So is Ragnarok just bad?

Jwallyr

So I was looking at the Nefarious Foes PvP event, and trying to see if there was any point in switching up my team build. Right now I'm running IM40/KK/Gambit 3*, so obviously a lot of healing with splash damage and yada yada. My reasonable level options for villains include basically Ragnarok, 3* Bullseye and Magneto, and 2* Daken, with Rags being the highest.

I could make Bullseye work, but I'm just not blown away by what I'd actually be able to do with him at his current cover spread (and non-champed) vs my standard team. Magneto doesn't synergize with anything I care about, even if he hits like a truck. Daken is meh, never been a fan, so even if I could make his schtick work it's still not interesting.

So... we have Ragnaros. I'm looking at his abilities, and comparing his green in particular to KK's green.

At 170, for 12 Green AP KK does 3422 team damage.
At 255, for 14 Green AP Rag does 2744 team damage (tooltip shown in an actual match) and 524 to allies, and destroys a random column (i.e. random damage to the frontmost character I'm assuming).

Am I missing something here, or is Ragnaros's green ability:
1) More expensive
2) Does less damage
3) Does damage to your own team
4) destroys a random column for random chip damage to front enemy, not generating AP

The only item in that list that's not a straight-up negative is the random column destruction, which is random board shake, no AP, probably not much extra damage to make up for the frontmost enemy, and this is with an 85 level advantage due to the event boost.

His red is ok, and I hear it's part of a winfinite combo that I'm not even close to being able to use. His blue ability is self-only healing that doesn't persist between matches (seems to be the worst of both worlds when it comes to healing) and doesn't actually create new green tiles, but just makes charged tiles that may not be easy to match.

So... is he just bad on his own (i.e. outside of specific winfinite combos) or am I missing something here?

TPF Alexis

You're not wrong. Outside of the Ragfinity combo with Riri, he's a serious contender for worst 3*.

hopper1979

His green is horrible.  See above combo for his optimal use and  he also pairs very well with Quicksilver who benefits from both his blue and red powers.  I would still take him over Sentry but he is bottom 3 in the 3-star group no debate.

GrimSkald

On the bright side, before they added his third power his red added green to the board, and his green destroyed the middle two collumns of the board for 6 green AP (it did tile destruction damage, but nothing else.)  This doesn't sound so bad, but all those nodes in PVE where you have to face him?  Sometimes he got to fire the green power Every. Tinykitty. Turn.  It was ridiculous.

So yeah.  When they revamped him I was like, "Well, he sucks, but at least I don't have to face "Godlike Power" and the resulting cascades every turn anymore..."

Anon

TPF Alexis said:

You're not wrong. Outside of the Ragfinity combo with Riri, he's a serious contender for worst 3*.

Ragfinity is awesome, but standalone Ragnarok is pretty bad.

Quebbster

I like Ragnarok, but it's pretty much all because of his fairly cheap Red. The ability to make green Charged tiles is fairly useful too, I suppose.

He actually works pretty well with Kamala - his cheap red means she gets to heal a lot, and with the help of her Purple it's a lot easier to match away the green charged tiles. Kamala gets to use the green AP of course.

wingX

I like to use Rag (3/5/5) together with Kamala  (5/5/3) and Quicksilver (3/5/5) .Using Rag red to make blue for QS passive thus making QS attack cheaper and for Kamala to heal. The green collected will be used by QS at cheap cost.

Dormammu

Ragnarok is best used as a blue battery, but it's hard to use him even for that because to do so you have to use his red and it's a pretty soft blow. I like to ignore his green and pretend it doesn't exist.

But as others have said, Ragfinity is real. I believe it's the most reliable winfinite out there right now in the 3-4 star game. It doesn't take much to get going (one Recharge from IM40 usually does it) and sustains itself well. I think the only reason it isn't more popular is the fact that despite being a fast starter, it's a slow finisher.

Jarvind

What is this "Ragfinity?" Is there a third member besides Riri and Rags?

DarthDeVo

 Iceman was boosted the last time Rags' PvP ran. That was pretty sweet. Other than a battery, I'd say his uses are fairly limited. 

Anon

Jarvind said:

What is this "Ragfinity?" Is there a third member besides Riri and Rags?

Mostly those two, although IM40 speeds it up considerably. Basically Recharge, then spam Rags Red to make Blue for Riri, then use Riri Blue to make Red for Rags. Repeat until all are dead. It's very reliable and after Recharge went off I've ended matches that very turn.

atomzed

I probably try Ragfinite now that we can disable the animations. 

Phumade

Jwallyr said:

So I was looking at the Nefarious Foes PvP event, and trying to see if there was any point in switching up my team build. Right now I'm running IM40/KK/Gambit 3*, so obviously a lot of healing with splash damage and yada yada. My reasonable level options for villains include basically Ragnarok, 3* Bullseye and Magneto, and 2* Daken, with Rags being the highest.


So... is he just bad on his own (i.e. outside of specific winfinite combos) or am I missing something here?

So a bit of history here.  Rags is actually one of the oldest 3* in the game, and alot of pve rules have changed that effectively weaken rags for player rosters.

1.  DA were designed with PVE events in mind and that version of PVE rules had enemy chars that were designed to scale with player rosters.  However,  3* rules still cap Rags at 166 for players.  The net effect is  Player's Rags is 1/2 as powerful as when the AI uses him in pve.  

if they  ever buffed Rags,  He would be unstoppable in pve especially when scaled to 515.  This is true for all version of the Dark Avengers.

Be cafeful what you wish for.  Any buff to those early characters will essentially make high level pve brutal.

Dormammu

Jarvind said:

What is this "Ragfinity?" Is there a third member besides Riri and Rags?

This is pulled from the excellent Explain your team!! thread in the Tips & Guides section.

RAGFINITY

Ragnarok (x/5/x)
Riri (5/x/x)
IM40 (x/x/5)

1. Gather 6 yellow AP and cast IM40's Recharge.
1a. Prioritize red, blue, and green (in that order) in the absence of yellow, and also while protecting IM40s countdown tiles.
2. Get 24 red AP for 4 casts of Rag's red power. You may need to do 1 cast of Riri's blue to get it. (Note: your opponent should no longer get another turn after this point.)
2a. Cast Rag's red 4+ times in a row. This is going to generate a lot of blue tiles and minor cascades - don't make any manual matches unless it's a match-5 which allows your turn to continue.
3. You should have a lot of blue AP by now. Cast Riri's blue as many times as you can until you run out of blue AP, or until you have 30 red AP built back up from her charged red tile generation.
4. Repeat steps 2a & 3 as needed until all your opponents are downed and you win. (Note: when you're down to one opponent under 10k health, Riri's red will finish things quickly.)
5. If at any point the winfinite falters, you have Riri's green to handicap the opponent into an airborne status while you reset things.

Jesus Jones

I L-O-V-E infinity teams!