Can we talk about 4* Rocket?

Borstock

Hadronic said:

Borstock said:

I play in SCL9 and my highest 5* character is lvl 333. I have finished each PvE in the top 50 pretty easily and the only time I use Grocket is to burn through the first three easy missions (teamed with Thanos) or when he's boosted. Otherwise, I find them largely useless in PvE.

In PvP, he's useful, but he's probably on my C-team. The main annoyance is that he shows up a lot on opposing teams. But that's true of Carol and Medusa and Blade, too.

There are several characters I would place ahead of Grocket if we were to make a nerf list.

i dont think he needs a nerf, the speed meta does. Nerfing rocket's yellow would just make him a bum no one used. Rocket, and Thanos, just allow you to easily exploit the meta, which is why they get singled out i guess.

Speed is a built-in part of the game. I don't see how you could ever eliminate it entirely. I also don't see it as a problem. That's like competing in a NASCAR race and complaining that you didn't come in first because you finished 30 seconds behind the winner in a 3 hour race.

Hadronic

LavaManLee said:

As others mentioned, 4RG really doesn't need a nerf.  It is specific to PVE and really requires you to also use Gamora or 4StarLord.  In PVP, that is a totally beatable team, no matter who the third character is.  I appreciate they gave us a character to speed through the "boring" rounds and let us go to the actual "thinking" rounds as soon as possible.  It's the PVE experience itself, not the character, that needs a retooling.

Instead of giving us these kind of tools to get through the boring trivial rounds, I would prefer they just got rid of the boring trivial nodes. Of course, that leads to a bunch of different issues.

An even better tool for those boring rounds would be a button at the end of the fight that says, PLAY AGAIN?

Saving you from having to spend the next 30 seconds clicking through menus just so you can play another 1 turn fight.

Borstock

broll said:

BoyWonder1914 said:

broll said:

I'm kinda confused by all the people claiming they are problem PvE only.  I usually lose to them in PvP and as such end up trying to avoid them, but once I get around 850 8 out of 10 teams are 4RG + G4mora + RNG

Thing/Medusa/Riri turns them into puppies. Or XFDP's black passive at 5 will ensure that Gamora or RBG don't last too long. You just have to have the right people. 

I'm not really sure what makes RBG so different from everyone else that gives you a speed advantage. Hell, I made MUCH quicker work of the Kingpin nodes with C&D/C4rol. C&D produces black, and I don't touch them to bait Kingpin or Ock into matching them. 2 or 3 matches and the AOE did all the work. The speed meta will exist regardless of who they nerf, people will just find different ways. So at the end of the day these nerfs will hurt no one but the players. 

I don't have Thing. I've tried Medusa, but unless I bring +4 purple she's usually dead before I can launch per Purple.

I suspect a lot of the people who say this isn't a problem have really high level 4*s.  All my champs are bottom feeders, highest is around 290, most are 275 or below.

You could bring Medusa and mirror match with your own Rocket. That puts a lot of special tiles down. You're bound to get something every turn. Add on Reed and you can have a stun buddy.

You could bring C4ge for shields and special tile removal.

You could bring Peggy to make sure you're only taking match dmg in the beginning. Pair with a healer.

Find out their strongest color and try to match it, add C4rol, and now their top matches hurt them.

There's options.

Borstock

Hadronic said:

LavaManLee said:

As others mentioned, 4RG really doesn't need a nerf.  It is specific to PVE and really requires you to also use Gamora or 4StarLord.  In PVP, that is a totally beatable team, no matter who the third character is.  I appreciate they gave us a character to speed through the "boring" rounds and let us go to the actual "thinking" rounds as soon as possible.  It's the PVE experience itself, not the character, that needs a retooling.

Instead of giving us these kind of tools to get through the boring trivial rounds, I would prefer they just got rid of the boring trivial nodes. Of course, that leads to a bunch of different issues.

An even better tool for those boring rounds would be a button at the end of the fight that says, PLAY AGAIN?

Saving you from having to spend the next 30 seconds clicking through menus just so you can play another 1 turn fight.

The boring trivial nodes are often the only option a casual player has to play a non-beast fight. That's why I like them. If I just want to play for funsies, I can't really go into PvP, because it costs me when I lose and I'm always going up against a strong opponent.

Orion

I guess we know who everyone will be using in the Class of 2017 event then since they're both boosted.

Omega Red

You need to use him with another Guardian in order to make the strike tiles truly effective. In level 9 a champed Grocket is only useful the first handful of trivial nodes. In PVP there's plenty of answers.

Of course he can be abused, but so it was bladedusa and so it will be the next cool toy.

JHawkInc

They're great. They're fast.

But at SCL9 you can go faster with a well-crafted boosted team. I've been playing SCL9, and only use R&G/Gamora on the trivial nodes, because that's the only time they're "undoubtedly" the best option.

rixmith

I don't have a problem with the current R&G. I seldom use them unboosted in PvE. I'm generally happy to see an unboosted R&G + Gamora team show up in PvP or Lightning Rounds and don't hesitate to attack them. They are good and they have their purposes, but I don't feel that they are broken at all.

GrumpySmurf1002

Who are you lunatics using Brocket/Gamora instead of Boosted Carol-Anything?

"First turn cascade usually results in one sometimes 2 members of the other team dyeing before they even get a turn. Just skip people using Thing and Deadpool and walk your way up to 900 with barely any retaliations."

Like:  How?  How are you not seeing 30K+ RHulks and Carols?   Or how are you one-turning that much health with unboosted Brocket?   How are you not being pummeled back by Carol and/or RHulk teams?   

I have many questions.   Brocket's very good, but he's not earth-shattering, and certainly not in the vicinity of nerf-worthy.

DyingLegend

He is fine, once he loses this strike tiles he is super mediocre. I can clear most of them in a few rounds, just have to eat some damage.

I've always had success against him using cloak and dagger. 

STERLING21JJ

DyingLegend said:

He is fine, once he loses this strike tiles he is super mediocre. I can clear most of them in a few rounds, just have to eat some damage.

agreed

j0nats

but grocket4 so fun!!! i would nerf 5thanos tho haha (cos i dont have him)

u shud try 3strange 4grocket and 2bullseye/daken in combined arms.  

jamesh

Didn't Rocket & Groot already get a nerf?  Before the introduction of repeaters, his blue was awesome when paired with Captain Marvel: every turn you'd get a new attack tile and have a bunch of the existing ones buffed.

Dotproduct

BoyWonder1914 said:

I'm not really sure what makes RBG so different from everyone else that gives you a speed advantage. Hell, I made MUCH quicker work of the Kingpin nodes with C&D/C4rol. C&D produces black, and I don't touch them to bait Kingpin or Ock into matching them. 2 or 3 matches and the AOE did all the work.

Yes, with this pairing I finally got to see all the rave with C&D. Mine is only Lv 152 but with the boost they were very usable wiht 4Carol in that manner.

In PvE goon nodes with a required character I tend to go with 4Gammora instead of 4R&G because the 6* blue stun is more valuable in preventing any goon attacks that pass through 3Strange's net.

killercool

Dotproduct said:

BoyWonder1914 said:

I'm not really sure what makes RBG so different from everyone else that gives you a speed advantage. Hell, I made MUCH quicker work of the Kingpin nodes with C&D/C4rol. C&D produces black, and I don't touch them to bait Kingpin or Ock into matching them. 2 or 3 matches and the AOE did all the work.

Yes, with this pairing I finally got to see all the rave with C&D. Mine is only Lv 152 but with the boost they were very usable wiht 4Carol in that manner.

In PvE goon nodes with a required character I tend to go with 4Gammora instead of 4R&G because the 6* blue stun is more valuable in preventing any goon attacks that pass through 3Strange's net.

I have been using Carol with C&D for Webbed Wonder too, but that is only because both are boosted.  I have been using R&G teamed with Gamora and Medusa for clearing all non-essential nodes in PVE for some time before this event, and will go back to it after this event.

Having said that I do not see R&G as an issue in PVP.  You focus on clearing his attack tiles for the first couple of turns and then he is a non-issue.

Phumade

GrumpySmurf1002 said:

Who are you lunatics using Brocket/Gamora instead of Boosted Carol-Anything?

"First turn cascade usually results in one sometimes 2 members of the other team dyeing before they even get a turn. Just skip people using Thing and Deadpool and walk your way up to 900 with barely any retaliations."

Like:  How?  How are you not seeing 30K+ RHulks and Carols?   Or how are you one-turning that much health with unboosted Brocket?   How are you not being pummeled back by Carol and/or RHulk teams?   

I have many questions.   Brocket's very good, but he's not earth-shattering, and certainly not in the vicinity of nerf-worthy.

Hehehe  I think its a roster scaling/mmr issue.  5* rosters see an entirely different meta compared to lower tier rosters.

I know I've broken through the first MMR partition when I start seeing medusa, grocket, gamora teams instead of massive panthos teams.

acescracked

MPQ is hard.

Borstock

mexus said:

His green is not mediocre, his green is amazing.
Lots of free AP and the best AoE in the tier.

Hammer and Anvil is more powerful, and there's no risk of that hitting your own team for ~6k.

Warbringa

While I don't debate the utility of R&G for PvE, I always use them for the easy nodes and goon only nodes, I tend to go with boosted characters more often than naught against AI teams with scaling and match ability.  I have found that R&G can be far less effective when a few of their strike tiles are matched away early.  For example, I have found boosted C&D, Rhulk and Carol to be a much more effective and quicker team against the harder nodes in the most recent PvEs than R&G team.

Now if R&G is boosted, that is a different story.

Warbringa

LavaManLee said:

As others mentioned, 4RG really doesn't need a nerf.  It is specific to PVE and really requires you to also use Gamora or 4StarLord.  In PVP, that is a totally beatable team, no matter who the third character is.  I appreciate they gave us a character to speed through the "boring" rounds and let us go to the actual "thinking" rounds as soon as possible.  It's the PVE experience itself, not the character, that needs a retooling.

Less grinding and more strategy is what is needed. 

In PvP, I really enjoy the combined arms event for this reason.  It makes people attempt to really consider different strategies that we usually don't see.  My preference though would be to change it to two  3* and one 4* as that would provide even more strategy since there are so few 2* options as compared to 3*.