, they've got the old Greg and the new Greg code already; possibly even more varied levels of difficulty, from the way I read the last announcement. They just have to decide who gets to face which level, which is a non trivial decision which depends on feedback from many different users as well as what kind of experience the programmers objectively want to create.
    maybe with each victory per specific node the AI gets more difficult in future battles with that node.  :)
  • Mainloop25
    Mainloop25 Posts: 1,940 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Completely agree  I don't know what they did to Lili3, but she didn't use ANY of her abilities last time I played her. And there were zombies in her deck too. 
  • Wolfteeth
    Wolfteeth Posts: 125 Tile Toppler
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    I am not sure why there isn't an in between? The mana cascades prior to his change were obnoxious and now the new Greg is just odd.  I just want fair fights and close matches
  • Lars
    Lars Posts: 33 Just Dropped In
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    wereotter said:

    The point is, if you're on these forums, chances are, your voice is an outlier. The typical player likely isn't on here, and likely isn't as hardcore into the game as you are, and probably will be turned away if the game is too challenging, and fewer players getting into the game, or sticking with it, is bad for the health of the game overall.
    I'm not sure that's true. Casual players are _more_ likely to be represented on forums, as they are more interested in the social side of the game, which is what forums represent. A forum poster might be better at articulating _why_ they think some aspect of game should be changed than an 'average' player, or simply have more time to engage in the forums to do that, but there's no particular reason why posting on forums automatically makes you less representative of the game's players as a group.
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Completely agree  I don't know what they did to Lili3, but she didn't use ANY of her abilities last time I played her. And there were zombies in her deck too. 
    Lil 3 does not use her ability on zombie creatures, only non-zombie.  Usually that means she just saves up for her ult, but since the AI is no longer allowed to use any abilities but the first (apparently) she just fizzles
  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,064 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Lars said:
    wereotter said:

    The point is, if you're on these forums, chances are, your voice is an outlier. The typical player likely isn't on here, and likely isn't as hardcore into the game as you are, and probably will be turned away if the game is too challenging, and fewer players getting into the game, or sticking with it, is bad for the health of the game overall.
    I'm not sure that's true. Casual players are _more_ likely to be represented on forums, as they are more interested in the social side of the game, which is what forums represent. A forum poster might be better at articulating _why_ they think some aspect of game should be changed than an 'average' player, or simply have more time to engage in the forums to do that, but there's no particular reason why posting on forums automatically makes you less representative of the game's players as a group.
    I’m referring to the casual player as the one who just downloaded the app and plays it. They may not even know a forum exists for the game, let alone chat on it if they do. This is who I had in mind when I mention that kind of player.

    I mean consider how many players exist in this game, then think about how many names you see here and with what frequency. The majority of players don’t give feedback on here. 
  • Lars
    Lars Posts: 33 Just Dropped In
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    wereotter said:
    Lars said:
    wereotter said:

    The point is, if you're on these forums, chances are, your voice is an outlier. The typical player likely isn't on here, and likely isn't as hardcore into the game as you are, and probably will be turned away if the game is too challenging, and fewer players getting into the game, or sticking with it, is bad for the health of the game overall.
    I'm not sure that's true. Casual players are _more_ likely to be represented on forums, as they are more interested in the social side of the game, which is what forums represent. A forum poster might be better at articulating _why_ they think some aspect of game should be changed than an 'average' player, or simply have more time to engage in the forums to do that, but there's no particular reason why posting on forums automatically makes you less representative of the game's players as a group.
    I’m referring to the casual player as the one who just downloaded the app and plays it. They may not even know a forum exists for the game, let alone chat on it if they do. This is who I had in mind when I mention that kind of player.

    I mean consider how many players exist in this game, then think about how many names you see here and with what frequency. The majority of players don’t give feedback on here. 
    True; but just because a minority of players post here, it doesn't mean they are 'outliers'. Since they are players, their views are entirely representative of players.
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