Money poorly spent!

killwind
killwind Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
in MtGPQ General Discussion
 This is in reference to the money a lot of us have spent in the previous 2 blocks that are now not playable. Are you really okay with having spent money on cards that you cant use now? Olivia, GnG, Ulrich and Drowner? Not just the P2W cards but the entire block is now unusable some have spent real world currency to purchase ingame currency.to buy packs.

  Im trying to wrap my head around that logic. But lets follow that line of logic.

   If you purchase the next P2W card will you be happy knowing that in a few months that initial outflow of cash will have been wasted? Think about it, you buy some high end toy and yes I know the immediate gratification is there, what about long term?   You just purchased the top end set of head phones for example, there is nothing wrong with them but  the company disables the wifi and blue tooth options ( a hypothetical kill option to the firmware) the manufacturer then tells you thank you for your purchase, but we have a new set that you can purchase? 

  I am not okay with this!

  
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Comments

  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    Depends on what they make the long-term rotation schedule like. I feel like BFZ was made with big, scary creatures because the paper set had big, scary creatures in it in the form of the Eldrazi. I think following that, they didn't think SOI could compete with the massive monsters from Zendikar and so the WAY upped the power level in order to give players a way to deal with it. Then noticing the massive power creep, the scaled back for Kaladesh, and returned to a more Origins power level for Amonkhet.

    Obviously both blocks will eventually rotate out, and Kaladesh will likely be cycled as soon as Aztalan comes out as it was a more intermediary power level. However, once that's the case, there may not be as much of a pressing reason to rotate out Amonkhet as soon as the block following Aztalan launches and sets might possible stick around longer. Either way, the cards are still valid in PvE events and Training Grounds. They may have lost usefulness in other more competitive environments, but they're not gone forever, they've just been retired to more casual play.

    But more, I look at it this way: I spend $60 on a new video game and get enjoyment out of it for a time before I'm bored with it or it gets replaced with something else (this is true for me with my general Magic decks) at which point I spent money buying the next shiny new title and play with that for a while. Same concept applies here. If you bought one of these cards, do you feel like you got enjoyment out of playing them for the time given? If not, maybe scrutinize the next paid card to hit the marketplace a little more, now knowing it has a limited shelf life in competitive environments, and determine if the cost is worth the enjoyment for you.
  • James13
    James13 Posts: 665 Critical Contributor
    If you choose to spend money on in game currency or goods within a mobile app you don't get to dictate wether that app stays open forever, wether powercreep would render your purchase obsolete down the road, that it's no longer bound by the whims of the game development team, or whatever else.  I'm a little confused that you would expect a purchase in a mobile game to be what you seem to describe in equating it with store bought physical goods.

    It seems like a breathtakingly naive stance you're staking out there.  I can tell you for certain that at some point your card purchases will be completely unusable.  What you buy is the satisfaction of using them in the moment more akin to say going to a movie or out to dinner.  A transitory thing.  Everyone has to use their own calculus to determine wether the immediate fun is worth the money.  That's what you are buying.  Not headphones.
  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    EDHdad said:
    Actually, I am enjoying the Olivia-free aspect of this event.  Not crazy about all the Hixus Prison Wardens kicking around, but I'll probably feel better about those once I pull the new 4-mana green support destruction spell.
    Creeping Mold is still legal, though it costs a lot more. Might be worth it with the resurgence he's seen.
  • EDHdad
    EDHdad Posts: 609 Critical Contributor
    @wereotter- true, but the green spell also has cycling, so it's not a dead card if the opponent has no supports.  Also, I was fortunate enough to pull New Perspectives, so my Standard "cycling matters" deck in this event could use it (it has additional synergy with Day's Undoing).
  • Volrak
    Volrak Posts: 732 Critical Contributor
    killwind said:

       If you purchase the next P2W card will you be happy knowing that in a few months that initial outflow of cash will have been wasted?
    As well as the points others have made, those purchases enabled you to gather resources (e.g. crystals, hoarded packs) more effectively than if you didn't have those power cards.  Those resources are giving you a head-start in AKH, and that will in turn will help you be more prepared when KLD rotates out than someone who didn't make purchases back in BFZ and SOI blocks, and so on.  In other words, those purchases are still indirectly giving a real boost to your competitiveness now, and will continue to do so for as long as you play (albeit with decreasing impact), even if you are no longer able to use those cards in decks.
  • killwind
    killwind Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    The point was not headphones.

      Lets look at this a bit like a subscription game then, You pay monthly 15$-24$ per month then pay for the DLC's and expansions. But at no point do you lose access to the older content. While the game is based on MTG to think that this mobile app is in the same category as the card game is a poor assumption. Yes some cards and some game mechanics are similar enough but that is where the comparison should end. 

      Step back again when have they ever stated that they would discontinue access to cards? Is it a new thing did I miss it? If its a recent thing I could have missed it. But I cant recall them ever saying that this was going to happen in previous releases.
  • Sarahschmara
    Sarahschmara Posts: 554 Critical Contributor
    killwind said:
    The point was not headphones.

      Lets look at this a bit like a subscription game then, You pay monthly 15$-24$ per month then pay for the DLC's and expansions. But at no point do you lose access to the older content. While the game is based on MTG to think that this mobile app is in the same category as the card game is a poor assumption. Yes some cards and some game mechanics are similar enough but that is where the comparison should end. 

      Step back again when have they ever stated that they would discontinue access to cards? Is it a new thing did I miss it? If its a recent thing I could have missed it. But I cant recall them ever saying that this was going to happen in previous releases.
    Actually, yeah, sometimes you do.

    Blizzard nerfed a lot of things during my WoW days and Cataclysm absolutely and irrevocably changed the landscape of the Barrens. But I can certainly understand how the transient nature of digital media (which is never truly owned, only borrowed) can feel unfair to someone new to gaming.
  • killwind
    killwind Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    Well I certainly am new to Mobile app gaming but not to gaming or even online gaming. The online games that I played ( going to date myself here ) Ultima Online, Everquest, Asherons Call, Darkage of Camelot did not ever block old content (I did not like WoW no pvp on release). I stayed with DAoC from Beta until they killed the PvP server. I never saw discontinued content.

      I dont know maybe I am spoiled but I am not used to the taste of mediocrity! 
  • Sarahschmara
    Sarahschmara Posts: 554 Critical Contributor
    I think it's OK to be scared of change @killwind
  • killwind
    killwind Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    lol, not scared of change. But I dont like to be blind sided!
  • James13
    James13 Posts: 665 Critical Contributor
    Does the physical card game banning cards and removing sets from tournament play, regardless of people buying those, also come as a surprise?
  • Sarahschmara
    Sarahschmara Posts: 554 Critical Contributor
    I get that!

    But I guess we're all just a bit confused why you didn't anticipate this? I know you took some time off for a while--and we're glad you've returned (especially since we no longer have to face your decks!). But you seem a bit... out of touch?
  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    They didn't say so before selling Baral, so for that point I think you're right to be upset, but they did announce the change to standard a couple weeks (I think?) before implementing it.

    its been an adjustment to be certain, but all in all I like it. I'll probably still buy mythic cards if I think they look fun to play, it'll just be with the realization that in time, they'll have limited use.
  • Ohboy
    Ohboy Posts: 1,766 Chairperson of the Boards
    killwind said:
     This is in reference to the money a lot of us have spent in the previous 2 blocks that are now not playable. Are you really okay with having spent money on cards that you cant use now? Olivia, GnG, Ulrich and Drowner? Not just the P2W cards but the entire block is now unusable some have spent real world currency to purchase ingame currency.to buy packs.

      Im trying to wrap my head around that logic. But lets follow that line of logic.

       If you purchase the next P2W card will you be happy knowing that in a few months that initial outflow of cash will have been wasted? Think about it, you buy some high end toy and yes I know the immediate gratification is there, what about long term?   You just purchased the top end set of head phones for example, there is nothing wrong with them but  the company disables the wifi and blue tooth options ( a hypothetical kill option to the firmware) the manufacturer then tells you thank you for your purchase, but we have a new set that you can purchase? 

      I am not okay with this!

      

    If we're going to use your analogy, we should note that built-to-fail has been a strategy for decades. 

    Your headphones are already crippled the moment it rolls off the line. 

    https://www.google.com.sg/amp/www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gmp202/planned-obsolescence-460210/


  • killwind
    killwind Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    If they are rotating the set out then why are they still giving us the packs in the daily reward, I just got another pack of SOI thanks!
  • Azerack
    Azerack Posts: 501 Critical Contributor
    killwind said:
    Well I certainly am new to Mobile app gaming but not to gaming or even online gaming. The online games that I played ( going to date myself here ) Ultima Online, Everquest, Asherons Call, Darkage of Camelot did not ever block old content (I did not like WoW no pvp on release). I stayed with DAoC from Beta until they killed the PvP server. I never saw discontinued content.

      I dont know maybe I am spoiled but I am not used to the taste of mediocrity! 
    You stayed with DAoC? Wow, you were one of the hangers-on! (Wife and I only lasted about 3 months with it... But I digress..)

    I think of it more like consoles.. Sure you can play lots of games on it, they aren't that great, sometimes, but you still have them. Then when the new version of the console comes out it plays some games but not others. What do you do with the ones you can't play? You get an emulator!  :)

    Yeah, you have new games but sometimes you like remembering the ones you spent money on so you play them for a bit, but ultimately you move on.

    For me, Olivia will be missed, but in the TG, I've found the entertaining bug about her giving the +3/+3 twice, not just once. It seems like she's trying to say she's going to go out with a bang. (At least until the devs fix that..  ;))

    Anyway, time to move on. Remember, "This too, shall pass... "
  • span_argoman
    span_argoman Posts: 751 Critical Contributor
    Hearthstone, the leader of the mobile card game category, initially didn't but now has card rotation. MTG has card rotation.

    Android: Netrunner and all the other card games by that same publisher Fantasy Flight Games initially didn't have rotation. Then they realised what an impossible task it was going to be balancing new cards against the constantly growing library of existing cards. So now they all have rotation too.

    I think it's part of the nature of cars games that either they die out before they need rotation or they survive long enough to require rotation. If you're a new upstart card game you don't announce that you will start rotating cards in 2 years' time. The majority of them don't even last that long.

    And yeah like people said, just factor in that the card will only be Standard-legal for 5 - 12 months (depending on which point in the cycle you buy it). It will still be playable in PvE and legacy PvP events.
  • andrewvanmarle
    andrewvanmarle Posts: 978 Critical Contributor
    I cant get rid of this quote box

    @wickedwitch74:

    The two main differences with paper magic: you cant sell your cards for cash, you cant trade but the cards -can- be rebalaced without reprinting. 

    Knowing that my cards will be useless in coalition play in less than 6 months makes me not want to spend more, it makes me spend less since I'm not gonna waste cash on something THAT ephemeral. 

    (Btw hearthstone has a much slower rotation rate) 

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