Fate is rarely fair, and apparently it is nothing but grief

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Comments

  • Volrak
    Volrak Posts: 732 Critical Contributor
    It sounds like I'm in the minority, but I am liking the fact that I've worked out a set of vehicle decks which seem capable of top 5 in Gold without too much risk.

    But there's nothing especially thrilling or novel about the event itself; in contrast, something like viewtopic.php?f=31&t=59718 would certainly pique my interest.
  • losdamianos
    losdamianos Posts: 429 Mover and Shaker
    Nitymp wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple
    words words words words.
    simple solution that is simple is to drop this event never speak of it ever again and bring back **** and even emrakul I will take elderazis any day of the week over those horrible unfun and miserable vehicles
  • watman
    watman Posts: 64 Match Maker
    Nitymp wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    I still wouldn't care. 5 vehicles is ludicrous when they are all terrible. Just thankful its a non-coalition event so I don't have to do it.
    Hell, make it 1 for win, guaranteed 5 for vehicles and 1 for the third!
    They are not all Olivias, but still - 9 mana 4/4 menace, 10 mana 4/4 haste, 10 mana 5/5 vanilla, 11 mana 6/6 flyer with the possibility of lifelink etc. are solid, non-bling drops. And they get 'cheaper' with each one dropped, I like that mechanics... The problem is with non-event decks (killjoys, sad people! The type of M:tG players who have never played pauper or highlander, as these were not tournament formats) AND with the enrage - when I sometimes do not manage to drop 5 vehicles 'cause the game is over or I did not draw enough in time...
  • Nitymp
    Nitymp Posts: 320 Mover and Shaker
    watman wrote:
    Nitymp wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    I still wouldn't care. 5 vehicles is ludicrous when they are all terrible. Just thankful its a non-coalition event so I don't have to do it.
    Hell, make it 1 for win, guaranteed 5 for vehicles and 1 for the third!
    They are not all Olivias, but still - 9 mana 4/4 menace, 10 mana 4/4 haste, 10 mana 5/5 vanilla, 11 mana 6/6 flyer with the possibility of lifelink etc. are solid, non-bling drops. And they get 'cheaper' with each one dropped, I like that mechanics... The problem is with non-event decks (killjoys, sad people! The type of M:tG players who have never played pauper or highlander, as these were not tournament formats) AND with the enrage - when I sometimes do not manage to drop 5 vehicles 'cause the game is over or I did not draw enough in time...

    Sorry, still wouldn't do it. But you also hit the other problem, is that the enraged mode makes it even more annoying to play the vehicles.

    Also, lore-wise, how the hell does a vehicle crew another vehicle?
  • Feyda
    Feyda Posts: 105
    Nitymp wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Nitymp wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    I still wouldn't care. 5 vehicles is ludicrous when they are all terrible. Just thankful its a non-coalition event so I don't have to do it.
    Hell, make it 1 for win, guaranteed 5 for vehicles and 1 for the third!
    They are not all Olivias, but still - 9 mana 4/4 menace, 10 mana 4/4 haste, 10 mana 5/5 vanilla, 11 mana 6/6 flyer with the possibility of lifelink etc. are solid, non-bling drops. And they get 'cheaper' with each one dropped, I like that mechanics... The problem is with non-event decks (killjoys, sad people! The type of M:tG players who have never played pauper or highlander, as these were not tournament formats) AND with the enrage - when I sometimes do not manage to drop 5 vehicles 'cause the game is over or I did not draw enough in time...

    Sorry, still wouldn't do it. But you also hit the other problem, is that the enraged mode makes it even more annoying to play the vehicles.

    Also, lore-wise, how the hell does a vehicle crew another vehicle?

    car_crash_stacked_cars_3.jpg
  • E1Q1G6
    E1Q1G6 Posts: 50 Match Maker
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!

    Except you will still face decks outside the deck building objectives, and thus, still have no chance against a mythic quick battle deck. This is not the answer, restrict it to decks from Planeswalkers that joined the event and have battled in one battle at least. If people still use non event decks, they will thus lose points and are just trolling.
  • watman
    watman Posts: 64 Match Maker
    E1Q1G6 wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    Except you will still face decks outside the deck building objectives, and thus, still have no chance against a mythic quick battle deck. This is not the answer, restrict it to decks from Planeswalkers that joined the event and have battled in one battle at least. If people still use non event decks, they will thus lose points and are just trolling.
    How would you do the pair-up in the first minutes of the event?
  • AettThorn
    AettThorn Posts: 125
    watman wrote:
    E1Q1G6 wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    Except you will still face decks outside the deck building objectives, and thus, still have no chance against a mythic quick battle deck. This is not the answer, restrict it to decks from Planeswalkers that joined the event and have battled in one battle at least. If people still use non event decks, they will thus lose points and are just trolling.
    How would you do the pair-up in the first minutes of the event?

    Allow us to assign PWs to the nodes before the event starts.
  • AoshiMBB
    AoshiMBB Posts: 9 Just Dropped In
    They should make crew use token creatures too. Vehicles would be a lot better.
  • PastrySpider
    PastrySpider Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    AoshiMBB wrote:
    They should make crew use token creatures too. Vehicles would be a lot better.

    As much fun as that would be, it would make vehicles very broken with cards like Thopter Spy Network, Sram's Expertise, Ruinous Path and Part the Waterveil. Vehicles would be effectively free.
  • Alve
    Alve Posts: 167 Tile Toppler
    This event makes my depression worse. And that's not even a joke.
  • DumasAG
    DumasAG Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
    AettThorn wrote:
    watman wrote:
    E1Q1G6 wrote:
    watman wrote:
    Solution is simple - to keep 7 ribbons per 'full' win (win+both objectives) just change the ribbon distribution to 2 for win, 4 for achieving the 'theme' objective (vehicles in this case) and 1 for the remaining objective. BOOM! suddenly, we have decks that care about the theme!
    Except you will still face decks outside the deck building objectives, and thus, still have no chance against a mythic quick battle deck. This is not the answer, restrict it to decks from Planeswalkers that joined the event and have battled in one battle at least. If people still use non event decks, they will thus lose points and are just trolling.
    How would you do the pair-up in the first minutes of the event?

    Allow us to assign PWs to the nodes before the event starts.

    I don't know what they don't do this. Fixes the "changing my deck is a chore" problem as well. You join the event, click a node, and are prompted to select a PW, then build a deck for the node. Doesn't alter your normal PW, and decks will be registered in advance for matchmaking in the first minutes.
  • PastrySpider
    PastrySpider Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    I think that solution means you can't easily change decks during the events which is not good. I would suggest that when you play an round, they upload the deck you entered, cache that and you compete against decks that were entered into events. So you are always playing against decks which were actually played. They should then focus on decks which achieved all objectives, which are therefore decks which actually match the theme.
  • Sortash
    Sortash Posts: 15
    Or maybe you should force people to build decks around a certain theme. If we look at that vehicle-obejctive ... every PW assigned might get a new deck already containing certain preset cards (3 or 4 vehicles for example, even if the player does not own them yet ... to be not unfair to those who dont have a lot of choices yet). The rest of the deck is up to everyone to fill as they please to make the best out of it. Those decks would be just for participating in the event, the regular decks could maintain untouched for use in QM/story.

    Following this system would not put people at disadvantage who put effort in fullfilling objectives by hitting enemies who dont care and just load their decks with the usual mythics. Also new players would get a glimpse of some cards and what they are capable of by playing them in an event.

    For other conditions you could also adapt that system. For example if the condition is "no supports" then lock out supports for deckbuilding or change the loadout for all PWs in that node (so every planeswalker can create decks for that node).
  • PastrySpider
    PastrySpider Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
    Sortash wrote:
    Or maybe you should force people to build decks around a certain theme. If we look at that vehicle-obejctive ... every PW assigned might get a new deck already containing certain preset cards (3 or 4 vehicles for example, even if the player does not own them yet ... to be not unfair to those who dont have a lot of choices yet). The rest of the deck is up to everyone to fill as they please to make the best out of it. Those decks would be just for participating in the event, the regular decks could maintain untouched for use in QM/story.

    Following this system would not put people at disadvantage who put effort in fullfilling objectives by hitting enemies who dont care and just load their decks with the usual mythics. Also new players would get a glimpse of some cards and what they are capable of by playing them in an event.

    For other conditions you could also adapt that system. For example if the condition is "no supports" then lock out supports for deckbuilding or change the loadout for all PWs in that node (so every planeswalker can create decks for that node).

    I'm not a big fan of the partially pre-made deck idea. Objectives are already strict enough ("use 5 vehicles") without forcing us to use specific vehicles. Its greatly limits the possible decks and this is supposed to be a game largely about deck building.

    What we can do is start putting requirements on having X cards of a specific type in the deck (e.g., deck must have 4 vehicles, deck must have 7 colorless cards or deck can only have KLD cards). This still allows for flexibility but forces decks to comply with event limits.
  • Szamsziel
    Szamsziel Posts: 463 Mover and Shaker
    I'm strongly against such limitations. The reason is that there are a lot of other options just to make vehicle deck consistent - you can use only one, add a lot of fetches and it will work better than adding dummy cards just to fulfill the requirements.
  • Sortash
    Sortash Posts: 15
    If you just enforce deck-conditions by telling players to add a certain amount of some card-type you will prevent people who dont own the needed stuff to enter the node at all (especially new players). I already found it very bad when they forced you to use dovin Baan, chandra 2 and nissa2 as PWs in inventors fair nodes (they cycled through all of them). It sucks if you cant fully participate because u are locked out of nodes and cant get enough ribbons for progress because of that.

    The thought behind presetting cards is not to limit deck-construction completely. If you preset maybe 3-4 cards you can still build a lot of different strategies. But at least there is a core-concept that all have to make use of and thats bound to the objectives that are to be achieved. If people want to abandon objectives they will suffer from those cards not fitting into their non-themed decks. And thats the main point. Trying to get objectives is a handycap. Everyone participating in an event should be bound to it. Trying your best and running into decks that play "out of the plan" can be very frustrating if they just combo-wombo you down. You might have been able to do it, too. But you played "by the rules" and get punished for that.

    And like i said before, all players receive the same base-cards for their decks, even if they dont own those cars yet. That will benefit new players and further contribute to a certain equality in event matches. And it opens new ways for strategies because you know at least part of the cards that you will fight against enabling the chance to build counter-decks. Players with a big collection of cards will still have the edge though.

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