Health as Energy

Dormammu

Free mobile games are fun, but they trick you. They suck you in. They give you a little taste of the game, level you up a few times so you feel the satisfaction of progress, then you hit the 'energy wall' where you either have to wait or pay to continue playing. Some games don't even try to hide it - they have a resource literally called 'energy' and when you run out you're done; you go do something else or you pay cash. I've never understood the reasoning behind this mechanic. Do developers not want you to play their game? Do they want you to find another game and go play that, forgetting all about their game and deleting it from your phone/tablet? Can't they come up with a more creative, and less insidious, way to make money?

Marvel Puzzle Quest hides the concept of energy rather well behind the health mechanic and slowly regenerating health packs. When the game first started and there were a total of 20 characters, health and health packs were a major concern that needed to be carefully managed (usually by always using 3* Spider-Man). Eventually I ran out of both and had to set the game down for a couple of hours. Now days I have 117 characters on my roster and when one goes down its next-character-up. Every now and then I'll use a health pack on someone who is required for a node, but I have 100+ health packs laying around so it's not something I need to manage.

Now, I'm more PVE. I can see where PVP-heavy players would use more health packs, but is this really a necessary mechanic anymore? Even for someone who does use their time allotted health packs, it's not like HP is in such short supply that buying a few more would require an investment of $$$.

I'm curious what percentage of the game's income comes from health packs. Not that I expect an answer, but I thought it would be a good topic for this forum's users. What is your health pack situation? Does the health mechanic force you to stop playing? Do you spend HP on health packs? Do you lean on true healers? Do you think the game would be improved or worsened by changing the health mechanic?

mpqr7

I almost never use HPs in PVE. Only when I'm doing my final hops in PVP, because I need to go up quickly.. I don't have 8 hours to wait for my dead characters of my A Team to return to life.

I use boosts in my final hops in PVP, in order to win matches faster, before my opponents can kill or severely damage my characters. The HPs are hard to replace!

I win most HPs when I'm opening up a bunch of Taco Tokens.

I wish we automatically had 10 HPs, and then it didn't start using our reserves until after those 10 ran out. It's a pain that we start by dipping into the reserves immediately, whereas people with less than 10 get to have their HPs regenerate.

GrumpySmurf1002

Dormammu wrote:

1) What is your health pack situation?
2) Does the health mechanic force you to stop playing?
3) Do you spend HP on health packs?
4) Do you lean on true healers?
5) Do you think the game would be improved or worsened by changing the health mechanic?

1) Healthy. I emptied some tacos not long ago and had like 70, so I used Carnage (boosted) to climb from 0-1200 in PvP. That was fun. Only used about 23 of them when it was done. Anyway, it's rarely a risk these days.

2) It has. Early in MPQ life that was a great way to limit my addiction. Then I got OBW and health packs were no longer a major concern. Then true healing came around, and back to the drawing board.

3) I have. Not in a while because I usually go to the taco well for them, but if I'm in a time pinch I'll buy them rather that dig them out of tokens. I can look but it's probably in the 2-3k range over my lifetime.

4) Well yeah, OML and Surfer are my two champed 5*, so I have to lean on them. If I had a more diverse 5* roster I'd be less inclined to do so.

5) I think there are significantly better things for the devs to worry about than health packs. The expansion from 5 in reserve to 10 was the best thing they've done. Faster Health pack regeneration would be nice, but since it is a minor income source, I doubt that'll happen unless it were tied to VIP.

pheregas

If the AI can instantly emerge from a battle with full health, so should we. The challenge in PVE has become the increase in levels between the matches.

I might actually try running different toons other than OML + boosted + boosted/5* if the consequence of losing a match was only that I have to try it again.

For PVP, the consequences come in the form of points. You fail, you lose points. You win, you gain points.

As above, roster diversity and boosted characters give lots of options and mitigate health pack use.

All that being said, if people are swimming in health packs, why have them?

CT1888

I use health packs in pvp; I'll maybe use an OML team, or play around early on with alternative teams, but when I get serious at chasing 900, I quickly move to my prime team and just go for it. I have enough 4* champs that I normally have one or 2 decent ones boosted, and I'll take them through a few matches before healing up (the 40k hulks down to around 20k before healing normally for example), health and push fast. If I run out of health packs close to 900 I'll shield, fall and try again later, or switch to a b team if it's just a tiny push over the top. I think ai've spent HP once on health packs.

Pve I normally use OML, Fist and Strange to melt easy nodes, and boosted 4*s or reliable teams (Jean/Witch for goon only for example) to clean out harder nodes. With Cho and RHulk boosted, I rarely need to use health packs just now.
I can often get through the first 4 full clears without using health packs.

stowaway

I often feel like the game is limiting my ability to play it, but it's not because of health packs. It's because DDQ is the only daily non-competitive activity it offers. PvP and PvE have to be played in a certain way, if you're being competitive, which limits your ability to just open the game and play it for a few minutes at a time, whenever you want. I wish there was a Gauntlet running at all times, alongside regular PvE.

I bought a Health Pack exactly once. It was to make sure I got top 10 in a new character release. I doubt it will ever happen again, because I doubt I'll ever play that aggressively again.

Wonko33

As a paying customer I don't really have any issues with health packs, the VIP heal rate and the 10 regenerating packs are all I need.


What is up with all the outrage about having to pay to play great games? Do you guys understand the dynamic where companies have employees that need to be payed and that games shut down when no money is made from them?

I think by now the "free to download" game concepts are well established and players understands how it works, it is certainly not "play as much as you want while we create free content ".

Do you guys think it is a fair expectation that you can play as much as you want and have all the advantages paying customers get for free?

Borstock

I use my health packs in PVE and PVP, but now that I have a bigger 4* champed roster, I've only been running out of them when chasing a high PVP position. This is almost entirely based on my playing habits and because I usually like playing with only 1 A team for an entire event. I also do VIP, which helps.

Eddiemon

Dormammu wrote:

- they have a resource literally called 'energy' and when you run out you're done; you go do something else or you pay cash. I've never understood the reasoning behind this mechanic. Do developers not want you to play their game? Do they want you to find another game and go play that, forgetting all about their game and deleting it from your phone/tablet? Can't they come up with a more creative, and less insidious, way to make money?

They want to make it so that time does not become the determining factor for success. People with jobs and disposable income have less time than people without, so allowing people with more time to play more and dominate actually drives away paying customers.

Now, I'm more PVE. I can see where PVP-heavy players would use more health packs, but is this really a necessary mechanic anymore? Even for someone who does use their time allotted health packs, it's not like HP is in such short supply that buying a few more would require an investment of $$$.

Sure. With unlimited health packs and time you can get unlimited 2* covers which turn into unlimited HP and CP if you grind in PvP.

While the CP cost oh health packs doesn't prevent me from buyinh 5 health packs if I really need it to make 900, it does stop me from running Prof X/GSBW/Featured to grind endlessly. (It will be able to beat most combos played manually, but the AI will lose to almost anyone, which will keep the MMR down, to keep grinding alive)

I'm curious what percentage of the game's income comes from health packs. Not that I expect an answer, but I thought it would be a good topic for this forum's users. What is your health pack situation? Does the health mechanic force you to stop playing? Do you spend HP on health packs? Do you lean on true healers? Do you think the game would be improved or worsened by changing the health mechanic?

Health packs don't get in my way really except when climbing the shield simulation or when trying to get to 900 in one jump. Or when i try to mix PvE and PvP.

But it does prevent me from endless grinding in PvP, and encourages me to shield when my packs get dicey.

Punisher5784

During my early days I relied heavily on 2* Wolverine and 2* Daken for their true healing. Eventually I graduated to 3* Wolverine and 3* Daken for their true healing until I had Ironfist and Luke Cage for the protect and attack tile. I used to be like you with over 100 healthpacks until I recently reached 4* land. Unfortunately I have not found such a team in 4* land and I burn healthpacks much more than I used to due to the high scaling/matchmaking. Unless I get a usable X-23 or a 5* such as OML, I've been managing healthpacks. It also does not help that we need to do 4 clears in PVE, as opposed to just 1 clear in the older days.

broll

Dormammu wrote:

1) What is your health pack situation?
2) Does the health mechanic force you to stop playing?
3) Do you spend HP on health packs?
4) Do you lean on true healers?
5) Do you think the game would be improved or worsened by changing the health mechanic?

1) Never had more than 15 at one time, rarely have more than 10. Currently hoarding taco tokens so after I finally open that will most likely change, but with 50 of each right now I'm only 1/6 of the way through that giant hoard...

2) Yes, not as much now as it used to. Early on it did a lot, or rather I found myself spending HP on health packs alot.

3) See above. It's rare that I do now, but it happens, maybe once a month at most now.

4) Depends on who's boosted or what I'm doing. I usually use 3* Daken in shield Sim for his true healing so I can go longer than 10 health packs would normally take me. In PvE I play who's boosted most of the time, unless the team has goons, then strange comes along for some non-true healing. Usually if there is a healer boosted, true or not, I try and bring them.

5) It would improve from a player's standpoint, unless the game would run out of money from it The only change to health packs I really want is to change VIPs increased heal regen to increased health pack regen. That would be huge and people would still be paying for it, probably more than on health packs.

Calnexin

I'm about 70/30 on PvE vs PvP.

Health pack usage is largely moot in PvE since I have a viable OML. I have to spend a few during heroics, or when I'm unable to quash a few AoE, but it's minor.

PvP, I use a lot. I could come out unscathed, or down to 20% health, necessitating 2-3 packs if I want to continue using that team - and given the nature of boosts, there usually is one good team. Maybe there's 1-2 replacements for defense, but that comes at the end.

So I compete as high as I'm able, spend the recharging health packs, then shield. I think a shield is far more useful to spend on than health packs. Immunity from retaliation until you're comfortable re-queuing saves more points than buying another full-health match does.

Hendross

I rode Patch the horse for a long time in the 3* transition, but now with 22+ maxed 4stars, health is a non-issue. I blow through 10; clubbing seals and dining on steak then throw up an 8hr shield. Rinse and repeat.

Calnexin

Wonko33 wrote:

What is up with all the outrage about having to pay to play great games? Do you guys understand the dynamic where companies have employees that need to be payed and that games shut down when no money is made from them?

I'm not sure I get outrage. Maybe discontent.

Abstracting the concept - when you buy a AAA title for PC or consoles, you're usually in the $60 range. It's a contained experience, which you complete and then move on. You can pay more for special edition content or DLC, but that tends to top out ~ $100 more.

MPQ is bejeweled with a CCG skin, and apparently some people pay tens of thousands of dollars to stay on top - and once they get there, it's miserable because they see the same 5 opponents and PvE takes longer than a FTP player with a champ 2* roster.

Point being - there's potentially two orders of magnitude difference in cost between MPQ, a game whose core mechanics have been around for a decade and plasters it over with licensed content, vs a large studio release which required a large team and millions of dollars to create.

It's kind of like cinema vs TV, except here you have to buy 5 movie tickets to see the last 10 minutes of the TV program.

Calnexin

Punisher5784 wrote:

Unfortunately I have not found such a team in 4* land and I burn healthpacks much more than I used to due to the high scaling/matchmaking. Unless I get a usable X-23 or a 5* such as OML, .

4* Deadpool is also viable, but requires an active power. You have to take a mid-range match, because trivial nodes will fall before you get enough red.

madsalad

They make all of their money from players spending HP to recall their heroes who are out on assignment for Teamups!

Talk about a mechanic that has outlived its usefulness (if it was ever actually useful to begin with).

Alfje17

Dormammu wrote:

1) What is your health pack situation?
2) Does the health mechanic force you to stop playing?
3) Do you spend HP on health packs?
4) Do you lean on true healers?
5) Do you think the game would be improved or worsened by changing the health mechanic?

1) About 160

2) No, don't need them in PVE and as I usually get mercillesly slaughtered above 200 points in Pvp I just stop playing.

3) Never, I used to get tons of health packs in the tacos, so before I started playing PvP I already had a stack of over 100.

4) Not really, sometimes use OML and Patch, but that's it.

5) I'm sure it can be improved, but there are more important issues.

Wonko33

Calnexin wrote:

Wonko33 wrote:

What is up with all the outrage about having to pay to play great games? Do you guys understand the dynamic where companies have employees that need to be payed and that games shut down when no money is made from them?

I'm not sure I get outrage. Maybe discontent.

Abstracting the concept - when you buy a AAA title for PC or consoles, you're usually in the $60 range. It's a contained experience, which you complete and then move on. You can pay more for special edition content or DLC, but that tends to top out ~ $100 more.

MPQ is bejeweled with a CCG skin, and apparently some people pay tens of thousands of dollars to stay on top - and once they get there, it's miserable because they see the same 5 opponents and PvE takes longer than a FTP player with a champ 2* roster.

Point being - there's potentially two orders of magnitude difference in cost between MPQ, a game whose core mechanics have been around for a decade and plasters it over with licensed content, vs a large studio release which required a large team and millions of dollars to create.

It's kind of like cinema vs TV, except here you have to buy 5 movie tickets to see the last 10 minutes of the TV program.

There is a huge difference in paying to be on top of the MPQ world and contributing to be able to play at your leisure.

I would say I play at least 1 hour a day. I pay 10$ a month since the beginning of VIP service. 30 hours a month for 10$ , in my situation (free time and disposable income) I don't know where I can get a better deal. But yes I agree when I had a lot of free time a 60$ video game was the best bang for the buck, hundreds of hours of play...

The key is not to let the pressure get to you, the rat race, once I accepted that I would not put the time and money to compete with the whales or the super dedicated top 10 alliance players , I started enjoying this game again.

Dormammu

Wonko33 wrote:

What is up with all the outrage about having to pay to play great games? Do you guys understand the dynamic where companies have employees that need to be payed and that games shut down when no money is made from them?

Do you guys think it is a fair expectation that you can play as much as you want and have all the advantages paying customers get for free?

I don't have any outrage. I'm a paying customer. Many daily-deal character packs have eaten into my wallet. For as much entertainment this game has given me on and off over three years I'm happy to support the developers and have done so generously.

I didn't intend for this post to sound like I was **** about the cost of health packs. I'm just wondering if they serve a purpose as a source of revenue anymore? If I wanted to complain about the cost of something, I'd complain about how much iso you get for $100.

Punisher5784

Calnexin wrote:

Punisher5784 wrote:

Unfortunately I have not found such a team in 4* land and I burn healthpacks much more than I used to due to the high scaling/matchmaking. Unless I get a usable X-23 or a 5* such as OML, .

4* Deadpool is also viable, but requires an active power. You have to take a mid-range match, because trivial nodes will fall before you get enough red.

True but 14 Red AP is a lot. My 4pool is at 5/5/0.. maybe one day I will see some purple so I can use him. I was actually waiting for players to tell me Mr. Fantastic lol

Jarvind

I remember health packs being an issue earlier on in the game, but at the current stage when I'm almost always using boosted 4*s, I rarely have to use more than two or three (and sometimes none) on PVE clears. In PVP I will blow through a bunch since I generally stick with my A team and heal them when they get to half-ish, but it's been a long time since I had to stop because I ran out of health - usually it's because attacks start rolling in and I have to shield.