4* PVP Events

jjfyahpowah

Why are 4* pvp events used to release new characters and then never seen of again?

Perhaps originally to stop teams from being overpowered, but in the age of 5*s and new Match Making Ratios this no longer has any effect.

mpqr7

I enjoy 4* PVP events with old characters. So far, they've done at least Elektra and GR, and they were both fun.

In the end, I still end up with the same score as always (900+), and the matches are probably harder, but it's nice to be able to have three strong characters, instead of two strong characters and one useless character.

Also, 4* PVPs should have better prizes!

jgomes32

Season should consist of 5 3* events and 5 4* events by now. That's just where the game is right now.

Skygazing

At this point I think the biggest factor is the sheer ubiquity of 3*s. Obviously we don't know the actual numbers, but I think it's safe to say that most rosters have way more 3* covers than 4*s. Running 4* PvPs more frequently would mean running 3*s less (unless Demi started doing both, which would be awesome IMO but take a lot of work to balance), which could alienate a large chunk of the playerbase.

Mr_Sinister

Each match seems to take an eternity, so maybe that's why. Medusa was actually decent for a loaner so that went well but for every 1 of those you have 4 Blade the red sucking vampire and Agent Venom the ap thieving menace.
If you have the 4* champed it's a great event, if not it's a world of hurt, much more so than 3* PvP. 5* rosters excluded, of course.

Dormammu

As long as the 'loaner' character is in effect I don't see why four star characters couldn't be used more often. MMR actually does a decent job (from what I can see) of separating those using the loaner and those who have the required character champed, so it's not like there would be a huge rift between the haves and have-nots in terms of competitiveness.

Rather than alienate players, I think it would encourage them. I know I learned a lot using 4* loaners in PVE nodes before transitioning into that tier and I appreciated seeing how they played.

Vhailorx

Would 4* pvps for old characters be more palatable if the feature 4* weren't boosted?

Is the main problem just the extra matchtimes of a featured character havung 30+k health instead of 18-22k?

SnowcaTT

They are there for the whales. If you spend enough, you can have the advantage for one event!

And to remind us all to stop asking for 4* PVP's, since the matches can take -forever-.

-signed, someone who used to ask for 4* PVP's all the time but then has seen the error in his ways after Duck, Dino, GR, Elecktra.

TxMoose

we easily forget the vast majority of players in the game are playing 3* or even 2* levels. from a single match perspective it would provide more interest, but from an event-long perspective I enjoy the opposing 3s using the ap instead of the boosted 4 or the opposing 5*. Elektra and GR were palatable because other than black, their damage moves were not devastating. run an ice, rulk, peg or cyke event, with 5*s and choices of 5 boosted 4s, and you will be taking copious amounts of damage compared to a psylocke or mystique event, or even a fist or sentry event.

Mr_Sinister

I feel like pvp should be segregated. 3* should be 3* and down, 4* should be 4*and 5* .

Don't care it'll never happen, or why it can't, just saying it makes more sense than throwing every tier in a pot like they are near equals.

TxMoose

Mr_Sinister wrote:

I feel like pvp should be segregated. 3* should be 3* and down, 4* should be 4*and 5* .

Don't care it'll never happen, or why it can't, just saying it makes more sense than throwing every tier in a pot like they are near equals.

if the rewards were appropriate, it would be worth it. based on CL8, they don't understand what is 'worth' it for the playerbase.

Polares

No please! I don't want those, I thought I wanted them but after thinking things through it would be a terrible mistake!

As a 5 player, the only reason to ever use any 3 is that they are featured. I use 4s sometimes, and when my top tier 4s get to the 325 level they will be usable again when buffed. But if they remove them from PvP there will be 40+ 3s I won't almost never ever use again.

Then as some people have pointed out, duration of matches would be much longer in a 4 PvP. A 430 has 45k+ hitpoints, but some can have around 100k!!!. This would make shield hops much more dangerous!

There is also the problem that whales have more or less all 4s at this 325+ level (some much higher), this would be an even bigger advantage in PvP for them. I can fight 460-470 5s with my 450 5s, but if they add a 430+ 4, things would start to be a bit too hard for fast hops. Now I have to fight sometimes fully maxed 3s (266 level) with my not maxed 3s (mine are around 220-200 level), but the difference is not as big as it would be with 4s.

wymtime

Here is an idea make the essential character an either or. Whatever the 900 progression 4* is they can be use in place of the essential 3*. This way if the 4* cover is let's say gwenpool who is newer you can use the 3*. If the 4*is HB you can use HB. You could also use the loaner for either one if you want. 4* PVP does not have to make everyone use the 4* character. This would also help with matchmaking for a lot of people who are strong 4* players but might not have a 5* ready. They can bring 3 buffed 4* to. Match and can compete with a lot of rosters.

Akari

I like the idea of 4* pvp as long as Rulk is never an option. Boosted Rulk is already the most painful thing ever.

OneLastGambit

Akari wrote:

I like the idea of 4* pvp as long as Rulk is never an option. Boosted Rulk is already the most painful thing ever.

I second this...I hate boosted Rulk more than anything. He easily seems like the character who is most boosted. I can only recall Bucky being boosted twice yet Rulk is literally once every season....hmm wonder why they boost a character every season that damages all 3 of your team forcing you to use more health packs....

Polares

Polares wrote:

No please! I don't want those, I thought I wanted them but after thinking things through it would be a terrible mistake!

As a 5 player, the only reason to ever use any 3 is that they are featured. I use 4s sometimes, and when my top tier 4s get to the 325 level they will be usable again when buffed. But if they remove them from PvP there will be 40+ 3s I won't almost never ever use again.

Then as some people have pointed out, duration of matches would be much longer in a 4 PvP. A 430 has 45k+ hitpoints, but some can have around 100k!!!. This would make shield hops much more dangerous!

There is also the problem that whales have more or less all 4s at this 325+ level (some much higher), this would be an even bigger advantage in PvP for them. I can fight 460-470 5s with my 450 5s, but if they add a 430+ 4, things would start to be a bit too hard for fast hops. Now I have to fight sometimes fully maxed 3s (266 level) with my not maxed 3s (mine are around 220-200 level), but the difference is not as big as it would be with 4s.

I am going to quote myself.

Please, those people that want 4 PvP, can you give solutions or 'disprove' the points I mentioned? (basically, much longer matches, even more advantage for whales and 3s not used anymore)

I think people think they want 4 PvP, but for most players if this was really implemented it would be a nightmare. This would be good just for players who have all 4s already above the 340+ level. There is a BIG difference between a buffed 400 level and a 430 level 4s, much, much, much bigger than a buffed 300 to 330 level 3. And there is a lot of people with 230+ level 3s, there are not that many with 330+ level 4s.

Mr_Sinister

Polares wrote:

Polares wrote:

No please! I don't want those, I thought I wanted them but after thinking things through it would be a terrible mistake!

As a 5 player, the only reason to ever use any 3 is that they are featured. I use 4s sometimes, and when my top tier 4s get to the 325 level they will be usable again when buffed. But if they remove them from PvP there will be 40+ 3s I won't almost never ever use again.

Then as some people have pointed out, duration of matches would be much longer in a 4 PvP. A 430 has 45k+ hitpoints, but some can have around 100k!!!. This would make shield hops much more dangerous!

There is also the problem that whales have more or less all 4s at this 325+ level (some much higher), this would be an even bigger advantage in PvP for them. I can fight 460-470 5s with my 450 5s, but if they add a 430+ 4, things would start to be a bit too hard for fast hops. Now I have to fight sometimes fully maxed 3s (266 level) with my not maxed 3s (mine are around 220-200 level), but the difference is not as big as it would be with 4s.

I am going to quote myself.

Please, those people that want 4 PvP, can you give solutions or 'disprove' the points I mentioned? (basically, much longer matches, even more advantage for whales and 3s not used anymore)

I think people think they want 4 PvP, but for most players if this was really implemented it would be a nightmare. This would be good just for players who have all 4s already above the 340+ level. There is a BIG difference between a buffed 400 level and a 430 level 4s, much, much, much bigger than a buffed 300 to 330 level 3. And there is a lot of people with 230+ level 3s, there are not that many with 330+ level 4s.

I'm indifferent on the matter I think but one thing I'm sure of is I'm sick of using 3*'s, ESPECIALLY IM40.

You make good points but not doing things different because of x,y,z is always going to be the case. Progress has to be made because stagnation will cause more people to leave than a temporary increase in opponent difficulty.

Polares

Mr_Sinister wrote:

Polares wrote:

Polares wrote:

No please! I don't want those, I thought I wanted them but after thinking things through it would be a terrible mistake!

As a 5 player, the only reason to ever use any 3 is that they are featured. I use 4s sometimes, and when my top tier 4s get to the 325 level they will be usable again when buffed. But if they remove them from PvP there will be 40+ 3s I won't almost never ever use again.

Then as some people have pointed out, duration of matches would be much longer in a 4 PvP. A 430 has 45k+ hitpoints, but some can have around 100k!!!. This would make shield hops much more dangerous!

There is also the problem that whales have more or less all 4s at this 325+ level (some much higher), this would be an even bigger advantage in PvP for them. I can fight 460-470 5s with my 450 5s, but if they add a 430+ 4, things would start to be a bit too hard for fast hops. Now I have to fight sometimes fully maxed 3s (266 level) with my not maxed 3s (mine are around 220-200 level), but the difference is not as big as it would be with 4s.

I am going to quote myself.

Please, those people that want 4 PvP, can you give solutions or 'disprove' the points I mentioned? (basically, much longer matches, even more advantage for whales and 3s not used anymore)

I think people think they want 4 PvP, but for most players if this was really implemented it would be a nightmare. This would be good just for players who have all 4s already above the 340+ level. There is a BIG difference between a buffed 400 level and a 430 level 4s, much, much, much bigger than a buffed 300 to 330 level 3. And there is a lot of people with 230+ level 3s, there are not that many with 330+ level 4s.

I'm indifferent on the matter I think but one thing I'm sure of is I'm sick of using 3*'s, ESPECIALLY IM40.

You make good points but not doing things different because of x,y,z is always going to be the case. Progress has to be made because stagnation will cause more people to leave than a temporary increase in opponent difficulty.

I guess you are still in 3 land. I on the other hand am in 5 land, so I basically use IM40 in Combined Arms, Balance of Power, and when it is featured in PvP and PvE. So basically once every month maybe? Probably less. Whenever you start having top tier 4s, you will finish to use IM40 so often. But, anyway, having a 4 PvP won't affect your problem with IM40 at all.

Progress is made, you play first with 2s, then with 3s, 4s and finally with 5s. It is just the featured char the only one that doesn't change, so stagnation is not that bad (at least not for this reason, there are other reasons for that).

I am not against new modes, but a mode exactly like we have now, where the only difference is that instead of a featured 3 we have a featured 4? No thanks.

Mr_Sinister

Polares wrote:

Mr_Sinister wrote:

Polares wrote:

Polares wrote:

No please! I don't want those, I thought I wanted them but after thinking things through it would be a terrible mistake!

As a 5 player, the only reason to ever use any 3 is that they are featured. I use 4s sometimes, and when my top tier 4s get to the 325 level they will be usable again when buffed. But if they remove them from PvP there will be 40+ 3s I won't almost never ever use again.

Then as some people have pointed out, duration of matches would be much longer in a 4 PvP. A 430 has 45k+ hitpoints, but some can have around 100k!!!. This would make shield hops much more dangerous!

There is also the problem that whales have more or less all 4s at this 325+ level (some much higher), this would be an even bigger advantage in PvP for them. I can fight 460-470 5s with my 450 5s, but if they add a 430+ 4, things would start to be a bit too hard for fast hops. Now I have to fight sometimes fully maxed 3s (266 level) with my not maxed 3s (mine are around 220-200 level), but the difference is not as big as it would be with 4s.

I am going to quote myself.

Please, those people that want 4 PvP, can you give solutions or 'disprove' the points I mentioned? (basically, much longer matches, even more advantage for whales and 3s not used anymore)

I think people think they want 4 PvP, but for most players if this was really implemented it would be a nightmare. This would be good just for players who have all 4s already above the 340+ level. There is a BIG difference between a buffed 400 level and a 430 level 4s, much, much, much bigger than a buffed 300 to 330 level 3. And there is a lot of people with 230+ level 3s, there are not that many with 330+ level 4s.

I'm indifferent on the matter I think but one thing I'm sure of is I'm sick of using 3*'s, ESPECIALLY IM40.

You make good points but not doing things different because of x,y,z is always going to be the case. Progress has to be made because stagnation will cause more people to leave than a temporary increase in opponent difficulty.

I guess you are still in 3 land. I on the other hand am in 5 land, so I basically use IM40 in Combined Arms, Balance of Power, and when it is featured in PvP and PvE. So basically once every month maybe? Probably less. Whenever you start having top tier 4s, you will finish to use IM40 so often. But, anyway, having a 4 PvP won't affect your problem with IM40 at all.

Progress is made, you play first with 2s, then with 3s, 4s and finally with 5s. It is just the featured char the only one that doesn't change, so stagnation is not that bad (at least not for this reason, there are other reasons for that).

I am not against new modes, but a mode exactly like we have now, where the only difference is that instead of a featured 3 we have a featured 4? No thanks.

You guessed incorrectly

The featured 3*'s have been used to death by everyone. That's the stagnation. How many featured 4*'s have been used? A few. It creates a completely different way to approach building a team, especially with how limited our experiences are with some of the newer 4*'s outside of shield where you can build whatever you want.


You want to hold back progress because it would be personally more difficult for you. It's understandable but I don't see that to be a valid reason to keep the status quo.

Whales always have the advantage, so nothing new with that either.

Polares

Mr_Sinister wrote:

You guessed incorrectly

The featured 3*'s have been used to death by everyone. That's the stagnation. How many featured 4*'s have been used? A few. It creates a completely different way to approach building a team, especially with how limited our experiences are with some of the newer 4*'s outside of shield where you can build whatever you want.


You want to hold back progress because it would be personally more difficult for you. It's understandable but I don't see that to be a valid reason to keep the status quo.

Whales always have the advantage, so nothing new with that either.

So, you are not in 3 land? But then, why are you tired of using IM ? Why do you need to use it all the time, when there are a lot of 4s (or 5s) that you can use? As I told you, I use it just once a month or even less. I was forced to use OML and PH all the time, but I can't see why anybody in 4+land is forced to use IM all the time. (I get that if he is buffed and Peggy, Iceman or 4hor are buffed too you might use him, but if he is not buffed it would be a liability, so even then, it is not that often, and you would use him all the same in a 4 PvP, so no difference there).

The stagnation is when you play the same chars all the time (like using OML and PH for a year like I had to in every single mode in the game except Heroics ). This doesn't happen with 3s in PvP. There are 40+ 3s, this means you use a 3 every 120+ days. I agree having 4 PvP would change a bit the way you build your team, but you also have sim or PvE for that, where you can chose your 3 chars, so that is still just one mode. And as I said, if we had 4 PvP a lot of people would probably stop using 3s at all (just in the PvE 3 featured node)

And talking about difficulty, it wouldn't be harder for me, it would be for EVERYBODY... except whales. The problem is that the advantage for whales would be even bigger than it is now, much much bigger than now, because having a 330+ 4 would be much more important than having a 230+ 3. But even forgetting about whales, imagine doing shield hops where instead of 3-5 min you need 5-7 min for every fight. This would be a big problem for everybody. Doing shield hops and getting to the last progression reward would be really hard!

I understand that we need newer modes, I agree with that. But I don't think 4 PvP will be the answer for that.

Mr_Sinister

Polares wrote:

Mr_Sinister wrote:

You guessed incorrectly

The featured 3*'s have been used to death by everyone. That's the stagnation. How many featured 4*'s have been used? A few. It creates a completely different way to approach building a team, especially with how limited our experiences are with some of the newer 4*'s outside of shield where you can build whatever you want.


You want to hold back progress because it would be personally more difficult for you. It's understandable but I don't see that to be a valid reason to keep the status quo.

Whales always have the advantage, so nothing new with that either.

So, you are not in 3 land? But then, why are you tired of using IM ? Why do you need to use it all the time, when there are a lot of 4s (or 5s) that you can use? As I told you, I use it just once a month or even less. I was forced to use OML and PH all the time, but I can't see why anybody in 4+land is forced to use IM all the time. (I get that if he is buffed and Peggy, Iceman or 4hor are buffed too you might use him, but if he is not buffed it would be a liability, so even then, it is not that often, and you would use him all the same in a 4 PvP, so no difference there).

The stagnation is when you play the same chars all the time (like using OML and PH for a year like I had to in every single mode in the game except Heroics ). This doesn't happen with 3s in PvP. There are 40+ 3s, this means you use a 3 every 120+ days. I agree having 4 PvP would change a bit the way you build your team, but you also have sim or PvE for that, where you can chose your 3 chars, so that is still just one mode. And as I said, if we had 4 PvP a lot of people would probably stop using 3s at all (just in the PvE 3 featured node)

And talking about difficulty, it wouldn't be harder for me, it would be for EVERYBODY... except whales. The problem is that the advantage for whales would be even bigger than it is now, much much bigger than now, because having a 330+ 4 would be much more important than having a 230+ 3. But even forgetting about whales, imagine doing shield hops where instead of 3-5 min you need 5-7 min for every fight. This would be a big problem for everybody. Doing shield hops and getting to the last progression reward would be really hard!

I understand that we need newer modes, I agree with that. But I don't think 4 PvP will be the answer for that.

I'm tired of even seeing IM40, never mind using him. His PvP wasn't that long ago, and it struck me how tired of him I am. I don't use 3* unless I'm forced into it, but I don't use IM40 even in pve anymore because it stopped being interesting matching 6 yellow a long time ago.
If it's harder for everyone, it's the new standard and there is no advantage/disadvantage.
people still use IM40 all the time, even with crazy amounts 4* champed because it makes for faster hops. I'm sure at double champed 5* that's not an option but for below that it happens all the time.
If there was 4* PvP I'd never use my 3* unless I was feeling high levels of nostalgia, which could happen tbh. I don't see why a split couldn't happen though, half 4* events, half 3* events to actually reflect the game has actually moved along.
We have as many now? More? 4* as 3*, and there really isn't any reason to have the backbone of PvP be stuck in 2014.
3* are the 2017 version of 2*. Although I started out kinda indifferent, as I've thought it over more in these posts I do actually want 4* PvP. It's time.