I'm happy with one improvement

Beer40

The improvement I'm happy with is: the game changes coming out before VIP renewal time.

A little context for you all, perhaps?

I have been a VIP since it started. Since then, many changes to the game have occurred. I've liked a few but have been on the dislike side of far more of them. My biggest complaint has always been that it seems these changes occur within a few days after my VIP renewal.

Now you say, why renew? Well, like I said, I'd already renewed...and 20+ days has a way of taking the sting out. Especially since some changes are good and some I don't like are minor to my overall experience.

This time tho!!! My VIP ends tomorrow. Extra PVE clears to reach progression, higher price point for HfH store, only reversing some of the team up tile nerfs, customer service that is actually getting worse (I didn't think it was possible, but I have proof if anyone actually cares/needs a laugh), and lack of a statement regarding our concerns with Vaulting.

Those are 5 things that I don't like. The last 3 are not deal breakers for me. But the first two? 

I'm just glad something like this happened a few days before I renew, not a few after. Thanks!

Daiches

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Dragon_Nexus

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

Alsmir

Dragon_Nexus said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

The main point of HfH store is 4* cover, not the extra garbage. If I'm going to purchase that cover I want to buy it as cheap as possible, not pay extra for resources that I can get daily without an issue.

Style55

Dragon_Nexus said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

I'm too sure people are lining up to buy the new and improved HFH package, since you know, the elite covers have such an astonishingly high pull rate of 2* covers. I mean 1100HP for 2x as much 2* covers, yay.

Style55

My VIP expires in 2 days and I am really reluctant to renew it this time. For me the two that really irk me are the new 5x clears in PVE to reach max progression because doing 4x and spending 1.5~2 hours on each sub event wasn't bad enough. Also the HFH price increase and reason given for that extra 1100HP charge.

CaptainFosco

Yeah, I'm not renewing this time. I intended not to last month after the OML nerf, but I managed to autopilot through the renewal process as I was so used to renewing immediately for the legendary. But that delicious purple token won't entice me this time. It would probably have been my 90th Agent Venom anyway. 

Bowgentle

CaptainFosco said:

Yeah, I'm not renewing this time. I intended not to last month after the OML nerf, but I managed to autopilot through the renewal process as I was so used to renewing immediately for the legendary. But that delicious purple token won't entice me this time. It would probably have been my 90th Agent Venom anyway. 

He must be pretty awesome at level 360 unbuffed, I want those 90 levels too.

Fightmastermpq

Style55 said:

Dragon_Nexus said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

I'm too sure people are lining up to buy the new and improved HFH package, since you know, the elite covers have such an astonishingly high pull rate of 2* covers. I mean 1100HP for 2x as much 2* covers, yay.

You are probably right, but that HfH purchase is maybe the most efficient way to turn HP into ISO and a small bit of CP.  There are a lot of competitive players pulling in more HP than they know what to do with, but ISO seems to always be in short supply - HfH might be a good option for them.

Beer40

Fightmastermpq said:

Style55 said:

Dragon_Nexus said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

I'm too sure people are lining up to buy the new and improved HFH package, since you know, the elite covers have such an astonishingly high pull rate of 2* covers. I mean 1100HP for 2x as much 2* covers, yay.

You are probably right, but that HfH purchase is maybe the most efficient way to turn HP into ISO and a small bit of CP.  There are a lot of competitive players pulling in more HP than they know what to do with, but ISO seems to always be in short supply - HfH might be a good option for them.

I put the word "good" in bold. That might be going a little far. It is definitely an option, though. I guess we'll all see how good it is by seeing if it makes it thru the 3rd cover cycle. My guess is that it won't, and we'll see a new system in place, but that's just a guess. 

MissChinch

Beer40 said:

Fightmastermpq said:

Style55 said:

Dragon_Nexus said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

Honestly, in comparison...the newer price point is a better bang for your buck.
2500 gave you 5000 ISO and 4 elites. This new one gives double that for less than double the cost.

I'm too sure people are lining up to buy the new and improved HFH package, since you know, the elite covers have such an astonishingly high pull rate of 2* covers. I mean 1100HP for 2x as much 2* covers, yay.

You are probably right, but that HfH purchase is maybe the most efficient way to turn HP into ISO and a small bit of CP.  There are a lot of competitive players pulling in more HP than they know what to do with, but ISO seems to always be in short supply - HfH might be a good option for them.

I put the word "good" in bold. That might be going a little far. It is definitely an option, though. I guess we'll all see how good it is by seeing if it makes it thru the 3rd cover cycle. My guess is that it won't, and we'll see a new system in place, but that's just a guess. 

There aren't any super appealing uses for HP, once you've got as many roster spots as you need, you're left to either amass it for no real good reason of spend it...  and honestly every option feels like poor value, getting a guaranteed specific 4* cover is gonna be a reasonable option...   3600HP is only "bad" if we have the option of getting the 4* for 2500HP...

The removal of intercepts combined with the increase in ISO and HP in the DDQ is a gain for players that pay, gain for free players that didn't watch intercepts and a loss for free players that did watch the intercepts....  the change to progression amounts to more work for the same amount of CP, but with some more little rewards sprinkled in...

Beer40

MissChinch said:

The removal of intercepts combined with the increase in ISO and HP in the DDQ is a gain for players that pay, gain for free players that didn't watch intercepts and a loss for free players that did watch the intercepts....  the change to progression amounts to more work for the same amount of CP, but with some more little rewards sprinkled in...

Yea, I liked that us VIPs were getting more of an advantage over the FTPers finally. 

That kind of goes hand in hand with my post though. I'll see an announcement like that and say, "Ok, that's a positive. I'll drop my $10 down this month again". And then, usually a few days later, I'll see "You have to put more time in PVE now. Also, getting that 4* you want is going to cost more". And then the net positive turns into a negative and I'm like, "Why did I spend money to support this game again?".

I really mean it when I say I'm happy they announced this all right before VIPs came up. Give us the good and the bad all at once and let us make an informed decision how to proceed.

And this isn't directed at your quote, but I'm already typing so I'll throw it in here: These changes being bad enough to make me quit VIP are simply my opinion based on my roster and play style. I can totally see the points of view that think they're great changes. Anyway, I just collected my 1500 ISO so now its time to remember what it was like pre-VIP.

Vhailorx

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

This misses the point.  More rewards for those who grind 6/6 already is great.  Long overdue.

The problem is that demi also made grinding 2-4/6 substantially less rewarding that it was previously.  Once again demi takes a step forward and one (or two depending on perspective) big steps backwards.  You cant just ignore the negative changes and praise the positive ones.

Crnch73

I completely agree that I am glad they made these terrible changes at the "right" time. Every bad decision has irked me more and more. It may just be unique to me and my experience, but the changes have really negatively affected my roster and gameplay. My interest is waning, and I just bought a new PS4 game that has piqued my interest. I can feel the pull towards the console and away from the phone. This may be the first time in my history of playing MPQ that I am looking forward to playing any other game more than I look forward to playing this one.

I really hope a new change that makes us happy is coming. I truly would love to get "sucked back" into this game. But at the current pace of bad ideas and bad changes, I can honestly see myself quitting in a few months.

Hotnfresh

So far it is NOT a gain to paying players. The resource increases are a LOSS compared to intercepts. Being a paying player, I see 2-5 daily bonus' now compared to over double that previously. Also, so far, most are 500 ISO or 10 HP. Before, I'd see 2000 ISO and 25/100 HP fairly often. VIP is now pointless, unsubbing.

MissChinch

Beer40 said:

MissChinch said:

The removal of intercepts combined with the increase in ISO and HP in the DDQ is a gain for players that pay, gain for free players that didn't watch intercepts and a loss for free players that did watch the intercepts....  the change to progression amounts to more work for the same amount of CP, but with some more little rewards sprinkled in...

Yea, I liked that us VIPs were getting more of an advantage over the FTPers finally. 

That kind of goes hand in hand with my post though. I'll see an announcement like that and say, "Ok, that's a positive. I'll drop my $10 down this month again". And then, usually a few days later, I'll see "You have to put more time in PVE now. Also, getting that 4* you want is going to cost more". And then the net positive turns into a negative and I'm like, "Why did I spend money to support this game again?".

I really mean it when I say I'm happy they announced this all right before VIPs came up. Give us the good and the bad all at once and let us make an informed decision how to proceed.

And this isn't directed at your quote, but I'm already typing so I'll throw it in here: These changes being bad enough to make me quit VIP are simply my opinion based on my roster and play style. I can totally see the points of view that think they're great changes. Anyway, I just collected my 1500 ISO so now its time to remember what it was like pre-VIP.

I didn't mean for that to be contradictory to your post, I just stuck it in there to show that while most are just seeing it as a blanket improvement, its not really that, its trying to incentivize paying money and removing the means of getting the reward for those that don't pay....  Its a small deal compared to what they've recently done, but its not accurate to gloss over and just say we get more resources.

Its none of my business, but I'd toss out the idea of only spending the $2 or whatever purchase to still get node rewards as an option.

MissChinch

Hotnfresh said:

So far it is NOT a gain to paying players. The resource increases are a LOSS compared to intercepts. Being a paying player, I see 2-5 daily bonus' now compared to over double that previously. Also, so far, most are 500 ISO or 10 HP. Before, I'd see 2000 ISO and 25/100 HP fairly often. VIP is now pointless, unsubbing.

I think the idea is that:

(new paid node reward system) < (old intercept rewards) 

HOWEVER:

((new paid node reward system) + (increased amount in DDQ)) > (old intercept rewards)

I asked for specific limits/distribution for both systems in the announcement thread, without it we'll never really know. (I'm very much NOT expecting a response in that thread, or at all for that matter)

Ducky

*off to feedback*

Daiches

Vhailorx said:

Daiches said:

Ha.. They made 2 changes where we get more resources for doing the exact same thing as we would normally do. If that doesn't say renew VIP, I don't know what does.

Only negative change since last VIP was HFH store price, but since I already had the 3600 price point (but no preview), it actually got a bit better (because of the preview now). Still wish I had gotten the unfair price advantage others had with the 1100 discount, but it's a store option, so not that bad.

This misses the point.  More rewards for those who grind 6/6 already is great.  Long overdue.

The problem is that demi also made grinding 2-4/6 substantially less rewarding that it was previously.  Once again demi takes a step forward and one (or two depending on perspective) big steps backwards.  You cant just ignore the negative changes and praise the positive ones.

Hence why I said "more for what we normally do". I grind every single PVE from the start to dust. I get more now. I'm buying VIP for ME, not for every casual out there. If they want to feel the same way as I do about the change, let them take out 15 more minutes in 24h to do that fifth clear (or better 5-6-7 on the trivials and essential. Probably same effect as doing 5 on all depending on the event).
If you can't do it, I genuinely feel for you as going from 25cp to 8cp is quite rough, and it must really suck. But it's not as if they suddenly require you to perform a Herculean task. People who are missing an essential have it worse than 4cclearmaximum players, but those can't fix it by spending a few more minutes. It's fine to be casual as long as you are ok with casual rewards. If you aren't, you will never be happy.

Vhailorx

Daiches:

You say "it's fine to be casual as long you are ok with casual rewards."

Thanks for giving everyone permission to be casual!    But you are sort of ignoring the fact that casual rewards just got worse.  So while it's ok to be casual, it is it also ok for demi to pull the rug out fron under casual players?  'Cos that's what just happened.

(Disclaimer: cp and iso are the most prized resources for me, so i generally played the minimum amount of pve to get max prog.  I also played pvp to 900 because i can't stand the shield cooldown mechanic and don't want to bother with the hassle of 1.2k anymore.  Going from 4/6 to 5/6 will add a non-trivial amount of time, but is hardly an insurmountable hurdle for me.  Take that bias/perspective fwiw.)

Felonius

I feel you, @Beer40...  Today my VIP came up for renewal, and for the first time since it's inception, I hesitated...  I haven't renewed.  I'm giving it a "cool down" period, to consider if I want to. 

On one hand... $10 bucks means little to me in the grand scheme of my life.  In a general sense, I do not have any issue with paying for a video game (why when I was a kid we had to pay $0.25 each time!), and I play MPQ a lot (damn you addiction!  lol), so I used to be happy to support the company. 

But these last couple months, issues have grown to make me take pause.  There's the handling of Vaulting (or in my opinion, lack thereof), OML Nerf, continued unaddressed bugs, etc.  And those are just the flat out Bad Things.

Even when they add positive features to the game, they're tarnishing it with negativity... Bonus Heroes were great, but Vaulting, ick!  HfH Store: Finally an option to Direct-Buy 4* covers, but IMHO I thought 2400 was too much, now 3600 takes it way to high to be of interest to me (YMMV, and that's fine)....   Add more rewards to DDQ, but that's because Shield Intercepts were taken away (well, honestly, I was getting SI for free w/VIP, so if I keep VIP, I'm actually getting a net positive on this, but the fact it was done because they fudged-up something again... well... just another blunder).  And now more PvE prizes, Yay!  But requires more work, Boo!  (...Well, ok, again, I usually do full six clears, so probably nothing but an improvement for me, but again, it's their way of thinking I don't like, ergo tarnished...)

So, I dunno... I expect I will renew VIP one more time, but it's no longer an easy thing to do.  If things continue being "bad", it will get more likely that I won't renew the next time, and so on, until I finally do stop.