PVP is too hard

Rod5

smkspy said:

Even at 30 4 star champs, yeah, i find pvp to be too hard. I aim for 575-650 but 900 just isn't a realistic goal unless you can afford to shield hop.

Benchmarks would do wonders to make pvp an experience where everyone can participate. There would still be point loss, but once you hit say 750 you don't drop down below that until you hit the next benchmark at 900. 

Dude, that is called PvE. You don't get prog rewards taken away if you fall below a score you've already reached. If you don't use shields, you can't expect to get more than bare minimum rewards. If that is not acceptable to you, stick to PvE..,

smkspy

Dude, I obviously said there would be point loss between benchmarks, so good try there.

spiderpool

smkspy said:

Even at 30 4 star champs, yeah, i find pvp to be too hard. I aim for 575-650 but 900 just isn't a realistic goal unless you can afford to shield hop.

Benchmarks would do wonders to make pvp an experience where everyone can participate. There would still be point loss, but once you hit say 750 you don't drop down below that until you hit the next benchmark at 900. 

I have 27 4* Champs right now and I can't remember the last time I failed to hit 900.  I've been hitting 900 since before I had a single 4* champ and I do it with no sheild hopping. I only use one sheild once I get to 900 for placement and occasionally a 3 hour sheild once I get to around 800 before I come back and hit 900.

Wumpushunter

PVP is only hard because this game has tiny kitty match making, like when you are facing 2 355 5 stars as you have no one over 200 in your rosterm

FokaiHI

OneLastGambit said:

Honestly the best tip I can give to people struggling with PvP is - time it well. If you're 3* or above you can hit 900.

I am a 4* player but every now and then a boosted week comes along where I have no boosted 4s (I don't roster everyone) and I have to make do with the boosted 3s. I play in s1 or s3 (forget s2) so I know it's doable because I actually do it.

PvP is more about timing than anything in my opinion. Start early, climb till youre in t25 then stop, come back later when you have dropped out of t50 and do the same again. This should have you at about 500-650 points..wait. Wait until theres under 24 hours remaining and quickly climb to 900 and shield for 24 hours.

With 4s this strategy is easy, it's tougher with 3s but it can be done - I spent half of last season doing it.

I do this all the time. I have a solid 4* roster though. It really is about timing and letting your queue fill up with meaty points. 

I think S4 is the X-Men alliance and S5 is pretty much top 50 if you score 800+. 

SpringSoldier

Picking slices isn't an option for everyone. Most of us play whenever we have time. I prefer PVE, I find it easier and more relaxing, so I do recommend it to anyone who wants to play semi-casual.

Sm0keyJ0e

SpringSoldier said:

Picking slices isn't an option for everyone. Most of us play whenever we have time. I prefer PVE, I find it easier and more relaxing, so I do recommend it to anyone who wants to play semi-casual.

Ummm, picking slices IS an option for everyone. It's right there when you join--you can pick any end time you like! I recommend joining the last one, slice 5. Zoooooom! Straight to 900, no shield!

Calnexin

SpringSoldier said:

I dislike PVP too- there's nothing like going to bed and waking up to a red screen full of battles your team lost. Even going on lunch break is a risk if you don't want to invest in shielding (not worth the hp for me at this point). It why I prefer PVE- at least here you can never lose progress.

This is the crux for a lot of people struggling in PvP.  There are reasonable limits based on where you're at in the game.  If you're not the type of player who drops wads of cash on the game, hp is precious up until you've developed sources to attain it in-game.  2* farms, champ rewards, and routine placement in PvE are mine.  I can afford to spend hp on shields because I have a stream of it coming in without opening my wallet.

Even once you have an hp "income", it may be more worthwhile to use it on packs or heroes for hire than climbing PvP.  Between the 10 CP @ 575 and the 4* @ 900 you're not missing anything significant - 2 recruit tokens, a 3* cover, 50 hp and 2000 iso.  For me to reach that, I usually have to drop at least three shields (minimum 300 hp, usually about double that).  If the 4* isn't attractive enough to spend 250+ hp to get it, there's no reason to push that high.

Piro_plock

Calnexin said:

Even once you have an hp "income", it may be more worthwhile to use it on packs or heroes for hire than climbing PvP.  Between the 10 CP @ 575 and the 4* @ 900 you're not missing anything significant - 2 recruit tokens, a 3* cover, 50 hp and 2000 iso.  For me to reach that, I usually have to drop at least three shields (minimum 300 hp, usually about double that).  If the 4* isn't attractive enough to spend 250+ hp to get it, there's no reason to push that high.

So you say it's okay to drop 3600HP on HfH, but 250-600HP for shields is too much? Come on.

FokaiHI

@Piro_plock
i think the point was misleading. I think Calnexin meant HFH as an option to not use hp for pvp. I might be wrong. Not everyone is down with the flawed pvp. I'm okay with it, but it could definitely be improved. I.e. Getting smashed by lvl550 over an over

Borstock

I think one thing people need to understand is that there are likely thousands of other players doing exactly the same thing you are doing when you play pvp, and most likely some who are going far beyond what you do and have been doing it for longer. If you're a casual player, or even semi-casual, why would you ever expect that there aren't 10-25 players in your bracket who are playing for hours and hours with a stronger roster and shields? And with that being the case, why do you expect to be able to beat them?

If I'm playing SCL8, at level 100, with my ~30 4*champs, I know I'm in there with a bunch of other players exactly like me and many that are way more powerful with more time to play. Why should I feel entitled to finish t10 just because I won 25-30 battles and got to 900 pts somewhere in that timeframe? Those other players are doing the same thing I'm doing.

Megdar

You gotta love someone starting a complain thread and never getting back at it lol

Milk Jugz

I go slice 1, have just over half the 4* champed and have no problem getting 900. The only time I don't make 900 is when RL gets in the way. Start about 4-5 hours into the event climb to 575-650. Shield for 24 hours, if you want it's not necessary here just have to put in a little extra work on your final climb if you don't shield. With about 20-24 hours left climb to 900 and shield out. Works every time for me.

EDIT: You'll notice I said nothing about coordinating on LINE in battle chats or anything. I do none of that, the only consideration I make on PVP is not hitting people in my alliance (sometimes, when I notice the name..... Oops!!). Other than that I hit what is in my queue and don't talk to anybody about shielded/unshielded, hops, grills, etc. I play PVP solo

Beer40

luckyday said:

I try to play in PVP events, but I always go against teams that are way too difficult for me.  Im a day 942 player and still can't use my 4* 's because they are not strong enough.  My bread and butter are the 3*'s.  I have a few 5*'s but the teams Im up against have their 5*'s way stronger than mine, at most of have 3 powers but in PVP they have like 6 or more.  I hate playing PVP.

Is this a new "auto create thread" feature? The OP made their first post, didn't really explain their roster too well, and has not re-entered the convo. Its basically become the PVP is easy vs PVP is hard debate among the factions.

Question for the "PVP is hard" group: Do you play PVE? If so, I'm guessing that the last 1-2 nodes for you are similar to every PVP battle you face once you've beaten them the first few times. So PVP is like the end of every PVE event, except every match. Is that hard? If so, then you also find PVE hard too, which means you probably just find the game hard in general.

OR, you only play PVE to the point that it gets hard and quit (far less than max prog)? Well, you can play PVP the same way too and save WAY more time. Enter events at the beginning, knock off the seed teams, take your 100-200 points, and you're done. The same way you only partially play PVE.

I'm just trying to guess why anyone thinks PVP is hard...its the same match 3 game that PVE is, only with higher scaled opponents consistently. They're still beatable. Sure, it may take longer than facing three level 30 Goons, but that's part of the vs P. 

I'm not trying to be rude, but if anything is "hard" in a match 3 game then you're probably doing something wrong, or have unrealistic expectations of your goals. Everyone can play baseball. Not everyone gets to be Mike Trout. MOST everyone who plays baseball doesn't even come near MLB, much less being the best player. Just because you can look on a stat sheet and see what the top looks like, doesn't mean its yours to be had.

/rant over

P.S. I don't like the PVP set up much either, I just can't get behind the notion that its "hard".

Calnexin

Piro_plock said:

Calnexin said:

Even once you have an hp "income", it may be more worthwhile to use it on packs or heroes for hire than climbing PvP.  Between the 10 CP @ 575 and the 4* @ 900 you're not missing anything significant - 2 recruit tokens, a 3* cover, 50 hp and 2000 iso.  For me to reach that, I usually have to drop at least three shields (minimum 300 hp, usually about double that).  If the 4* isn't attractive enough to spend 250+ hp to get it, there's no reason to push that high.

So you say it's okay to drop 3600HP on HfH, but 250-600HP for shields is too much? Come on.

Absolutely, if it's for a character you want.  If your roster isn't strong, spending that HP is a risk with no guarantee you'll ever get to 900.  If you try it for an entire season with mixed results, you would have had enough HP for one guaranteed cover you actually want with no effort.

If you're not in a place where you can comfortably roster every new character and drop 600 hp per event on shields, HfH may be the more attractive place to spend HP.  It's targeted, guaranteed, and cycles faster than character event rotation.

rixmith

Beer40, my guess is that the OP didn't mean that PvP matches were "hard", but that the PvP metagame is "hard". Understanding climbs, hops, and float points; knowing when to shield (and being willing to spend the HP), when it is worth lots of ISO to skip, coordinating with others on external tools like LINE; and losing tons of points when you don't do all of these things correctly... that is hard, and for some players who just want to play matches and get progression awards, not particularly fun.

Unfortunately, it is hard enough to progress in this game even when you do play PvE. PvP, DDQ and LRs, For people who find the PvP metagame unappealing, it becomes doubly difficult to better your team and assist your alliance.

Beer40

rixmith said:

Beer40, my guess is that the OP didn't mean that PvP matches were "hard", but that the PvP metagame is "hard". Understanding climbs, hops, and float points; knowing when to shield (and being willing to spend the HP), when it is worth lots of ISO to skip, coordinating with others on external tools like LINE; and losing tons of points when you don't do all of these things correctly... that is hard, and for some players who just want to play matches and get progression awards, not particularly fun.

Unfortunately, it is hard enough to progress in this game even when you do play PvE. PvP, DDQ and LRs, For people who find the PvP metagame unappealing, it becomes doubly difficult to better your team and assist your alliance.

Fair enough point. Instead of arguing about the dynamics of PVP, I'll just suggest to anyone who finds it hard (meta game or otherwise) to think about shifting your focus. Try one of these two ideas instead:

1) Play as many matches as you can, whenever you can, each PVP event. Don't worry about progression/placement. ISO is in short supply the better your roster gets. Use these matches to farm ISO. (Hint: You're eventually going to hit a spot where you'd rather have ISO than that 4* cover, trust me)

2) Try to block out a piece of time each PVP event and climb as far as your roster allows. That's your progression. That's where your roster is probably meant to be. Anything else is gravy. At that point, for the rest of the event, play as often/as much as you like as detailed in plan 1.

You don't need to be part of the meta game, you're saving your gold for roster slots, and you're positioning your roster to not waste covers when you hit the eventual ISO crunch.