5* Soft-Capping: Worth It?

mrb
mrb Posts: 21 Just Dropped In
edited March 2017 in Roster and Level Help
When I was in the 3* transition, I wrecked my PvE performance by champing my first 3* without a deep enough roster to support him. Now in my 4* transition with no champs yet, I play most PvE events for the 4* rewards and CP.

I'm holding my 5* guys at about lvl 300, when they could be higher, because I rely on 3* champs 90% of the time and don't want to wreck my scaling again. Does soft-capping still make sense?
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Comments

  • halirin
    halirin Posts: 327 Mover and Shaker
    Yes. If you can't champ any 5*s, then keep their levels not too much higher than the level at which you typically have boosted characters in any given week. That way you can use the 5* if it's a better synergy than the boosted 3*s or 4*s that week, but you don't feel like you have to if it's not the best choice.
  • Daredevil217
    Daredevil217 Posts: 3,994 Chairperson of the Boards
    If I ever get my 5* usable, that's what I plan to do. Hearing horror stories of people being stuck with 3 characters (out of a roster of over 100) they HAVE to use to be competitive just sounds awful. Luckily with only 8 champed 4's I'm a long way from there.
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    Friends don't let friends softcap.
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
  • halirin
    halirin Posts: 327 Mover and Shaker
    Yeah, don't soft cap your 4*s or 3*s.
  • bbigler
    bbigler Posts: 2,111 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    Friends don't let friends be persuaded by illogical taglines.
  • BoyWonder1914
    BoyWonder1914 Posts: 884 Critical Contributor
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?

    From how I've seen him and his alliance buddies talk about it, seems like they're upset at what happened to their PVE scaling after they champed fives. They don't enjoy other people with well/fully covered fives having a leg up on them, so they're trying to level the playing field with their "sage" advice.
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.
  • byc
    byc Posts: 297 Mover and Shaker
    I never leveled any of my 5* until Thanos. I just thought 255 was high enough for everything. People told me I should have leveled my OML with 6 covers, but I never did.

    It wasn't until championed 2-3 4* did I consider it. I picked Thanos because I got 6 covers at first, more later, and decided to follow Marvel lore and leveled him to 375.

    My scaling and matchups definitely changed when I championed my first 4* (Hulkbuster), and again when I got Thanos to 375.

    It's annoying that sometimes I just have to use Thanos or I would have a hard time clearing a node.
  • Orion
    Orion Posts: 1,295 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    Then the devs better understand their own game and fix scaling for 5* rosters. Because right now there's absolutely no reason why anyone should ever level their 5*s past 360. And this is from someone with 2 5* champs and another one at 420.
  • mohio
    mohio Posts: 1,690 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmaster will likely respond himself, but I figured I'd give my perspective as well.

    There is a very real benefit to leveling your best characters for PvP purposes. The higher level your team is, the fewer attacks you are likely to take and the higher you are going to be able to climb in PvP (and your hops are likely to be safer as well). The reality is that every roster is different, and characters vary wildly depending on which covers are available and what other characters are leveled to be support or second fiddle, etc. A 5* leveled to 375 but missing a 3rd color might be completely unusable or might be great depending on the character and colors. It also could really throw things out of whack for you if you have that but not a single championed 4*.

    To me what it comes down to is what do you enjoy most in the game? If you love PvP and matching up your best teams against other people's best teams and seeing how high you can go, then there's little point in softcapping anything (except of course for not having enough iso, which is a very real issue). If you love grinding PvE and facing what limited combinations the game has for villains over and over, then softcapping can make a lot of sense, as it benefits you to be able to use a wide range of your roster to be able to deal with the varied threats the game sends at you. That is best accomplished by softcapping your higher tier characters until you get to the point where you can level several of them together (since significantly higher scaling can artificially limit your options "forcing" you to bring your highest leveled characters only). Only you can decide which way of progressing through the game is best for you.
  • Tilesmasher
    Tilesmasher Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.


    Don't take advice from people that have an axe to grind. They are mad that they went all out and now are suffering, their advice is given because misery loves company.
  • Spudgutter
    Spudgutter Posts: 743 Critical Contributor
    edited March 2017
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    Just out of curiosity, what is your stance on pvp snipers and counter snipers? Or cupcakes? I apologize if I am incorrect, but I thought you were a big proponent of outside the game communication, as well as coordination to achieve maximum in game rewards?

    For reference, I don't have any 5* champed, or any at 13/13, so I don't even have a dog in this particular fight. But I do only have OML up to 375, and I have 34 or 35 of the oldest 4* champed, so my roster is pretty deep, and I use him pretty much every match. The speed he takes people down with match damage is night and day compared to 4*.

    Edit: I just read the response from Mohio, and his description for a pve players is me to a T. I like the option of playing a lot of different nodes against different teams, at different times of the day. It's only been the last couple seasons that I really dipped my toe in the water for PvP, and I shield once I hit 900 and don't look back.
  • Tilesmasher
    Tilesmasher Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    I have 2 fives at 13 covers, I did the same as a few others.. I leveled them until they are both in the 360-370 range so I have more flexibility. I can use the boosted 4s or the two 5s depending on their synergy.

    Why people want to max them and never play their 4s again is a mystery to me, you can succeed just fine without doing so.
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    broll wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Friends don't let friends softcap.

    You say that a lot, but do you have a reason or you just like the tagline?
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    So, if I'm hearing your right, you know it's advantageous to soft cap, but you don't like it. So you're shaming those who don't follow your honor code? This would be like an NFL coach trying persuade other coaches not to use the challenge flag because video review of ref calls is 'counter to the spirit and integrity of the game' icon_rolleyes.gif

    If you shame others for playing to their best of their ability within the rules of a game then you're bad and should feel bad...
  • astrp3
    astrp3 Posts: 367 Mover and Shaker
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    Just curious as to how you feel it is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game. Is it because you think it's deceptive (by hiding the true strength of your characters). Do you think it gives players an unfair advantage over those who level their 5*s? Do you not like the artificiality of it and the fact that it can be seen as "gaming" the system rather than just playing straightforwardly?

    Also, does it only apply to 5*s? What about 4*s? If it does only apply to 5*s, are you saying it's unethical to not level 5*s but it isn't unethical to do the same for 4*s?

    Do you only consider it softcapping if it's done to avoid scaling? I generally don't level characters up until I get a 14th cover and can champion them. In some cases, this is partly to avoid scaling, but it's mostly because I don't want to spend ISO partially leveling characters and would rather save it for championing. Is that softcapping?

    Do you think that such practices as sniping, grilling, cupcakes, etc. are counter to the spirit and integrity of the game?

    I am actually genuinely curious and not criticizing or being sarcastic (I know it's hard to tell on here sometimes - someone started a thread praising MPQ and it took me a while to figure out it wasn't sarcasm).
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    broll wrote:
    This would be like an NFL coach trying persuade other coaches not to use the challenge flag because video review of ref calls is 'counter to the spirit and integrity of the game' icon_rolleyes.gif
    No, more it's like coaching your players to fake a flop to get a call. Sure it's within the bounds of the game (except in the NHL which has diving/embellishment penalties), but that doesn't mean you aren't a piece of **** if you do it.
  • acescracked
    acescracked Posts: 1,197 Chairperson of the Boards
    It's your game, if you want to softcap that's your prerogative. Same as people who like to use Line to play PvP. Both methods allow you an easier path.

    Note two things:
    Takes alot of chutzpah to softcap and then complain PvP is to hard. Can't have it both ways.

    I've seen many posts complaining that rosters with a bunch of champed 5*s are always taking the t10 in new character releases. Can't have it both ways.
  • JackTenrec
    JackTenrec Posts: 808 Critical Contributor
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    Or it's because everyone in 4* and 5* land already has huge ISO deficits and pumping ISO into inadequately-covered 5* is a poor decision.
  • Fightmastermpq
    Fightmastermpq Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    astrp3 wrote:
    Fightmastermpq wrote:
    Softcapping is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game, and done to abuse scaling/MMR mechanics that only exist because the devs admittedly don't understand 5* play. If you softcap your 5*s you are bad and you should feel bad.

    Just curious as to how you feel it is counter to the spirit and integrity of the game. Is it because you think it's deceptive (by hiding the true strength of your characters). Do you think it gives players an unfair advantage over those who level their 5*s? Do you not like the artificiality of it and the fact that it can be seen as "gaming" the system rather than just playing straightforwardly?

    Also, does it only apply to 5*s? What about 4*s? If it does only apply to 5*s, are you saying it's unethical to not level 5*s but it isn't unethical to do the same for 4*s?

    Do you only consider it softcapping if it's done to avoid scaling? I generally don't level characters up until I get a 14th cover and can champion them. In some cases, this is partly to avoid scaling, but it's mostly because I don't want to spend ISO partially leveling characters and would rather save it for championing. Is that softcapping?

    Do you think that such practices as sniping, grilling, cupcakes, etc. are counter to the spirit and integrity of the game?

    I am actually genuinely curious and not criticizing or being sarcastic (I know it's hard to tell on here sometimes - someone started a thread praising MPQ and it took me a while to figure out it wasn't sarcasm).
    I believe the devs have said that they don't like softcapping and the champ feature was designed in many ways to try to encourage people not to softcap. They also removed cupcakes because they didn't like those either, so you can get a good feel for what they think the spirit of the game is.

    It mostly applies to 5*s as 5* scaling/MMR is the most broken, and it is gaming the system specifically to gain a PvE advantage. When I talk about softcapping, I'm not talking about ISO or cover shortages, I'm talking about people that have fully covered (or close to fully covered) 5*s on their roster THAT THEY USE, but are intentionally keeping under-leveled to gain an advantage over others.

    I don't want to confuse this topic with sniping/grilling/cupcakes etc. Make a new thread or PM me.

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