I dont understand what was wrong with the old PVE

slidecage

i mean if they wanted to go pure progession okay why didnt they just leave the way the game is set up now instead of doing all of these test with making the game scale higher.

Why didnt they just go pure progression and leave the pve scaling alone

TxMoose

for a broad, lower segment of the playerbase, pve scaling was broken by the 5*s (kinda like other parts of the game). scaling exceeded the ability of 3* transition rosters once you had 1 and especially 2 5* characters. we know that its best to hoard LTs until you can handle the scaling, but the forumites are a small percentage of the playerbase and most have no strategy other than, get stuff, open it, and figure out what to do with it. so, I think in their attempt to 'fix' scaling, they thought, "lets fix some other stuff that doesn't work well", so they started throwing darts at the dartboard with several variables at once and the results must really be jumbled up as to what system change contributed to what changes they saw in play/performance.

personally I agree - I could perform ok in the old system without 'excessive' effort. personally I think its much more healthy to encourage a handful of moderate play sessions a day rather than develop a system where optimal involves sitting down for 5-6 hours in one shot (first sub being 48 hrs really exacerbates that point). after grinding on this a while, I'm not sure i'll ever be playing for placement here. optimal is way too big of a solid play chunk out of the day and the top nodes get too high to still be 'fun'. they said they wanted there to be an advantage to leveling your roster, but then lifted the level cap on the enemies. when they communicate, half the time they say one thing and do another and I just don't trust them much any more. core of the game is still fun, so I continue to play.

elusive

Just a quick question concerning the tip to hoard Lightning Tokens until you can handle the 5 star scaling: how am I expected to build a 4 star team if I don't open them? PvP is ridiculously broken for me, and the 25 CP from PvE progression is realistically the only avenue available to my 3 star team to make the transition to 4 stars. Am I supposed to keep hoarding them for years until I have enough to guarantee that I get at least one fully covered 4 star, especially now that they're releasing new ones and diluting the pool at a much faster rate?

bigwhoop

I really hope dev's ultimate goal is to completely remove the placement reward section of PVE. The progression reward list can be extend and can make the max point progression to be a 4* cover.

If that's dev's ultimate goal, make PVE to be truly PVE, then everything they are doing makes total sense. I actually really enjoy the current format. The scaling gets hard but not impossible. Plus, I can play whenever I have some time instead taking extended bathroom around 3PM to make the timely clear.

***fingers crossed***

TxMoose

elusive wrote:

Just a quick question concerning the tip to hoard Lightning Tokens until you can handle the 5 star scaling: how am I expected to build a 4 star team if I don't open them? PvP is ridiculously broken for me, and the 25 CP from PvE progression is realistically the only avenue available to my 3 star team to make the transition to 4 stars. Am I supposed to keep hoarding them for years until I have enough to guarantee that I get at least one fully covered 4 star, especially now that they're releasing new ones and diluting the pool at a much faster rate?

the general consensus is that once you have a broad stable of champed 3*s to where you have multiple boosted 3s every week, you're ready, since 255s won't increase your average of your top characters that much. before that, 4s are just collecting and won't be usable anyway and generally just costing you hp. it is especially crucial for f2p players to do that portion optimally or they just continually find themselves having to sell stuff that they don't really need to have sold if they just left their Legendary tokens be until a later date.

the people it breaks the scaling for are ones with maybe a handful of covered 3s maybe at level 120 and a bunch of 5-10 cover 3*s with a handful of 1-2 cover 4s - basically 2*->3* transitioners. when that roster opens 4*s it does nothing for them other than cost them hp way before it needs to. and a 5 basically kills that roster's mpq experience.

slidecage

TxMoose wrote:

for a broad, lower segment of the playerbase, pve scaling was broken by the 5*s (kinda like other parts of the game). scaling exceeded the ability of 3* transition rosters once you had 1 and especially 2 5* characters. we know that its best to hoard LTs until you can handle the scaling, but the forumites are a small percentage of the playerbase and most have no strategy other than, get stuff, open it, and figure out what to do with it. so, I think in their attempt to 'fix' scaling, they thought, "lets fix some other stuff that doesn't work well", so they started throwing darts at the dartboard with several variables at once and the results must really be jumbled up as to what system change contributed to what changes they saw in play/performance.

personally I agree - I could perform ok in the old system without 'excessive' effort. personally I think its much more healthy to encourage a handful of moderate play sessions a day rather than develop a system where optimal involves sitting down for 5-6 hours in one shot (first sub being 48 hrs really exacerbates that point). after grinding on this a while, I'm not sure i'll ever be playing for placement here. optimal is way too big of a solid play chunk out of the day and the top nodes get too high to still be 'fun'. they said they wanted there to be an advantage to leveling your roster, but then lifted the level cap on the enemies. when they communicate, half the time they say one thing and do another and I just don't trust them much any more. core of the game is still fun, so I continue to play.

I seen people with 2 5 stars and nothing higher then 94 take top 10


i would be for pure progression if they went back to the old PVE ranking these ranking jacking up to 300 instead of 160 where my Ess were is just unplayable

TxMoose

ok, big exception for oml yellow. that damn cover is basically everything in this game. that, ss blue, and phx green might be beneficial to any roster, no matter the level.

brisashi

It never worked for someone like me.

I've never been able to shoot for high placement because I have a schedule that doesn't allow me to come back and play the game at 8 hour intervals. The new system has its drawbacks, but for me I was able to finish in the top 10 of this first sub, something I couldn't do before.

OneLastGambit

Waking up at 4am to clear.

Missing clears because I think tim4 with my family is more important.

The 8 hour refresh schedule sucked. Plain and simple. Its probably awesome if you have no job, no responsibilities and no family or partner. But if you have any of the above then you're forced to choose...mpq will never win that ultimatum for me.

Mawtful

Player engagement metrics
Also money, amirite?

hodayathink

The 8 hour timer is basically only good for people who can't stop themselves from playing (whether because of compulsion or competitiveness). For everyone else, going sans timer is better.

And the reason they won't go to full progression is because they believe that scarcity of covers is important,, and they know no matter how high they place the progression target for 4* covers, more than 1% of people are going to reach it.

veny

Point system is limiting, forcing us to play at certain hour, or even minute for maximal efficiency... all in all, this is the only thing i would change.

DFiPL

TxMoose wrote:

ok, big exception for oml yellow. that damn cover is basically everything in this game. that, ss blue, and phx green might be beneficial to any roster, no matter the level.

I have PHX but I'm finding I basically never use it. GG on the other hand is extraordinarily useful teamed with and

HxiiiK

I have no complaints with the new format, only to echo other players' sentiments, devs please make the reward progression instead of placement!

I have been consistently in the t10-t20 range past few PvEs (save for Kate's PvE release because I was out with friends) and quite frankly it is extremely tiresome. I do see the same people grinding extremely optimally and clean out all the points on the table. And that's good for them, but I have to fight and arrange my schedule according to the 8hr refresh so that I maintain t10-t20.

This new format has been extremely enjoyable for me. Plenty of rewards on the table, ability to play anytime I want. MPQ becomes the pick up and play game it should always have been! Just take that last step and change to progression, then MPQ will become fun (again?) I can't remember the last time it was THIS fun and afforded me so much freedom! Great change!

ZeroKarma

OneLastGambit wrote:

Waking up at 4am to clear.

Missing clears because I think tim4 with my family is more important.

The 8 hour refresh schedule sucked. Plain and simple. Its probably awesome if you have no job, no responsibilities and no family or partner. But if you have any of the above then you're forced to choose...mpq will never win that ultimatum for me.

I've heard this several times and I have to ask, do you mean being able to make progs on the old system is harder than this when you have a family and job? Certainly not placement.

I can squeeze a 20 minute clear in the morning, one around lunch and then grind a little before dinner and place well. With this system, you have to ignore everything in your life for four hours if you want to place well. Four straight hours of video game play, which I cannot seem to budget anywhere in my day.

Bowgentle

ZeroKarma wrote:

OneLastGambit wrote:

Waking up at 4am to clear.

Missing clears because I think tim4 with my family is more important.

The 8 hour refresh schedule sucked. Plain and simple. Its probably awesome if you have no job, no responsibilities and no family or partner. But if you have any of the above then you're forced to choose...mpq will never win that ultimatum for me.

I've heard this several times and I have to ask, do you mean being able to make progs on the old system is harder than this when you have a family and job? Certainly not placement.

I can squeeze a 20 minute clear in the morning, one around lunch and then grind a little before dinner and place well. With this system, you have to ignore everything in your life for four hours if you want to place well. Four straight hours of video game play, which I cannot seem to budget anywhere in my day.

Also, I haven't had to get up at 4am ever since they introduced time slices.
Just pick a slice that lets you do a clear when the sub starts, then do another one before bed at not quite full points.

Works for T10 every time I want to go for it, no need to sacrifice sleep.

Of course it won't work for T2, but if you're going for T2 in a release PVE you need to seek professional help.

OneLastGambit

Bowgentle wrote:

ZeroKarma wrote:

OneLastGambit wrote:

Waking up at 4am to clear.

Missing clears because I think tim4 with my family is more important.

The 8 hour refresh schedule sucked. Plain and simple. Its probably awesome if you have no job, no responsibilities and no family or partner. But if you have any of the above then you're forced to choose...mpq will never win that ultimatum for me.

I've heard this several times and I have to ask, do you mean being able to make progs on the old system is harder than this when you have a family and job? Certainly not placement.

I can squeeze a 20 minute clear in the morning, one around lunch and then grind a little before dinner and place well. With this system, you have to ignore everything in your life for four hours if you want to place well. Four straight hours of video game play, which I cannot seem to budget anywhere in my day.

Also, I haven't had to get up at 4am ever since they introduced time slices.
Just pick a slice that lets you do a clear when the sub starts, then do another one before bed at not quite full points.

Works for T10 every time I want to go for it, no need to sacrifice sleep.

Of course it won't work for T2, but if you're going for T2 in a release PVE you need to seek professional help.

The slices aren't really convenient for me and while slices are an improvement surely playing to your own schedule is the best system over everything.

There's only 2 slices that finish at times that I can actually play, that doesn't seem important unless you play for t10 and need to grind at the end of it.

If you're only interested in max progression then you don't need to consider your points at all since this is ridiculously easy to achieve. I can get max prog even after skipping 60% of the event. But 25 cp isn't as helpful when you start cover maxing 4* (i've pulled star Lord pink and fury pink 19 and 14 times respectively and that was after I'd already maxed them) so aiming for stated covers is the best way to progress. There's two ways to get this 1k in PvP or t10 pve. Both of which I attempt.

Which brings me to another point, if you're a hybrid player (my alliance is) then trying to do both of these when you only have 2 slices available to you gets pretty tough as those slices aren't far enough apart to allow health pack regen.

The current test pve means I can play it whenever I want, couple of nodes here, couple of nodes there and I never have to do any full clears so managing my time is far easier.

Crowl

slidecage wrote:

i mean if they wanted to go pure progession okay why didnt they just leave the way the game is set up now instead of doing all of these test with making the game scale higher.

Why didnt they just go pure progression and leave the pve scaling alone

The old system was flawed due to the impact of 5* on scaling, the way it encouraged people to soft-cap their rosters and by the inflexibility when it came to clearing, so the tests have tried to address these failings with varying degrees of success.

slidecage

Crowl wrote:

slidecage wrote:

i mean if they wanted to go pure progession okay why didnt they just leave the way the game is set up now instead of doing all of these test with making the game scale higher.

Why didnt they just go pure progression and leave the pve scaling alone

The old system was flawed due to the impact of 5* on scaling, the way it encouraged people to soft-cap their rosters and by the inflexibility when it came to clearing, so the tests have tried to address these failings with varying degrees of success.

thank you and to the rest who posted stuff like this....it mostly answers my question.

smkspy

Nothing was wrong with it, then they introduced 5 stars, end of story.

Crowl

smkspy wrote:

Nothing was wrong with it, then they introduced 5 stars, end of story.

Soft-capping giving an advantage and scheduled playing were still a problem before 5*'s.