5* champing question

OneLastGambit

GrimSkald wrote:

Arix90 wrote:

OML is definately getting a much earned nerf soon

Seriously, guys, stop harping on OML. For PVP purposes, he's just not scary. Nerfing him will only hurt the 4* to 5* transitioners, which is the last thing they should do.

Agree with this sentiment, even at my level a 400 oml is a piece of cake to fight against. He does make pve less health pack intensive but honestly once you get to the stage where you have 10 or more 4* champs you don't use many health packs anyway because you just use different characters. In pvp if I see an oml team then I'll happily take them on as its almost a handicap for my opponent. Personally IM45 (with the right team) and Phoenix are far more difficult

SnowcaTT

Here is what I found from 300-400 about a year ago: viewtopic.php?t=44648&p=524396
And here is what I found to 450 around that time: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=45391

I was playing with one 450 and a bunch of 4*'s up until last season, when I went to 450/450. That second topic remained pretty much true - 450/450's could see me all the time (apparently), but I could see CC's at any time from 300 points on. With a 4* champed/buffed every week I rarely had any difficulty in getting to 1200, and PVE scaling was high but not impossible.

Update to 458/451/405:
PVE Scaling: went something like 40-60 levels higher, but two 5*'s made it worth it (one is Strange, so that might effect it). Damage was going to be had with a 4*/5*, it's honestly not as bad with two 5*'s.
PVP: I can now be seen by HUGE 5* teams (instead of only small ones), and I can't see CC's until about 1000 points now. That said, I find it much easier to take on almost any team (with less threat/reason of retal) than a 4*/5*, where a 5*/5* has little reason -not- to retal you. 4*/5* is a "lucky" find for me at this point, but I do take quite a few less hits (can float higher) with 5*/5*.

The big difference is I'll basically never use 4*'s again. This PVE is fun because I'm using SL, but typically I wouldn't be (I hear from the huge rosters the 4*'s can be faster, but I assume they also mean at higher levels of 4*). I know some 5*'s "troll" with a 4* early but can't run them late in PVP. I know you can run some 4* in PVE but I'm not taking my 368 Medusa/389 SL/401 XF against 425's when I can take the 450's in and (hopefully) use less health packs.

Polares

This game moved from OML Puzzle Quest to something else (Bolt, Thanos, GG, Strange, etc.) a long time ago. There is a lot of people still obsessed with him, but they should really look at the newer and stronger 5s.

OML is still the best 5 for transitioners, this is true, but once you are firmly in 5 land (6+ chars), he doesn't see that much use (as an example, my typical team for PvE is Strange, BBolt, BW and for PvP I use Thanos+BBolt, Thanos+GG, BBolt+PH the most). I almost don't use OML at all.

PS: If they ever nerf OML is going to be great for 5 players, it is going to be fun to stomp over those players with champed OMLs that they are required to use him everywhere.

spiderpool

I'm in a very similar position as OP but with 5* Thanos instead of oml. I just pulled my 13th cover for him and have him at lvl 390 along with a lvl 390 9 cover oml. After them I have about 20 4* Champs the highest ones being around lvl 280.

I haven't leveled up Thanos anymore for fear that suddenly my mmr and scaling will go crazy.

Jarvind

GrimSkald wrote:

Arix90 wrote:

OML is definately getting a much earned nerf soon

If they nerf him, he will be almost useless to 5* players. As it is he's just plain not great - his value lies in the metagame as he is the most sustainable character there is. I run Black Bolt/Widow and I will gladly take an OML team over pretty much anything else. Black Bolt will do some really serious damage to you pretty much no matter what. Black Widow can one-shot for over 20K under the right circumstances. Phoenix is hell with a good cascade (and she makes good cascades.) IM46 (who is fortunately pretty are) can do absolutely incredible damage. The only way OML will really tinykitty you up is if he a) transforms too early, or b) gets a nasty cascade with "Living Legend" strikes out.

Seriously, guys, stop harping on OML. For PVP purposes, he's just not scary. Nerfing him will only hurt the 4* to 5* transitioners, which is the last thing they should do.

THANK YOU. I get that OML is still desirable for health pack conservation, but it's baffling to me that people still preach the gospel of OML Is The Only Character That Matters. I only use boosted 4*s in PVP and I'll happily take on a 435 OML, whereas basically any other 5* at that level (except maybe Banner) is either a skip or a use-lots-of-boosts for me.

If you deny black he can't do anything except match damage and put out some unpleasant-but-definitely-manageable strikes, and dopey AI means he virtually never transforms. It isn't even necessary to kill his teammates first to weaken his healing - his relatively low health (for a 5*) means you can just stock up some AP and then burn him down.

Magic

I think he remains The Only Character That Matters if he is your only 5* you have covers for. I don't have his covers and I doubt I will get them soon.

On the other hand I have Strange maxed covered. Would it be advisable to champion him when then next on the list is Black widow with 10 covers? Probably not as I would get burned in PvP and my scaling would go through the roof in PvE. I don't think I would mind using Strange every time but I just doubt that it makes sense to make the jump with only him.

I would be happy to stand corrected on this matter

Quibbles

SnowcaTT wrote:

I know some 5*'s "troll" with a 4* early but can't run them late in PVP.

I mostly agree with this, but there are a few very limited cases where a boosted 4* can be useful and scary all the way to the end. In this category, I would put the following (in my order of preference):

Iceman Nova Rulk Thoress Peggy

I expect Captain Marvel is in that category as well, but she's not there yet for me. Nova is the really deadly one, because everyone always underestimates him. The key for all is that they have cheap powers and can pack a punch or disable someone (Thoress isn't as cheap, but paired with Bolt her power ramps up quickly). Any others that 5* folks routinely use all the way through? (I've had folks say they've skipped my Bolt/Iceman combo in favor of two 460+ level 5* teams, so there are some 4* that aren't gimmicks in PVP.)

GrimSkald

Magic wrote:

I think he remains The Only Character That Matters if he is your only 5* you have covers for. I don't have his covers and I doubt I will get them soon.

On the other hand I have Strange maxed covered. Would it be advisable to champion him when then next on the list is Black widow with 10 covers? Probably not as I would get burned in PvP and my scaling would go through the roof in PvE. I don't think I would mind using Strange every time but I just doubt that it makes sense to make the jump with only him.

I would be happy to stand corrected on this matter

I'd actually say no. Strange is not terribly frightening in PVP - he has very low hit points and most winning strategies involve hoarding AP rather than using a power as soon as you can. This means you can generally just pop him first (particularly with a constant damage dealer like Bolt,) then move on, or else do what you need to do and take the damage. Sure, it kind of sucks, but he's a minimal deterrent.

What Strange is great for (and I have a max-covered but not max-leveled Strange, so I speak from some experience here,) is PVE, particularly goon nodes. Leaving him at about the level of your boosted 4*s is phenomenal there - sure it's a bit less damage but you'll still get that nasty 5* match damage (particularly on the critical matches,) and he's still really good.

Even if his build is sub-optimal (mine is, at 4/5/4,) he's still pretty good, so you probably just want to leave your scaling alone, particularly for PVP. Strange makes a good 3rd max 5*, IMHO, not a great first. I'll eventually champ mine, but probably will wait until I get another 5* champ like Thanos. If you had an extra cover for him, the point would be more arguable, but if you're exactly at 13 I'd leave him be until you got a better PVP 5*.

Way I see it, there's really only two good reasons to champ a 5*

- Better ability to climb and hop in PVP
- You would waste covers otherwise

PVE doesn't really figure into it, as a fully covered 5* is pretty good at the level of boosted 4*s, and if you level them your scaling will go up to match.