** Hawkeye (Modern) ** [PRE 2014-09]



  • Spoit
    Spoit Posts: 3,441 Chairperson of the Boards
    Really all he needs is the ability to chose which red/blue tile his countdown goes on. (though maybe a tad less damage if that is the case, as it is, he theoretically has one of the best damage/AP ratios, balanced out by his attacks failing so often)
  • There are countless solutions but it´s pointless unless the issues are clear. I think what holds him back is:
    1. Unreliability: Boardclearing is simply to easy to have high CD Timers up. Maybe they were designed with other match3 system in mind, 4 matches don´t clear a row in all of them. It really doesn´t help that the tile is placed randomly.
    2. Delay: Not only do you have to match 4 times to fire an ability it also has a delay. That way his red is 2/3 as effective since usually one enemy is already dead. His Blue in turn "wastes" the stun since to target is likely to just die to it.

    What isn´t bad:
    Damage: IF his stuff goes off it´s overkill.

    The dodge is bad in the context that you aren´t particularly interested in having him die last. It´s also a bit wonky since it´s actually based on placement in the picking screen. To top it off it´s largely unnecessary in offense (which is the actually interesting part) since you can manipulate who gets hit anyway (and if you have Wolverine + OBW he won´t go in front on any color). No matter how great it is in defense in practice we want our Heroes to be awesome when we activly use them.
  • M. Hawkeye's avoid can be stopped, if you stun him with Spider-Man or Black Widow. Since they are not damaging him, he will not dodge, once stunned it stops his power completely.
  • Pwuz_
    Pwuz_ Posts: 1,213 Chairperson of the Boards
    Good to know, but how often is it needed? I've rarely found myself focusing on M.Hawkeye in groups since all of his attacks can be countered or at the least planned for in the case of his blue.

    Even without Avoid making him occasionally jump to the back, I find myself leaving him till last most of the time.
  • I agree completely, I happened to fight one and stunned him completely on accident. It was an interesting tidbit so I thought I should share. A 230 M. Hawkeye is nothing to laugh at. icon_e_smile.gif
  • For me the worst part of Hawkeye's skill is the fact that you can't target him even with skills that deal damage to the entire team. While I can understand that he can Avoid attacks by "hiding" behind others but when there's nowhere to hide (we're talking about AOE attacks after all), he should get hit. Otherwise just change his skill (and the description) so that instead of using a teammate as a human shield 100% of the time, Hawkeye has an xx% chance to avoid any attack due to his incredible agility. This % should increase with covers invested and, of course, levelling up, not only with the number of purple tiles on the board. The cap should be somewhere around 66%, giving him 2 chances in 3 to completely avoid ANY attack, but also giving the enemy team a chance (1/3) to hit him with direct or AOE attacks.
  • Phaserhawk
    Phaserhawk Posts: 2,676 Chairperson of the Boards
    This is such a cool character that with just the smallest of tweaks would become a staple in many peoples decks. I agree with the consensus, if you could place the tiles his utility goes up exponentially. I'm okay with countdown tiles, but I think a character should have at least one form of direct instant damage, that's where hawkeye is lacking. I would be cool if his blue was CD placement and I wish his red did less damage, at less cost and you could target any tile to destroy, period, one tile. POP!!!!, regardless of whatever, Hawkeye could be the ultimate counter to IW, or Ares, Red. 6AP, 500-750 Damage, destroy anyone tile, you do not generate AP (or maybe you do) here's my version

    Hawkeye (Modern)
    2 Star Rarity (Uncommon)

    Electric Arrow - Blue 12 AP
    Hawkeye shoots a charged arrow, you place a Blue Countdown tile anywhere on the board. It activates after 4 turns, dealing 200 to the entire team and stunning current targe for 2 turns. (similiar to classic storm)
    Level Upgrades
    Level 2: Stuns enemy for 3 turns.
    Level 3: Reduces countdown to 3 turns.
    Level 4: Stuns enemy for 4 turns.
    Level 5: Reduces countdown to 2 turns.

    Blast Arrow - Red 6 AP
    Hawkeye shoots an explosive arrow, you may destroy any one basic tile, it deals 60 damage to current target.
    Level Upgrades
    Level 2: +25% damage.
    Level 3: Target any Critical, Defensive, Attack, or Web Tile.
    Level 4: +25% damage.
    Level 5: Target any tile.

    Avoid - Purple Passive
    (PASSIVE) If there are more than 8 Purple tiles on the board, Hawkeye leaps out of the way of attacks, moving to the back of the team and healing for 50.
    Level Upgrades
    Level 2: Requires 7 Purple tiles.
    Level 3: Requires 6 Purple tiles.
    Level 4: Requires 5 Purple tiles.
    Level 5: Requires 4 Purple tiles.

    My other thought, and it would tie all skills into each other. If you keep Hawkeye as is (still allow for placement of tiles) each time he dodges an attack it reduces countdown tiles by one, that would be interesting, but I like my heal idea as well
  • All passive skills can be negated by stunning the character first.

    Avoiding AE doesn't really do much because someone just gets hit twice, and a lot of the time that's worse than Hawkeye just taking his fair share of the damage.
  • Scenario: Modern Hawkeye is on the front of the enemy team. I try to attack him but there are too many purple tiles on the board so he jumps to the back of the enemy team and lets his team mate take the damage instead. Nothing strange there, his ability works like it should.

    Another scenario: Modern Hawkeye is once again on the front of the team. I attack the WHOLE team with Classic Storm's Windstorm attack, that should damage the whole team. Once again, too many purple tiles and Hawkeye jumps to the back of the team and...isn't damaged at all! How is that even possible? Avoiding one hit, sure, but avoiding a team wide attack??? icon_eek.gif

    This is a serious bug!
  • NighteyesGrisu
    NighteyesGrisu Posts: 563 Critical Contributor
    IIRC he jumps behind a teammate who then gets hawkeye's damage as well as his own so I think it's not a bug. Besides, Modern Hawkeye needs all the help he can get...
  • So what you're saying is that instead of Hawkeye, Juggernaut and Thor getting 1000 points of damage each from Windstorm, Hawkeye is unscathed and Juggy or Thor gets another 1000 damage? I have not seen that happen, only that Juggy and Thor gets 1000 damage each and Hawkeye escapes the damage completely.
  • I have had exactly the same thing, makes him incredibly annoying and hard to kill sometimes. I, like you, assumed Wind Storm would damage the team, I see no way to avoid damage by jumping to the back when the power being used would normally attack the person in the back, seems ridiculous!

    Mind you, as NighteyesGrisu says he does need all the help he can get icon_e_biggrin.gif

    It is rather an unfitting power though, since when has Hawkeye been a coward? he would be in the front line swinging his bow even if he had no arrows left!
  • turul
    turul Posts: 1,622 Chairperson of the Boards
    Also, if invisiility does not deflect AOE damage, avoid shouldnt either.
  • Tested this several times today. If the ENTIRE team is alive, Hawkeye will avoid.
    If one person is dead, the enemy Hawkeye will actually get stunned and take damage.

    Obviously if only Hawkeye is alive he takes the hit as well.

    Somewhat inconsistent, not sure if working as intended with C.Storms windstorm.
  • I'm okay with that little bugger jumping out of harm's way IF someone else takes the damage. Windstorm and other such area effect abilities should still damage the whole team and if it doesn't, and Hawkeye is still supposed to live (highly illogical) Windstorm should at least make double damage on one other character.

    He's bloody annoying that Modern Hawkeye...and not very good. His abilities are powerful but way too slow.
  • wirius
    wirius Posts: 667
    Target Hawkeye as the main guy of storm's ability, and it will stun him. He will then also take the damage.
  • wirius wrote:
    Target Hawkeye as the main guy of storm's ability, and it will stun him. He will then also take the damage.

    And you've tried that and know it to be true? Okay, I'll try it myself, but so far, I've only seen him jump away. Maybe he didn't jump away in your match because there was too few purple tiles on the board?
  • After using Hawkeye in several events now, I have seen some good uses with Hawkeye. I don't think they really need to get rid of Avoid, as this makes him a somewhat hard team member to damage, and being able to shift the damage elsewhere is a huge advantage. However, dealing double damage to the Avoid target has become somewhat exploitable with hulk, easily making enough green from his passive to seriously consider changing the damage to being only one tick and eliminate Hawkeyes entirely.

    His utilizing CD tiles is an irritation both for and against whatever team he is on. If he should be changed anywhere, it should be with the CD tiles. I would even go so far as to say reduce the damage of the abilities if at rank 5 it reduces the turn down to one from two.

    He is somewhat of a niche character due to his Avoid, but pairing him with those that can negate or utilize the passed damage really makes him useful if you can mitigate it.
  • I agree with you. Running him with The Hood is spectacular btw.

    Here is the beauty of mHawkeye: Avoid keeps him up long enough that if the other two members go down with power hits, the other team has to wait to ramp up their abilities again. You have enough time to get the AP and set his timers, and the other team can't take them all out. The damage is high enough to make a big dent and sometimes win. So mHawkeye's biggest strength is actually facing OP teams that would normally be a lost cause. I like that he's so counterintuitive.

    This also makes IM40 a worthy foe or a worthy ally.

    That said I haven't leveled him to max yet. I want to, but there is always someone else who is better. Because the above scenario isn't a sure thing and it's a desperate measure.
  • Hmmm, surprised the Hawk post isn't more active, given that we're ... encouraged to use him in the event.

    As far as his problems go, I really do think they could be fixed with an easy change: let us target his coutdown tiles. CD skills are inherently weaker anyway, so why not let us pick like you can with Cap. And for a marksman like Hawkeye, it just makes sense that he should be able to choose where to place his tiles!
This discussion has been closed.