Did they go too far with buffing Iron Man 3*

2

Comments

  • scottee
    scottee Posts: 1,610 Chairperson of the Boards
    So in summary...
    20three wrote:
    I'll always be bitter I trashed my 11 cover Iron Man like a week before the change was announced.
  • mckauhu
    mckauhu Posts: 740 Critical Contributor
    Absolutely not. His only good ability is yellow and then he self-stuns. Meanwhile he could get wiped out.
  • Xidex
    Xidex Posts: 12 Just Dropped In
    It's the only useful 3* in PvP when you have maxed 4*. Climbing with him reduces healtpack's spent numbers. All other 3* (including IW, SW, Loki, Hood) extremely useless (comparable to IM40) with Thora/JG or Thora/IceMan and so on.
  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    20three wrote:
    You think making one topic on the board mentioning how a character might need a nerf is enough to actually have the developers do something about it? Your naïveté is adorable.
    And your ignorance isn't. There have been plenty of player-unfriendly gamechanges that have been prompted by "a concerned citizen" making a post here.

    And since every PvP battle doesn't make you fight someone else's IM40, clearly he's not too strong. If you want to "fix" the game and make new friends, go make a thread that OML and Phx need a nerf.
  • Quebbster
    Quebbster Posts: 8,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    simonsez wrote:
    There have been plenty of player-unfriendly gamechanges that have been prompted by "a concerned citizen" making a post here.
    Do you have any proof of this? This seems relevant.
  • emaker27
    emaker27 Posts: 285 Mover and Shaker
    Quebbster wrote:
    simonsez wrote:
    There have been plenty of player-unfriendly gamechanges that have been prompted by "a concerned citizen" making a post here.
    Do you have any proof of this? This seems relevant.

    Searching this forum is a mess, and you'd have to compile dev's pre-release info with forum posts, and then their post release info. Legally it'd be circumstantial but it's happened repeatedly since the beginning of the game (no particular order):

    1. Venom - he could devour the entire team
    2. Loki - had a 3* Mags like board shuffle with damage
    3. Sentry
    4. X-Force and 4* Thor
    5. Mystique/2* Mags/Prof X
    6. Galactus
    7. 2* Thor
    8. 3* Spider-Man
    9. Venom, again (due to Miles) - probably the easiest forum thread to search for
    Many more...

    Of course dev has also made positive changes based on forum feedback which gets overlooked from time to time. Again, it's mostly circumstantial as well due to an overall lack of consistent communication.
  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    The change to Scarlet Witch's green is probably the most obvious example. Hell, "Phaserhawk" even became a verb, meaning "to open one's mouth about a game "feature" we'd prefer the devs didn't know about"

    So what's Latin for "Why would anyone assume the timing on posts and game fixes is coincidental, when we all know the devs don't do any playtesting?"
  • Crowl
    Crowl Posts: 1,580 Chairperson of the Boards
    The reality is that the game has moved on from 3* being the main focus and as a result most of the best 3* characters are now the ones that act as a battery or accelerators in some fashion for a more powerful partner.
  • alphabeta
    alphabeta Posts: 469 Mover and Shaker
    Quebbster wrote:
    simonsez wrote:
    There have been plenty of player-unfriendly gamechanges that have been prompted by "a concerned citizen" making a post here.
    Do you have any proof of this? This seems relevant.

    Galacticus run 1

    There are lots more examples but that the best case study - 'helpful' players posted things on forums - devs realised a smart player base had good tactics to take on shiny new baddy over buff at last minute as we got an unplayable supermess of an event, a player base pissed off and "meant to lose" type comments from the devs.
  • Dayv
    Dayv Posts: 4,449 Chairperson of the Boards
    Of course his yellow is overpowered now. But he's only a 3*, so even when he's buffed, he can't hang with buffed 4* or any 5* in competitive play. The overall depowering of the 3* tier makes IM40 reliance a phase that players go through, sort of like winfinite, until they reach a poiwer point where the OP technique has downsides.

    I mean, IM40 doesn't need nerfing anywhere near as much as a game-warping, constantly-healing damage machine like OML. Yeah, I said it.
  • smkspy
    smkspy Posts: 2,024 Chairperson of the Boards
    mckauhu wrote:
    Absolutely not. His only good ability is yellow and then he self-stuns. Meanwhile he could get wiped out.

    I disagree, both his red and blue are goon for finishing off a match. He can easily tale anyone out with 6000 health in shot and around 2000 health with his blue. Added damage bonus when teamed with IF strike tiles.

    It hsa to be timed perfectly, but it can end a match sooner.
  • Ulizeus
    Ulizeus Posts: 35
    For pvp is easy to limit matching yellow, I sometimes even let he fire yellow and kill him asap so his team is low on yellow for other abilities.
    For pve its a good support char for blue/red/green user and low purple users, like iron fist, a lot of people uses it with him. I have 7-8 3* champs, selling a few 2* max champed to get some iso, and very low on covers on my 4* , starting to rank top 20 even when missing the 4* essential and getting the 4* from new releases, Im40 is a good char to have cause you can team him with a lot of 4*, the new peggy comes to my mind, that yellow passive fits perfectly, you just need to throw any green/purple/black user and it will do nice after a few turns.
    It's not op, sometimes you cant match yellow and that slows a lot your recharge, the enemy team doesn't care about health packs, they sometimes have teams with feeders that speed a lot heroes abilities, like the node with cmags in dp event, that goon feeding blue, hes ready to use his ability even before you matched 2 times yellow (if mags dont match yellow) and wait for recharge to activate (2 turns more hoping that cmags dont match yellow again) and there are several more examples where it´s not insta win or easy win (been testing hulkbombing vs the last node where kingpin is, went easy but you need to take a lot of dmg) and I don't have winfinite, my luke have 4 covers (no red) and so on.

    TLDR: The good thing about im40 its that he fits everywhere, but the top 3* teams dont use it, 4* teams he start to be low on health and 5* land dont mention it icon_razz.gif.
  • Chrono_Tata
    Chrono_Tata Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
    smkspy wrote:
    mckauhu wrote:
    Absolutely not. His only good ability is yellow and then he self-stuns. Meanwhile he could get wiped out.

    I disagree, both his red and blue are goon for finishing off a match. He can easily tale anyone out with 6000 health in shot and around 2000 health with his blue. Added damage bonus when teamed with IF strike tiles.

    It hsa to be timed perfectly, but it can end a match sooner.
    Additionally, the yellow self-stunning is actually a GOOD thing in PvP. If you are using IM40, the chances are that you are bringing in other characters who can better use red and blue AP than IM40 himself.

    On defence, the AI will usually fire the most expensive powers available to it, and since IM40's red and blue are so expensive, they would get fired instead of other more useful powers. But due to IM stunning himself, this ensures that other powers will be fired by the AI.
  • BigRussian
    BigRussian Posts: 166 Tile Toppler
    OP is jelly because he trashed a character that they had announced an update to weeks before was actually changed.
  • mckauhu
    mckauhu Posts: 740 Critical Contributor
    smkspy wrote:
    mckauhu wrote:
    Absolutely not. His only good ability is yellow and then he self-stuns. Meanwhile he could get wiped out.

    I disagree, both his red and blue are goon for finishing off a match. He can easily tale anyone out with 6000 health in shot and around 2000 health with his blue. Added damage bonus when teamed with IF strike tiles.

    It hsa to be timed perfectly, but it can end a match sooner.

    I know he is great, but I dont want the devs to know that I think so
  • Quebbster
    Quebbster Posts: 8,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    emaker27 wrote:
    Quebbster wrote:
    simonsez wrote:
    There have been plenty of player-unfriendly gamechanges that have been prompted by "a concerned citizen" making a post here.
    Do you have any proof of this? This seems relevant.

    Searching this forum is a mess, and you'd have to compile dev's pre-release info with forum posts, and then their post release info. Legally it'd be circumstantial but it's happened repeatedly since the beginning of the game (no particular order):

    1. Venom - he could devour the entire team
    2. Loki - had a 3* Mags like board shuffle with damage
    3. Sentry
    4. X-Force and 4* Thor
    5. Mystique/2* Mags/Prof X
    6. Galactus
    7. 2* Thor
    8. 3* Spider-Man
    9. Venom, again (due to Miles) - probably the easiest forum thread to search for
    Many more...

    Of course dev has also made positive changes based on forum feedback which gets overlooked from time to time. Again, it's mostly circumstantial as well due to an overall lack of consistent communication.
    I Think many of these have less to do with forum posts and more to do with in-game metrics. Both the Thor/Wolverine (2* and 4*) nerfs are prime examples of this - if those two characters are head and shoulders above everyone else, why would you ever use anyone else? And if a disproportionate portion of the players use them (and not leveling other characters), that's something that should be fixed.
    Sentry is a bit of a special case though. I remember IceIX expressly saying he did not need to be fixed because he wasn't used that much in the big Picture (I guess "the entire high level play" tier is a small amount of their metrics). Then they changed their minds for unknown reasons - maybe too many players had started using Sentry? Maybe they decided to kill two birds with one stone when they were fixing Hood anyway? (OK, Hood was user prompted, but I don't Think that was brought up on the forum first, I Think the responsible party elevated the issue to the devs directly).
    As for Galactus, the preview was never said to be the definitive version. It might have been the version sent out for playtesting (yes, I Believe play testing happens), and the play testers pointed out that Star-Lord would be a problem, and the scenario was changed accordingly. I am not convinced the forum prompted this change either.
    I Think the devs are aware of a lot more problems than the forum goers. Their primary motivation is not to make an enjoyable game but to make Money though, so their decisions have to be seen in this light. The forum can absolutely be helpful in identifying exactly why some combination is troublesome, but I Think the devs are well aware of some problems.
  • theshadeofopal
    theshadeofopal Posts: 93 Match Maker
    I think he's just got a somewhat unique position in that he's still useful (when boosted) in pvp compared to other other 3*s. Ever since the damage nerf to abilities of +166 rendered most 3*s pointless for 4* rosters. Even boosted, other support characters like loki or hood are too frail, particularly on defense, to be useful in 4* land. Switch might be a bit of an exception but only feeding purple skills while having a weak green skill really limits her utility in parties. When boosted, Im40's significant acceleration of 3 colors, 1 passable if costly damage option, and relatively high health let him hang out in 4* land like most boosted 3*s used to.
  • Escape2victory
    Escape2victory Posts: 64
    For once, the devs actually did something to help many people. IM40 encourages me to use different red, blue, green casters and I like it. He's my rock now. Any nerfing would infuriate me to the point of quitting. He's actually injected some fresh life into gameplay.
  • Meander
    Meander Posts: 267 Mover and Shaker
    I think the new IM is a powerful enabler, but not OP. He wont win you many D wins at all, he wont win a match if he's the last one standing, but damn if he doesn't make 4hor (or any R/B/G user) hum. Much like Switch/GSBW with PX, or fist with HB/OML/black user, he isn't necessary to make his partners work, but he helps a ton.
  • Calnexin
    Calnexin Posts: 1,078 Chairperson of the Boards
    On offense he's now an awesome boost to other characters with the best nuke in 3* land.

    On defense, easily exploitable.

    I do believe he's the strongest 3*. I frequently use him in preference to boosted characters for hard nodes. I voted "too far", but I also feel if he were any less, I would say "not enough".

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