*facepalm* How does this happen, honestly???

rbdragon

So we have a new character release starting - well starting an hour ago. The event is a double ISO event.

How does a double ISO event for a new character go essentially completely unannounced? I mean the link to the "Unknown" character page was just posted what - two days ago?

Okay, so maybe they wanted the double ISO to be a nice, "found" surprise. Fine.

But a new release? A new EXCLUSIVE release?

So many people here talk about how clueless D3 is when it comes to it's players - clearly there's something to this. People plan their "MPQ Schedule" well in advance sometimes. Whether this is a good thing or not is irrelevant - it happens, and the devs know this, or at least they should after over 2 1/2 years.

Funny thing about this for me personally is it doesn't affect me - my schedule is one where I can easily move things around. But yet here I am really upset over this massive game-related oversight. Imagine how upset those who would have planned for it are going to be?

You cared so much about this character, again, this EXCLUSIVE character, that she was brought in with no fanfare at all. If you didn't care enough to promote her, why should we?

aesthetocyst

Communication is not their strength. Marketing is not their strength. They seem to be getting by without it. Could be doing a lot better with it, but I guess we'll never know. Perhaps they decided the RoI wasn't there, that increase in players and engagement would raise costs faster than sales.

Best marketing is always word of mouth anyway

acescracked

A lack of announcement "makes you really upset", say whaaa?? How upset do you get when you open 40 LTs and get zero 5*s or That you are playing the same pve storyline after 3 years (or a myarid of other issues)? No, it's the lack of announcement...haha!

I guess I should say to each their own but this forum has somewhat become a whinefest and btching about a lack of announcements just strikes me as hilarious. You know new characters come.all the time, look at the rewards and see the new character. There was a pop-up that said it's double iso. Wait for a fresh bracket, join and play.

Am I oversimplifying this?

Pylgrim

acescracked wrote:

A lack of announcement "makes you really upset", say whaaa?? How upset do you get when you open 40 LTs and get zero 5*s or That you are playing the same pve storyline after 3 years (or a myarid of other issues)? No, it's the lack of announcement...haha!

I guess I should say to each their own but this forum has somewhat become a whinefest and btching about a lack of announcements just strikes me as hilarious. You know new characters come.all the time, look at the rewards and see the new character. There was a pop-up that said it's double iso. Wait for a fresh bracket, join and play.

Am I oversimplifying this?

You are oversimplifying. I'm positive that the OP is perfectly aware of the issues that you mention and more. The fact that outstanding issues remain doesn't mean that new issues should be just shrugged, rather it shows compounding problems. The issues you mention? Have indeed been around for 3 years and we've learned to live with them for better or worse. Lack of communication or poor communication, too, has always been a problem. But this?

-A new character release.
-A character that is exclusive to MPQ.
-In a double ISO event.
-Coming only 7 days after the previous release event without any kind of big event looming in the future to justify shifted releases.

This is a new low in dropping the communication ball. I think it shows a worrying absence of caring from D3 and it is remarkable enough to make a thread about it. I really don't see the necessity of calling out the OP for it. If you are complacent ruminating bovinely day by day through old and new content alike, and being treated just as so by the people milking you at the beginning of the day, that's perfectly fine. That other people who have played games where the developers at least maintain a pretence of caring for their playerbase by interacting with them in a timely, professional and humane way, and as a result have higher standards should not be your concern, though.

revskip

acescracked wrote:

I guess I should say to each their own but this forum has somewhat become a whinefest and btching about a lack of announcements just strikes me as hilarious. You know new characters come.all the time, look at the rewards and see the new character. There was a pop-up that said it's double iso. Wait for a fresh bracket, join and play.

Am I oversimplifying this?

This is pretty much endemic of this forum. The user base complains even when they get what they want. People are constantly asking for more ISO, the devs release a second double iso event in the span of a month or so and instead of being happy about the ISO they complain loudly that they weren't told ahead of time.

And then despite the torrent of complaints they expect the devs to wade through the nonsense that is General Discussion and comment all the time even though if they do communicate it will only lead to a new complaint when the information given doesn't line up exactly with the forums expectations.

It never will line up with expectations of the top 1% of players. Mostly because the very loud minority of people who actually post on the forum are not even vaguely indicative of most average users and their playing/spending habits.

Pylgrim

revskip wrote:

This is pretty much endemic of this forum. The user base complains even when they get what they want. People are constantly asking for more ISO, the devs release a second double iso event in the span of a month or so and instead of being happy about the ISO they complain loudly that they weren't told ahead of time.

And then despite the torrent of complaints they expect the devs to wade through the nonsense that is General Discussion and comment all the time even though if they do communicate it will only lead to a new complaint when the information given doesn't line up exactly with the forums expectations.

It never will line up with expectations of the top 1% of players. Mostly because the very loud minority of people who actually post on the forum are not even vaguely indicative of most average users and their playing/spending habits.

You are misrepresenting the complaint. No one is complaining about double iso. In fact, there's a thread celebrating it. It's the lack of announcement what is the issue. Commanders of alliances use the advance notice to organise and plan ahead. This event dropped out of nowhere, at a time where it couldn't be expected (only 7 days after the previous release). I'm pretty sure that it took a lot of alliances by surprise.

Announcing this matter requires no "wading" through the forums. Although interaction with us is something that we've begged for, in vain, that's not even what is missing here. A thread announcing future special events (such as the release of an exclusive character in a much-demanded double iso event) is not some kind of extraordinary courtesy. it's called "generating hype" and it's one of the most basic PR and marketing tools for companies that like having engaged and happy customers.

revskip

Pylgrim wrote:

revskip wrote:

This is pretty much endemic of this forum. The user base complains even when they get what they want. People are constantly asking for more ISO, the devs release a second double iso event in the span of a month or so and instead of being happy about the ISO they complain loudly that they weren't told ahead of time.

And then despite the torrent of complaints they expect the devs to wade through the nonsense that is General Discussion and comment all the time even though if they do communicate it will only lead to a new complaint when the information given doesn't line up exactly with the forums expectations.

It never will line up with expectations of the top 1% of players. Mostly because the very loud minority of people who actually post on the forum are not even vaguely indicative of most average users and their playing/spending habits.

You are misrepresenting the complaint. No one is complaining about double iso. In fact, there's a thread celebrating it. It's the lack of announcement what is the issue. Commanders of alliances use the advance notice to organise and plan ahead. This event dropped out of nowhere, at a time where it couldn't be expected (only 7 days after the previous release). I'm pretty sure that it took a lot of alliances by surprise.

Announcing this matter requires no "wading" through the forums. Although interaction with us is something that we've begged for, in vain, that's not even what is missing here. A thread announcing future special events (such as the release of an exclusive character in a much-demanded double iso event) is not some kind of extraordinary courtesy. it's called "generating hype" and it's one of the most basic PR and marketing tools for companies that like having engaged and happy customers.

Except that lost in all of that is that the forumites are a tiny, tiny minority of the people actually playing the game. Most people playing the game aren't on the forum, should every decision the devs make immediately hit a splash screen in app? Does that sound reasonable?

Add to that the forumites do not necessarily receive communication in the most positive light. The former forum liaison Ice-X once made a communication on this forum that still receives almost daily ire and it happened a long, long time ago. I can bet with almost clock-like precision that within the week someone will post something along the lines of "You are supposed to lose". Which ironically wasn't even the main gist of his post but was made into a sort of mantra for the disenfranchised members of the forum at the time.

Add to that the fact that no one here knows exactly when the developers themselves knew that they were going to make this event double ISO. Asking for multiple weeks of notice when they themselves may not have made final decision to do so until the last couple of days or so is crazy.

My over-arching point is that if I were the developer I would not ever bother communicating with a group as unreasonable as this forum is. No matter what the communication is it has a good chance of not being well received and even if it is well received the forum will simply move on to the next complaint.

That doesn't mean there aren't valid complaints about the game. There are plenty. But not communicating positive moves they are making is a silly complaint. Better to be stoked about the positive move than complaining that you were not privy to every decision they make as soon as it is made.

Omega Red

Yeah devs, what's wrong with you? How dare you to do this without sending notice to my assistant at least two weeks in advance?! Now my meeting with the President will have to be postponed.

GrumpySmurf1002

While yeah the "Surprise! New Character!" motive of this event stinks, it would typically release this Thursday.

Which would put it right through the July 4th weekend, which every American player would've screamed bloody murder about (again). Perhaps this was their bone to those complaints.

brisashi

This does seem a little embarassing.

The event is well underway meanwhile the new character's page over on the character board is still listed as "unknown". I know they take the weekends off but it would have only taken a moment for a forum update.

aesthetocyst

Kinda sounds like the OP is being held hostage and being compelled to play.

Chasing loot under duress does take the fun edge off.

Im glad I still have my free will. I think.

90min to next PVE clear ... Ding ding says Pavlovs bell.

Bowgentle

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

While yeah the "Surprise! New Character!" motive of this event stinks, it would typically release this Thursday.

Which would put it right through the July 4th weekend, which every American player would've screamed bloody murder about (again). Perhaps this was their bone to those complaints.

I'm guessing that this is exactly what happened.
They probably switched in this event on Friday afternoon, then closed up shop without informing David.

And really, there are alliances that plan ahead for PVE? Seriously? o_o
I thought you either are a primarily PVE alliance that plays every PVE religiously regardless of rewards, or a primarily PVP alliance, then you merc in or out on the final day.
Only boss events require planning, usually.

FierceKiwi

Bowgentle wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

While yeah the "Surprise! New Character!" motive of this event stinks, it would typically release this Thursday.

Which would put it right through the July 4th weekend, which every American player would've screamed bloody murder about (again). Perhaps this was their bone to those complaints.

I'm guessing that this is exactly what happened.
They probably switched in this event on Friday afternoon, then closed up shop without informing David.

And really, there are alliances that plan ahead for PVE? Seriously? o_o
I thought you either are a primarily PVE alliance that plays every PVE religiously regardless of rewards, or a primarily PVP alliance, then you merc in or out on the final day.
Only boss events require planning, usually.

Fun theory...but someone at Demiurge/D3 must have known at least on Wednesday (I think that was even a day before Cthulu posted the Carter preview but I'm not sure) since it was Wednesday's data push in which the random "Recruit Peggy Carter in Unstable Iso-8...and oh yeah double ISO" string first appeared (or at least I first noticed it).

Pylgrim's alliance is a bit weird...from my understanding they only really worry about new character PvEs and are pretty much whatever the rest of the time...of course I could be completely wrong about that.

SnowcaTT

I grinded most of the first sub (S1) and didn't realize it was double ISO until a team-mate pointed it out...so I went back and grinded a bit more.

Should it be more obvious? Yes. Would an announcement be nice? Yes. Would double ISO always be nice? Yes.

Do I mind that it was a surprise and kind of randomly dropped in there? Absolutely not. Surprise me more often, please.

RoboDuck

FierceKiwi wrote:

Pylgrim's alliance is a bit weird...from my understanding they only really worry about new character PvEs and are pretty much whatever the rest of the time...of course I could be completely wrong about that.

Yep. We're top 100 for new characters, casual as hell for everything else. So unannounced mistimed events are an issue.

rbdragon

Those who are "calling me out" - I don't think you truly understand what bothered me about this, so I'll try to explain better.

This character is not just new, but is exclusive to this game. That's not been done before in this game. Yet they don't even bother to tell us not just about the event, but ANYTHING about her?

Every single character before her at the very least got some sort of mention beforehand. Hell, the consensus worst 4*, Cho, got his own event! Now I recognize this was a build up directly from Marvel, but still, Cho deserved his own event and Peggy Carter deserves......nothing?

I know the forum is not where most players are, but it is an official outlet for D3 to communicate with us. It takes literally a minute or two to start a new topic saying here's a new character, here's some info on her, and oh by the way, the event is double iso because she is special! I honestly don't think I'm being unreasonable to expect at least that. Besides, with all the negativity towards them lately, you would think they would like the praise that always comes when double iso is implemented.

I am well aware of the other issues plaguing this game lately. I guess I just got to a point with all the bugs and issues in the game currently that this was a "last straw" type of thing.

aesthetocyst wrote:

Kinda sounds like the OP is being held hostage and being compelled to play.

For the record, I don't feel obligated to play - I can stop whenever I want....now let me get back to the game - need to grind!!!

aesthetocyst

rbdragon wrote:

Those who are "calling me out" - I don't think you truly understand what bothered me about this, so I'll try to explain better.

This character is not just new, but is exclusive to this game. That's not been done before in this game. Yet they don't even bother to tell us not just about the event, but ANYTHING about her?

I hear you, rb. It IS weird, and it IS a missed opportunity (or at least has been so far...), but it's also the first time they've done a new character. Setting precedents internally and externally.

Perhaps D3 and Demi weren't on the same page here.

Perhaps was was to be released via DP vs starting next Thursday, when the usual "Piecing Together..." article would appear, but thing were rearranged.

Further perhaps there is a special event following DP vs. MPQ that required Cpt. Carter?

Could be many things ... bet we hear more about this tomorrow.

Perhaps whatever ... the day MPQ is being competently marketed, and the pubs/devs are consistently and proactively communicating, is the day I wonder who the new owners are and what they did with the crew we all know and loathe so well, harhar.

Looking forward to whatever may be revealed this week....it's to be a surprise, whether it should be or not

Pylgrim

revskip wrote:

Except that lost in all of that is that the forumites are a tiny, tiny minority of the people actually playing the game. Most people playing the game aren't on the forum, should every decision the devs make immediately hit a splash screen in app? Does that sound reasonable?

Add to that the forumites do not necessarily receive communication in the most positive light. The former forum liaison Ice-X once made a communication on this forum that still receives almost daily ire and it happened a long, long time ago. I can bet with almost clock-like precision that within the week someone will post something along the lines of "You are supposed to lose". Which ironically wasn't even the main gist of his post but was made into a sort of mantra for the disenfranchised members of the forum at the time.

Add to that the fact that no one here knows exactly when the developers themselves knew that they were going to make this event double ISO. Asking for multiple weeks of notice when they themselves may not have made final decision to do so until the last couple of days or so is crazy.

My over-arching point is that if I were the developer I would not ever bother communicating with a group as unreasonable as this forum is. No matter what the communication is it has a good chance of not being well received and even if it is well received the forum will simply move on to the next complaint.

That doesn't mean there aren't valid complaints about the game. There are plenty. But not communicating positive moves they are making is a silly complaint. Better to be stoked about the positive move than complaining that you were not privy to every decision they make as soon as it is made.

This post showcases why I was bothered by the aces' first post enough to reply. As I emphasised above, there's lots of misrepresentation and hyperbole when it comes for members of the forum to mock complaints that they don't share (something I myself have fallen into in the past, but I'm trying to improve).

No one is asking for weeks of advance for every little bit of detail. A few days or even hours and a general outline is enough. Again, it's not an unwarranted courtesy, it's basic PR. It's normal practice. It occurs to me that if any other company were to launch a product/service/update unannounced, they'd get lots of flak for it... but I don't know because that just doesn't happen. It is unheard of. Maybe because there are so many standing complaints about D3 some people feel like smaller ones like this one should be let slide?

On the matter of the forums being hostile: I easily remember the forums being akin to toxic waste. I remember because I fought very much against it, perhaps in the way you think you are doing it now. But the forums are nowhere as bad nowadays, and we're sadly carrying some kind of stigma. Yes, there are still a number of really negative, rude, whiny, entitled and inarticulate people, but they are far from "the majority" of the forums. If you pay attention, you'll notice that while some times there seems to be lots of negativity in general, it comes from the keyboards of the same small, old group of people. This doesn't mean that whenever someone expresses a concern they are part of that mindless nagging mentality, or that the complaint is dissmissible in principle. That negativity can usually be heard even amidst undeniable improvements? That, distressingly, is more a result of undeniable improvements being frequently marred by undeniable negatives. How awesome is the championing mechanic, for example? But it brought along an uncommunicated nerf for the boosted levels of 3*s. Should we really just be so grateful about the good that we shrug off the bad? It's something that we are paying for! it's within our rights to demand for a better service, or at the very least, better communication.

Sadly, we're kind of in a vicious cycle situation here. The forumites want open communication. The devs avoid the forums like hell because previous toxicity. The producers drop the ball constantly. The forumites feel abandoned and unrest grows, and the forums verge into toxicity again whenever the producers visibly drop the ball, etc. But it could be better! A couple months ago a developer(s) by the forum name of "bagman" dropped by in one of the many communication threads and offered an effort to be more communicative and to reopen a direct channel with us. They did warn about having a thin skin, understandably. If you check that thread, you'll notice that all the replies that followed were positive, polite and hopeful (maybe with the exception of one or two mildly sarcastic comments).

Unfortunately, "bagman" never returned, but it marked a precedent: if the devs reached out an olive branch, we'd be ready and anxious to grab it. Overly negative people will always exist, but they can be deal on a one-by-one case. There's no need to punish the whole forums for it. And yes, I understand that the forums represent a minority of the playerbase, but it is the enfranchised percentage, the ones who care. The way people in the forums react (again, disregarding the always negative people) is representative of what the whole player base feels in general. Increased communication between dev and players can only help improve the game for both parties so yeah, I believe that the communication issue is a bigger deal than, say, the sacred cow of issues, the lack of Iso.

Malcrof

New Character announcements for a long while now, have been done by Marvel.com first, before anything can be posted here. I am pretty sure this is a contractual thing. Marvel.com though , failed to acknowledge PegCap at all, in fact, doing a search of Google News for Peggy Carter, Puzzle Quest, and a few other keywords, shows no acknowledgment of this new character anywhere.

This is a first, ever.. Complaining about communication on something that d3/demi can do absolutely nothing about due to the contracts that make the game possible is just silly, but i do find the lack of anything at all , anywhere, about this new char.. a bit disturbing.

They did add her into the iso-8 storyline though, so they had been in the works for a while.. it looks like Marvel dropped the ball on this one.

brisashi

They still could have communicated the fact that there was an upcoming double iso event with a surprise new character release outside of the normal schedule without revealing the identity of the new character, contractual agreements or no.

JVReal

It came as a surprise to me when I logged in yesterday and a popup came in announcing the new character, I scanned it and dismissed it, but as I clicked the x, I thought I read double-iso, but I was so used to dismissing the pop-up, I almost missed it. I went back into the "Today's News" section and re-read the pop-up.

It was a happy discovery. I shared the screenshot I took with my alliance mates and they were excited too because some of them blew by the pop-up when they started up the game.

You would think that D3 would take every advantage of the opportunity for positive press and announce the Double Iso event. Especially since many people have asked about it. It's the perfect time for it too, with people pulling their tokens at the end of the season and having to level some of their newly cover-maxed characters... like me, I pulled my 13th Cyclops cover, and now I have to bring him up from level 210, so I will be playing this PVE as much as I can and focus on getting all the Iso i can... if I happen to get a Miss America while I'm at it... Bonus!

I don't think the OP meant for it as much as a complaint that they didn't do it, but as being totally at a loss for why they didn't take advantage of something that would have been a net positive for their reputation.

Especially when people just finished up the season and usually take PVP breaks and are readily available to play the PVE event.

If they did bump it because they didn't want it to run over the 4th of July weekend... My thanks to them!