Clearance Levels

UnsmashableTim
UnsmashableTim Posts: 81 Match Maker
in MPQ General Discussion
Where the eff are clearance levels 9 and 10??

I asked Mpq and they won't tell me LOL

Just wish there was some kind of time frame... 
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Comments

  • DapperChewie
    DapperChewie Posts: 399 Mover and Shaker
    The devs have said that there are not enough people playing at what will be SCL9 and 10 levels to fill out enough brackets yet. 

    They'll get here once more people get leveled higher. 
  • Punisher5784
    Punisher5784 Posts: 3,845 Chairperson of the Boards
    Now that Vaulting exists, players will develop 4*s faster allowing them to be able to compete in higher CLs.. hopefully we see 9 soon as we need some positivity
  • Alsmir
    Alsmir Posts: 508 Critical Contributor
    Punisher5784 said:
    Now that Vaulting exists, players will develop 4*s faster allowing them to be able to compete in higher CLs.. hopefully we see 9 soon as we need some positivity
    I have no intention of playing CL8 with 3* roster.
    I dropped to CL7 in PvP, then I realised that 900 prog is out of reach and heroics give me better odds than event tokens, so I'm dropping all the way to CL6 for the nearby future.

    Carol's PvE convinced me to drop to CL7 in PvE so at least I get a shot at some HP from placement.

    The system clearly works, right?
  • Pessi
    Pessi Posts: 170 Tile Toppler
    After playing in SCL7 for the last two events I don't see any point in going up anyway. 

    Its ridiculous that top 20 is easily within my grasp in CL7 where as I'd be looking at top 100 for CL8 for practically the same progression rewards.
  • Phumade
    Phumade Posts: 2,495 Chairperson of the Boards
    Alsmir said:
    Punisher5784 said:
    Now that Vaulting exists, players will develop 4*s faster allowing them to be able to compete in higher CLs.. hopefully we see 9 soon as we need some positivity
    I have no intention of playing CL8 with 3* roster.
    I dropped to CL7 in PvP, then I realised that 900 prog is out of reach and heroics give me better odds than event tokens, so I'm dropping all the way to CL6 for the nearby future.

    Carol's PvE convinced me to drop to CL7 in PvE so at least I get a shot at some HP from placement.

    The system clearly works, right?
    In your case, it probably worked exactly as designed.  One of the users did an analysis of the CL, prizes and avg placements.  I think with his mid-level 4* roster, he determined that SCL6 was the optimum clearance level that generated the most prizes.

    The general rule of thumb on scl placements is that you should be in the highest clearance level that you can consistently place in the Top10.  This will generate the largest number of prizes that you can effectively use.

    Just because your eligibile to play in a SCL doesn't mean that you should play in that tier

    @Jack0fAllGames  may still have the original charts on that research.

  • SnowcaTT
    SnowcaTT Posts: 3,486 Chairperson of the Boards


    More SCL's could really solve a -lot- of in-game problems...and they could have months ago. Instead, these problems linger.
  • carrion_pigeons
    carrion_pigeons Posts: 942 Critical Contributor
    Yeah, the concern about filling brackets is just an excuse.  The game design that pits players in widely different tiers against each other is *exactly* what SCL was put into the game to fix, and that fact that their rewards scheme is broken means that SCL actually makes the problem worse for everyone who's finished the 3* transition, which is a lot of people.

    The real problem with PvE, though, is the slowly rising level of grinding required to make progression.  I don't honestly care about placement rewards, but they're actively changing the amount of participation required for the progression rewards too, and it's an irritating trend.
  • BlackIC
    BlackIC Posts: 65 Match Maker
    PvP makes no sense. I am in groups with maxed 5* and I have 5* at a very low level. Ugh.
  • wymtime
    wymtime Posts: 3,758 Chairperson of the Boards
    The reality with CL is they have enough players who play PVE to add CL9 which will unclog a lot of rewards but also speed up a lot of players accumulation of 4*.  Adding an extra CL will allow an extra top 5 for each time slice.  PVE is getting clogged up with players and could use the extra CL.

    For PVP I don't think there are enough players who really play for placement in PVP.  If they added another CL you would just get more CL 9 players moving down to CL6-8 to take top placement.  If the game forced you into your to CL then you could really separate the playerbase.  What you would then have though is CL 6,7, or 8 really light on players.  Right now more players go down in CL to earn prizes rather that play CL8 because they don't want to compete with top players
  • Ezrius
    Ezrius Posts: 150 Tile Toppler
    mohio said:
    wymtime said:

    For PVP I don't think there are enough players who really play for placement in PVP.  If they added another CL you would just get more CL 9 players moving down to CL6-8 to take top placement.
    That's why they have to make the CL9 rewards worth it. Maybe another 4* cover in progression. Maybe extend 4* cover rewards all the way to top 100. Whatever it is has to be good enough to convince people they should be there as opposed to somewhere else they can take top placement easier. This is why most people view CL8 as a failure, the incentives over CL7 are not really there. 6 to 7 is a big difference with 4* progression cover, they need to do something similar in CL9 to get people to play it.
    That sounds like a bit of a dream, given exactly what you're saying about CL8.  If they couldn't even expand 4* rewards to the top 20 in CL8, there's no way they'd budge any further than top 50 in CL9, if they even do that.  Hate to be so pessimistic, but they haven't really given me reason to feel otherwise.
  • smkspy
    smkspy Posts: 2,024 Chairperson of the Boards
    I find it hard to believe that they don't have enough players for at least scl 9. Judging my experience alone (and that's all I have to go on), I just qualified for scl 8 when it rolled out and since then have advanced to level 88. I can only imagine the number of players well pastrewuired number. 
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    Phumade said:
    Alsmir said:
    Punisher5784 said:
    Now that Vaulting exists, players will develop 4*s faster allowing them to be able to compete in higher CLs.. hopefully we see 9 soon as we need some positivity
    I have no intention of playing CL8 with 3* roster.
    I dropped to CL7 in PvP, then I realised that 900 prog is out of reach and heroics give me better odds than event tokens, so I'm dropping all the way to CL6 for the nearby future.

    Carol's PvE convinced me to drop to CL7 in PvE so at least I get a shot at some HP from placement.

    The system clearly works, right?
    In your case, it probably worked exactly as designed.  One of the users did an analysis of the CL, prizes and avg placements.  I think with his mid-level 4* roster, he determined that SCL6 was the optimum clearance level that generated the most prizes.

    The general rule of thumb on scl placements is that you should be in the highest clearance level that you can consistently place in the Top10.  This will generate the largest number of prizes that you can effectively use.

    Just because your eligibile to play in a SCL doesn't mean that you should play in that tier

    @Jack0fAllGames  may still have the original charts on that research.

    Mostly agree with this.  The problem would be if everyone did actually play where they "should" then there would be too many top end players in the higher clearance levels and would ultimately create a new meta-game around bracket sniping and coordination.  They need 3* rosters to fill out the CL8 brackets to keep vets playing there, and so they just open them up far sooner than they should.

    If they aren't going to push rewards further down the tree in higher clearance levels they should really just make the brackets smaller for those levels.
  • JackTenrec
    JackTenrec Posts: 808 Critical Contributor
    The SCL system (like bonus heroes) looks good on paper but is more or less broken in practice.  I had barely started to champ 4* when vaulting came into play, which means that T10 placement with my roster is impossible in SCL 8 -- and green-check clears (admittedly not fully optimal) don't even guarantee T100. I can sometimes get within spitting distance of T10 in SCL 7, but this just means that I'm poaching from players who are even further behind me in roster development.

    It doesn't matter if there aren't enough players in SCL 9 to be competitive. Those players are already grabbing all the rewards that would exist in this hypothetical SCL, but the players who should truly be placed in SCL 8 and get those rewards are being shut out.
  • fmftint
    fmftint Posts: 3,653 Chairperson of the Boards
    If they don't have enough players to fill SCL 9/10 the answer is simple, and I've suggested on several occasions, reduce bracket size!
    SCL 9 200 players
    SCL 10 100 players
  • mohio
    mohio Posts: 1,690 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmastermpq said:

    Mostly agree with this.  The problem would be if everyone did actually play where they "should" then there would be too many top end players in the higher clearance levels and would ultimately create a new meta-game around bracket sniping and coordination.  They need 3* rosters to fill out the CL8 brackets to keep vets playing there, and so they just open them up far sooner than they should.

    If they aren't going to push rewards further down the tree in higher clearance levels they should really just make the brackets smaller for those levels.
    There already is bracket coordination and sniping at the higher levels in both PvP and PvE and you're well aware of it so this comment kinda confuses me. I will say in response though, I am continually surprised by the sheer number of people that join CL8 in either PvE or PvP and just don't try at all. I'm sure there are some people where real life gets in the way so they didn't get nearly as many points as they planned, but we're talking 80% or more of a PvP bracket that doesn't bother climbing over 5-600 points. I really wonder why most of these choose CL8. 

    As for the rewards issue - I play s5 for PvP and I know some have tracked brackets for quite some time now and we get somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10 brackets per event (I'm being generous here, these numbers are on the high side). That's just 40-50 players who get 4* rewards by being in the top 5. If we think CL9 will reduce participation to only 2 or 3 brackets total and you want all of those players to move over to CL9, then you need to have at least the same compensation down to top 20 or 25, and likely extend single 4* cover rewards past that. You might all say that's far too generous for them to do, and sadly, I agree. My point isn't that this is what I wish for, it's that these are the kinds of rewards they actually NEED to offer to get people to join CL9 instead of keeping the status quo in CL8.
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    mohio said:
    Fightmastermpq said:

    Mostly agree with this.  The problem would be if everyone did actually play where they "should" then there would be too many top end players in the higher clearance levels and would ultimately create a new meta-game around bracket sniping and coordination.  They need 3* rosters to fill out the CL8 brackets to keep vets playing there, and so they just open them up far sooner than they should.

    If they aren't going to push rewards further down the tree in higher clearance levels they should really just make the brackets smaller for those levels.
    There already is bracket coordination and sniping at the higher levels in both PvP and PvE and you're well aware of it so this comment kinda confuses me. I will say in response though, I am continually surprised by the sheer number of people that join CL8 in either PvE or PvP and just don't try at all. I'm sure there are some people where real life gets in the way so they didn't get nearly as many points as they planned, but we're talking 80% or more of a PvP bracket that doesn't bother climbing over 5-600 points. I really wonder why most of these choose CL8. 

    As for the rewards issue - I play s5 for PvP and I know some have tracked brackets for quite some time now and we get somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10 brackets per event (I'm being generous here, these numbers are on the high side). That's just 40-50 players who get 4* rewards by being in the top 5. If we think CL9 will reduce participation to only 2 or 3 brackets total and you want all of those players to move over to CL9, then you need to have at least the same compensation down to top 20 or 25, and likely extend single 4* cover rewards past that. You might all say that's far too generous for them to do, and sadly, I agree. My point isn't that this is what I wish for, it's that these are the kinds of rewards they actually NEED to offer to get people to join CL9 instead of keeping the status quo in CL8.
    The coordination we do now only really works because there are more T5 spots than we have T5 players.  If they open up a CL9 and we have 50 guys competing for only 25 placement spots it gets much harder, the level of coordination required goes up and expands to even more clearance levels.  Having to wait for a bracket to flip before you can join and play sucks, and thinning out the brackets only makes it worse.

    Definitely agree that rewards should be so much better in each clearance level to deter anyone from sandbagging.
  • CT1888
    CT1888 Posts: 1,201 Chairperson of the Boards
    For pvp, if they went with a 4* cover at 800 and 900 for CL9 when it opens up, I'd take that over a top 25 finish in CL7.

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