FIX PVP

greenglove

I would like to know when PVP is going to be fixed. Several huge problems make PVP astoundingly frustrating.

1. The higher up you go, the less reward you have in progression points. You get penalized for doing well.

2. The higher up you go, the more you get clobbered by someone attacking you. You can win two fights, only to lose all of those points because someone else beat you and copped 70 points off of you

3. Then, when you've run out of health packs, you get to pay for the tremendous privilege of NOT PLAYING by having to shield.

4. The cost of getting a head start in ap is also too expensive. 200 ISO for 5 AP? You guys could help a lot of people out with the chronic ISO shortage by making 5 AP cost 100 instead of 200.

I've been waiting for ages for D3 to fix these problems, which have been noted by MANY people before me. Right now, the only people who are NOT frustrated are the whalers, who can afford the HP, because it doesn't even affect the number of roster slots they can buy.

The Herald

For context, can you give us some idea of what your roster is like?

It doesn't address the core issues, but there does some to be a point where you aren't really able to compete that the devs seem.okay with.

I have a developed 3* roster. I can manage about 600 points and can squeeze top 100 for 3* covers if I put some time and effort into it.

The 1k+ players in general seem to have developed 4* rosters, often able to present decent defence teams or else putting in boosted combos to climb.

The top 10 seems to be 5* champ land. The top players get to stomp it out atop Olympus.

greenglove

Sure, I have 14 champed (but not maxed) 4* characters, and 43 champed 3* (also not maxed) characters. I have 6 5* characters, but they are not usable yet. Even with so many 4* champs, it is almost impossible to get 1300 on a pvp score. When you get too close, BAM, you get hit with minus 150 in two very close hits, while you're trying to get a measly 30 points in a win.

The Herald

greenglove wrote:

Sure, I have 14 champed (but not maxed) 4* characters, and 43 champed 3* (also not maxed) characters. I have 6 5* characters, but they are not usable yet. Even with so many 4* champs, it is almost impossible to get 1300 on a pvp score. When you get too close, BAM, you get hit with minus 150 in two very close hits, while you're trying to get a measly 30 points in a win.

Yup. Sounds like hell.

3* plebs like me don't even bother, but 4* transitioner players seem to have it rough when they SHOULD be about the right point to play...

Bowgentle

greenglove wrote:

Sure, I have 14 champed (but not maxed) 4* characters, and 43 champed 3* (also not maxed) characters. I have 6 5* characters, but they are not usable yet. Even with so many 4* champs, it is almost impossible to get 1300 on a pvp score. When you get too close, BAM, you get hit with minus 150 in two very close hits, while you're trying to get a measly 30 points in a win.

Go to S4.
Problem fixed.

What does "champed but not maxed" 4*s mean?
With 14 level 270+ 4*s you should have zero problems hitting 1300, unless you play in S2.
In that case get the hell out of there.

I'd also like those 3 extra 3* chars that you have in addition to the 40 that are actually in the game

wymtime

greenglove wrote:

Sure, I have 14 champed (but not maxed) 4* characters, and 43 champed 3* (also not maxed) characters. I have 6 5* characters, but they are not usable yet. Even with so many 4* champs, it is almost impossible to get 1300 on a pvp score. When you get too close, BAM, you get hit with minus 150 in two very close hits, while you're trying to get a measly 30 points in a win.

To get to 1300 it is time to start coordinating with others. It is doable without but will take some shields and a lot of skip tax. Also if your 4* are not buffed you are going to be a bigger target. If you can get to 1000 without a shield you can hop with a 3,8,3 hop. The difficulty is finding teams to fight for enough points.
I would also disagree with your point about HP in the game. There is a ton of it with PVP, PVE, DPDQ vault, and champion rewards for 2* and 3*. Lots of HP available in the game for roster slots and shields.
The issue with PVP is players open up to everyone around 800+ points and this should not happen until 1k. Also there should be rewards st 1100 and 1200.

8punch

i wonder if this works.

just write every top player his name down when you know he is a shield hopper. the moment you see him playing. wait till he leaves a weak team. destroy it and shield?

would this actually work?

Bowgentle

8punch wrote:

i wonder if this works.

just write every top player his name down when you know he is a shield hopper. the moment you see him playing. wait till he leaves a weak team. destroy it and shield?

would this actually work?

It would certainly put you on the list of known snipers, which in turn will make your PVP experience kinda unpleasant.
Give the guys that leave easy teams 5-10 minutes before hitting, they're helping out the whole slice.

8punch

Bowgentle wrote:

8punch wrote:

i wonder if this works.

just write every top player his name down when you know he is a shield hopper. the moment you see him playing. wait till he leaves a weak team. destroy it and shield?

would this actually work?

It would certainly put you on the list of known snipers, which in turn will make your PVP experience kinda unpleasant.
Give the guys that leave easy teams 5-10 minutes before hitting, they're helping out the whole slice.

alright. noted thanks for the headsup if i get actually get into the 1000+ zone.

jobob

8punch wrote:

i wonder if this works.

just write every top player his name down when you know he is a shield hopper. the moment you see him playing. wait till he leaves a weak team. destroy it and shield?

would this actually work?

What Bowgentle said. Give them time to shield, otherwise you will get a reputation for sniping, which means you will take many, many more hits.

Best thing to do is just download LINE and get in a shield check room.

jobob

To the OP... I think #1 and #2 are mandatory for the PVP system, and changing it would be a mistake. You can't have a system where attacking someone 3,000 points below you is worth 75 points the same as hitting someone 1000 points above you. If you make that the case, and take away the point loss for losing to someone below you... then PVP just becomes who can play non-stop for the entire event and scores are going to be about 50,000 per event.

I think that what they need to do is have two running tallies... keep the current point total which includes points won - points loss and use that for placement. THEN, have one that only counts points won, without taking losses into effect, and use that for progression. Then you probably need to bump the progression requirement up a little, but I think if you earn enough points to hit progression- regardless of what you lose- you should get the reward.

carrion_pigeons

@The OP: are you complaining that pvp is too hard to compete in or that pvp competition is too unintuitive?

I'll definitely agree that the current system (which requires participation in the LINE community to arrange out-of-game cooperation) has some problems as far as game design goes, but if you actually want to overcome the problems you're upset about, you do have the means to do so.

Any high level alliance would probably be pretty happy to snag a player with your obvious level of commitment, aiming you're willing to start using Line.

Dragon_Nexus

Bowgentle wrote:

Go to S4.
Problem fixed.

Slice 3 is where it's at, IMO. Slice 4 gets stupidly competitive past the 800 point mark to the point where I was basically treading water once I got there. Slice 3 can be that way late on, but generally speaking I can get to 900 points without much difficulty and finish with high placement.

Even so, I haven't hit 1000 in ages. Nerfed 3*s this year really scuppered progress.

The Herald

Dragon_Nexus wrote:

Bowgentle wrote:

Problem fixed.

Slice 3 is where it's at, IMO. Slice 4 gets stupidly competitive past the 800 point mark to the point where I was basically treading water once I got there. Slice 3 can be that way late on, but generally speaking I can get to 900 points without much difficulty and finish with high placement.

Even so, I haven't hit 1000 in ages. Nerfed 3*s this year really scuppered progress.

Shhhhhhh! We're not aspposed to talk about the massive nerfing! The devs will get mad and hurt our rosters again....

jredd

Eliminating the skip tax would be nice too. probably spent 4-5k iso in skipping for the wasp pvp. 90% of the time it's just the same 3-5 teams on loop anyways. so, if skipping isn't actually going to skip you to someone different, why do we have to pay for it?

also, fix matchmaking so we don't get stuck in a loop with the same 3-5 teams.

acescracked

carrion pigeons wrote:

...
I'll definitely agree that the current system (which requires participation in the LINE community to arrange out-of-game cooperation) ....

Not true. Of course LINE helps but is not required to be successful.

MrCrowley

All it takes is committment and some shields to break 1.3k in S4.

I have 2 champed and maxed 4s and I can get 1.3k even with just 1 4s.

The sad thing is that it relies on hunting those weak "cupcake" teams. I try to not snipe right away.

You can get 225 points per hop, that means you can get from 850 points to 1.3k with 2-3 hops.

kidicarus

Bowgentle wrote:

8punch wrote:

i wonder if this works.

just write every top player his name down when you know he is a shield hopper. the moment you see him playing. wait till he leaves a weak team. destroy it and shield?

would this actually work?

It would certainly put you on the list of known snipers, which in turn will make your PVP experience kinda unpleasant.
Give the guys that leave easy teams 5-10 minutes before hitting, they're helping out the whole slice.

Seriously, if some guy is leaving cupcakes I'd give them 3 minutes max. Who on earth stays unshielded for 5-10 minutes with cupcakes out?

MrCrowley

The trick is to queue up the cupcakes to your 3 slots and then wait if you want.

The advantage of not waiting, particularly on the last of the 3 cakes you queue is that you might hit it 2-3 times.
This is sniping, but I dont really care about that.
I mostly care about having a predictable scoring for my shield hops, which means 3 cakes and a new shield up. Maybe 4 cakes if you can find one after the queued 3 cakes.

Obviously the time window for getting the cake in teh queue is short, around 3 min, and that is why there is coordination. People skip and call out any cakes to eliminate the need for everyone to skip all the time. Just do your part and occasionally look for the targets, calling them out if you find any. Then use your chat to find when someone else has found something to queue and quickly skip until you find those.

GrumpySmurf1002

acescracked wrote:

carrion pigeons wrote:

...
I'll definitely agree that the current system (which requires participation in the LINE community to arrange out-of-game cooperation) ....

Not true. Of course LINE helps but is not required to be successful.

Seconded.

There's virtually no difference in my scores, or my iso tax, between when I play in slice 3 (where I use LINE and check) and slice 4 (where I don't do either). In fact, my iso tax is generally higher in 3 by a couple hundred.

WelcomeDeath

greenglove wrote:

I would like to know when PVP is going to be fixed. Several huge problems make PVP astoundingly frustrating.

1. The higher up you go, the less reward you have in progression points. You get penalized for doing well.

Thats because your targets the higher you go are more likely to be shielded. Can't find a decent q? Shield up and check again in a bit, you will find your qs.

greenglove wrote:

2. The higher up you go, the more you get clobbered by someone attacking you. You can win two fights, only to lose all of those points because someone else beat you and copped 70 points off of you .

Again, thats because the higher you are, the more valuable your q is to others. If you shield hop, you are more likely to have positive gains during battles, as your q is hidden leading up to a battle, rather than hanging out for all to see.

greenglove wrote:

3. Then, when you've run out of health packs, you get to pay for the tremendous privilege of NOT PLAYING by having to shield.

So, climb twice. Once to get to a float point where you run out of packs, and fall. Come back later and climb as high as you can before shielding. Hop later from there.

greenglove wrote:

4. The cost of getting a head start in ap is also too expensive. 200 ISO for 5 AP? You guys could help a lot of people out with the chronic ISO shortage by making 5 AP cost 100 instead of 200.

I'd be ok with this, but seeing that it used to be cheaper AND you could get the boost all for iso instead of HP. Not likely to go back.

greenglove wrote:

I've been waiting for ages for D3 to fix these problems, which have been noted by MANY people before me. Right now, the only people who are NOT frustrated are the whalers, who can afford the HP, because it doesn't even affect the number of roster slots they can buy.

I dont know that you have to whale to get 1.3k. There are plenty of f2p guys that do it, theres probably guides here on forums on getting there. Spending 300 hp on shields
To use a 3 hr twice and an 8 hr shouldnt break the bank and certainly doesnt mean youre a whale. Those that spend do get there easier, but isnt that the whole point? This *is* a business after all. They couldnt keep the lights on if everyone were f2p.