Veteran PVE Brackets Are Bad

mpqr7

People on this forum pressured me to do 5-6 clears per day. I'm now at over 100,000 points on this endless 7-day pve, and I'm still not even in the top 100!! I have alliance-mates who have 90,000 points, and they're number one!!

There should be a point where if you play enough (and isn't 2-3 hours per day enough?!?!), you just get the new cover.

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it, while others get n00b brackets and win lots of covers with lower PVE scores.

I get the idea of Veteran PVP bracket, because people with higher level rosters should fight others with higher level rosters, plus the placement rewards in PVP don't really matter.. you don't need to place near the top to get new releases. And the higher people score in PVP, the easier it is for others to get to 1300.


But there's no reason for Veteran PVE brackets. It's just punishment for the sake of punishment.

SnowcaTT

mpqr7 wrote:

There should be a point where if you play enough (and isn't 2-3 hours per day enough?!?!), you just get the new cover.

This would be called "all rewards are progression rather than competition" that folks have been begging to have for over a year.

Instead PV"E" is just PVP in disguise.

puppychow

I'm sorry to hear about your frustration over not making t100 individually. Hopefully, you can jump into a t100 alliance and get your bucky that way.

The thing is, people are simply drooling over the idea of getting a 5* cover for free from the cw event. And thus, Hulk pve is highly competitively no matter which bracket you landed in. Even taking your 90k points example--the players probably had to push a bit to stay in the hunt for a bucky.

If we were to eliminate vet brackets, then newer players would be less likely to have a shot at bucky, and thus the player base will shrink due to newcomers quitting. That has not been the case right now, and I suspect the use of vet brackets is a partial reason for this. Thus, I think the game devs made a conscious decision to grow the playerbase at the cost of inconveniencing a portion of the veteran base.

Also, I think the 80 cover vault with a new cover added is another way for the game devs to ensure all players have a chance at the cover. Obviously not everyone will blow a hundred bucks to clean out the vault, but at least players now have that choice, rather than staring at a 0.2% chance at pulling a bucky.

BlackSheep101

puppychow wrote:

The thing is, people are simply drooling over the idea of getting a 5* cover for free from the cw event. And thus, Hulk pve is highly competitively no matter which bracket you landed in. Even taking your 90k points example--the players probably had to push a bit to stay in the hunt for a bucky.

If this experience were peculiar to Winter Soldier's release, you'd have a point, but this type of thing happens on every new character release. The OP already cited one far less competitive bracket than his, and my own bracket is somewhere between mpqr7's and his alliance-mate's. 90,000 is good for top 50 for me so far. I've missed clears and done incomplete grinds, but I know I'm getting at least one WS cover.

If you wind up in a bracket with many motivated players, you can play very hard and still wind up on the outside looking in. Meanwhile, folks that join a few hours after can take a nice, leisurely stroll to top 50 or grind hard for top 20. It's a terrible gameplay experience, and a bad model for releasing rewards.

TxMoose

puppychow wrote:

The thing is, people are simply drooling over the idea of getting a 5* cover for free from the cw event....

lmao....good one. people are drooling, true. if they think it'll be free, they be fooling. 9mil round 8

LegendReborn

Speaking as a vet who has worked his way up largely through pve, vet brackets are not the issue. Why do seasoned players deserve to **** on lower tier players more than they already do? I agree that a pseudo pvp in the form of pve doesn't feel like we're fighting the ai but instead each other, which is 100% true.

Current pve, the pve changes they've proposed to us, and, pvp, for the most part, have been competitions of will and endurance. It would be nice if pve was truly moved toward a progression system but saying that vet brackets should be demolished for what boils down to you wanting an easier top 100 isn't a good argument.

If you want to go poop all over weaker players in pve, go take a break from pve for 3 or 4 weeks. I did it and I just felt bad trouncing players around me who only a handful had the essentials and even fewer knew how to properly grind.

SnowcaTT

The joke is getting the covers like I do 60-70% of the time: with less than 24 hours of play. It makes me feel bad for those who have stories like OP - but even worse for those who grinded for 7 full days.

Jumped into S1 yesterday. One full clear + ~1/3rd of a proper grind and Bucky is on my roster this morning.

Not how you intended D3? How about putting that 4* cover as the final progression instead, limiting the late bracket-jumpers like myself?

Killinstinct

They should differ the rewards between the brackets. For instance top 150 in a vet bracket will get the 4*, while only top 50 in a noon bracket will get the 4*. This would be a fair solution...

apexpredator85

This 1000%. I grind every PVE to get new characters and finish T100 during most events hitting progression rewards. I quit playing for about 2 weeks because burnout and life getting in the way and the 2 events following coming back I did minimal play, didn't come close to progression. Started at the normal time and was easily top 10. Rewarded for not playing for a couple weeks? That doesn't seem fair. Although I did enjoy the top 10

Darknes21

mpqr7 wrote:

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it, while others get n00b brackets and win lots of covers with lower PVE scores.

News flash life is not fair! Why should MPQ be fair! I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

TheWerebison

Darknes21 wrote:

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it...

mpqr7 wrote:

I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

Boldness mine. He already stated that he is working hard for the rewards. Good job on reading comprehension.

Also, I normally ignore this, but since you started the pettiness wars: it's "we live in a world where..." Where, not were.

Gmax101

Darknes21 wrote:

mpqr7 wrote:

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it, while others get n00b brackets and win lots of covers with lower PVE scores.

News flash life is not fair! Why should MPQ be fair! I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

I certainly don't want things for free... but there should be a "do the work and get the prize" approach, rather than do the work and don't get anything while other people don't do the work and do get the prize" logic...

But that is the whole progression only argument....

Nobody complains when the final progression in Civil War is a 5*, in fact, its a good thing. Do the work and get the prize

But would it be fair for an alliance to do the work and not get the prize cos 11 other alliances ground more?

Which is essentially the argument with PVE Placement awards....

mpqr7

Killinstinct wrote:

They should differ the rewards between the brackets. For instance top 150 in a vet bracket will get the 4*, while only top 50 in a noon bracket will get the 4*. This would be a fair solution...

This would be great. FYI I'm at 110,000.. still probably won't break top 100.

News flash life is not fair! Why should MPQ be fair! I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

I don't see how scoring well above top progression qualifies as "not working".

TxMoose

Gmax101 wrote:

Darknes21 wrote:

mpqr7 wrote:

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it, while others get n00b brackets and win lots of covers with lower PVE scores.

News flash life is not fair! Why should MPQ be fair! I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

I certainly don't want things for free... but there should be a "do the work and get the prize" approach, rather than do the work and don't get anything while other people don't do the work and do get the prize" logic...

But that is the whole progression only argument....

Nobody complains when the final progression in Civil War is a 5*, in fact, its a good thing. Do the work and get the prize

But would it be fair for an alliance to do the work and not get the prize cos 11 other alliances ground more?

Which is essentially the argument with PVE Placement awards....

its also about risk management and working efficiently for what you want. playing the fresh bracket game can be dicey and sometimes you lose if there are multiple brackets open. the iso shortage is so immense that I'd probably prefer at this point to play the entire week and just miss out on something (i.e. 21st or 101st) since I still got the iso, tokens, and hp/cp along the way, which the bracket snipers don't end up with. the only thing it really affects is the bucky essential on cap's side which could be avoided by going team IM anyway.

Darknes21

"mpqr7 wrote:

FYI I'm at 110,000.. still probably won't break top 100.


I don't see how scoring well above top progression qualifies as "not working".

It's a new release! 110 is good for a normal reward. You need to be around 125 to 140k

PiGeek314

For those over 100k and still outside of top 100 individual, which slice are you in, and when did you join that slice?

I joined slice 4 about 6h before the end of day 1 and am currently around 103k and ranking #90, and I have vowed to myself never to repeat this mistake again (either pre-join slice 4 or join slices 1 or 2 even though they don't work well with my schedule). I'd like to figure out the pattern of these extremely competitive pve slices.

Smudge

Darknes21 wrote:

"mpqr7 wrote:

FYI I'm at 110,000.. still probably won't break top 100.


I don't see how scoring well above top progression qualifies as "not working".

It's a new release! 110 is good for a normal reward. You need to be around 125 to 140k

[/quote]

False. Brackets are different from each other from slice to slice even for veterans. I am at 104k and currently placing #31 in my bracket in slice 5. There is no "general rule" for how hard you need to grind other than, "If you want reward X, you need to grind harder than Y other players."

For the record, in spite of my bracket luck this time, I agree with the OP for the most part. If you are bypassing the top progression by 125-175% with nothing else to show for it besides node rewards and a slim prayer at getting a single new character cover, that's pushing the envelope way too far.

TxMoose

PiGeek314 wrote:

For those over 100k and still outside of top 100 individual, which slice are you in, and when did you join that slice?

I joined slice 4 about 6h before the end of day 1 and am currently around 103k and ranking #90, and I have vowed to myself never to repeat this mistake again (either pre-join slice 4 or join slices 1 or 2 even though they don't work well with my schedule). I'd like to figure out the pattern of these extremely competitive pve slices.

from my experience, keys to success are:
1 - stay away from 4. I go 5 and 5 sub-optimally is easier to place than playing 4 optimally. I hardly ever stay up for the flip.
2 - play the fresh bracket game but play it on day 1. you still get ahead of a ton of players, have an easier time, and still get all the rewards along the way.

for reference I joined hulk fresh slice 1/2 way through sub 1. have not stayed up for a single flip. have 116K and am solidly in t20. will probably end in the 130Ks or 140Ks. I clear morning, lunch/afternoon, grind 5x at night, getting to green checks on everything. t20 is grueling (to me) but t100 would have been very easy.

LordXberk

Related note, but there needs to be a bigger reward difference between t50 and t100 besides a measly 500 ISO and 50 HP.

TxMoose

LordXberk wrote:

Related note, but there needs to be a bigger reward difference between t50 and t100 besides a measly 500 ISO and 50 HP.

I don't disagree, but if you look at t50 vs t100 for 7 subs, that difference is actually there with all the sub hp. it would definitely be nice to have a little more of a bump for t50 since I sometimes just miss out on t20.

carrion_pigeons

Darknes21 wrote:

mpqr7 wrote:

It's not fair that I have to work my butt off and probably won't even win it, while others get n00b brackets and win lots of covers with lower PVE scores.

News flash life is not fair! Why should MPQ be fair! I forgot we live in a world were everyone gets what they want when they cry and complain! God forbid people have to work for things!

Being real here, nobody in MPQ gets what they want, except the publisher.