Get rid of skip tax

Unknown

Tolken wrote:

MMR restrictions do not come into play on lightning rounds as anyone can be pared against anyone else.

This is hardly true.

Unknown

pasa_ wrote:

Tolken wrote:

MMR restrictions do not come into play on lightning rounds as anyone can be pared against anyone else.

This is hardly true.

Yeah, MMR definitely affects who you see in Lightning Rounds. The global nature means there's no brackets and you're competing in absolute terms, but mmr still affects your matchups.

Unknown

Daige wrote:

Still, why is it a problem that people skip fights? We skip either because we feel the points we get for the fight are too low so we don't want to waste time, or we skip because we the enemies are too hard for us and we dont' want to send our team on suicide missions.
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I'm guessing that it is some combination of wanting to tax ISO out of players' hands, and lower server traffic generated by match requests. My guess is that the play patterns aren't matching dev expectations and they're trying to find an in-game solution. Unfortunately, it's overly punitive to certain players (those perpetually screwed by the broken MMR)

Unknown

I'm finding PvP impossible to play now. I'm consistently being matched up with opponents that have at least 10 levels on my two highest level chars, sometimes 20. Skipping multiple times never yields anything that I can fight, and if I try to fight my team gets destroyed. So I use up my heals and get maybe one more match in. I really enjoy playing the game, but at this point I can play about one or two matches of PvP and then I get wiped out. I understand that the skip tax is kind of small... but if a fight I can handle never shows up then I feel pretty discouraged and stuck. At this point I feel like I'm relegated to PvE only, but it would be really nice if I could play PvP again.

I'm sure this is just one of many whiny posts about the skip tax, but the tax is kind of a bummer.

Unknown

I originally said I liked it, but after playing with it for a while it sucks. Somehow, I think it made matchmaking WORSE! I skipped one guy three times in six skips! Never before has something like that happened to me.

Unknown

Instead of 70 or 140 iso and then get +30 and then going down 10 for each skip, we could start at 140, and get 10 iso as a bonus for each match we play without skipping. Cumulative, that is. No loss for anyone. If you manage to play 20 fights in a row without skipping: GOOD FOR YOU, just got 200 extra iso (and if you're that good, you sure as h*ll need that extra iso it to level your high-level characters).

Unknown

Typhon13 wrote:

I originally said I liked it, but after playing with it for a while it sucks. Somehow, I think it made matchmaking WORSE! I skipped one guy three times in six skips! Never before has something like that happened to me.

I don't know if it worse or just as bad as it's ever been, but one thing's for sure: The matchmaking sucks. BAD.

Where's the logic in meeting a team constisting of 85/85/85 when your own team is 50/50/50, or something like that?

Unknown

Skipping the same team, 3 times is a bit annoying...

Unknown

Ben Grimm wrote:

I skipped someone in a retaliation (they were only worth 13 points) in a lightning round this morning only to have him replaced by the same guy, and another where I skipped someone only to have him show up 2 skips later. This is ridiculous; it needs to lock people out for x skips before they can come up again if they're going to charge us for the skips. I had the double annoyance this morning of getting hit for 42 points in the lightning round with six minutes left, which cost me a shot at the top 8, and then having to pay to get the 9 point match off of my queue.

This business. I was trying in vain for some higher progression rewards in the Predator and Prey tournament on Tuesday morning, but found very quickly that my opponent list was total ****. I skipped an opponent only to find the same opponent, or skipped a retaliation only to find that guy again...all at a cost because I was looking for guys that actually be worth fighting.

Are shielded players still invisible? Just having them fully back in the rotation would give us hope of finding opponents who are actually worth hitting. That way I wouldn't just be tossing ISO-8 down a well.

Also, is MMR banding rigid? Or does it open up as your point total increases? If the latter were true, then I could imagine having a wider field of opponents as your score increased, which would allow you access to higher point fights and potentially more manageable opponents. Starting players with really high scores would get beat up a bunch, but it might help out middle- and upper-tier players.

Unknown

Thought about opening a new thread on this this morning, but remembered something like this already existing. So here's a bump for a subject we shouldn't forget.

If I'm going to pay to skip an opponent, I want to actually skip that opponent. Not pay to indefinitely look through a list of the same three 15 point opponents until I break down and open myself up to terrible retribution.

Seriously, devs. If skipping is going to come at a premium, it should actually take the people on our list out of rotation.

CNash

I agree; the skip tax is unfair to newer players. I started playing the game seriously a couple of weeks ago, and haven't been able to really enjoy PVP events as I keep getting matched up with opponent forty levels higher than me - and then have to pay out ISO to skip them, when I'd really rather be using that ISO to level my characters!

Unknown

You don't have to get rid of the skip tax if you fix the mmr so that we, the players, aren't always running into suicide missions. As far as game design goes, forcing your players to lose is the worst design decision you could make. People don't necessarily play every game to win, but they do play to have a chance to win, and if there's no chance to win, there's no reason to play.

Flip a coin. You win if you don't get heads or tails. Not a very fun game, is it?

Linkster79

In every PvP tournament once I get to a certain stage in trying to get the higher progress rewards I can burn through hundreds of iso just to see the same 5-8 names. If I have skipped them once it is for a reason, if I skip the same player twice it is for an extremely good reason, three times means I do not want to battle that player sso do not force me. That reason is usually I have slim to no chance of beating a team of 3 characters at L141 with my 2* roster.

Unknown

I only play the PVP's for the progression rewards. Usually to 300 to get the Heroic Token. Then I walk away.

Between the points system and length of time it would require for me to put in to place highly enough to be worth it in the Event reward is so messed up that I don't bother after I get my token. Once I pass the 200 mark, it takes SOOOOO long to get to 300 that by the time I see that bright shiny gold token, I'm exhausted and just want the hell out of the room because all the fights that are coming up are worth 9 or 11 points, even with skips and I am being slammed with 20-25 point losses at this point left and right.

Unknown

Why. I like the skip tax. Keeps those who would skip over and over till they got a low level and fight them in a min and skip again till they got a easy fight and over and over. This wouldnt help the lower levels that started and they would quit. You just need to get better at playing the game.

Unknown

First time here for me (hi), and well, I was gonna post a list of stuff that I don't "understand" from the system, but since this was one of the points in my list, I'll just say it here.

I think one of the problems with the skip tax is that it counts towards skipping revenge matchups. My current roster is mostly represented by a first page of lvl 29-30 chars, and a bunch of other chars between that and lvl 6. Thing is, I might get attacked by a bunch of 50+ lvl teams (I've even been getting attacked by teams with the featured char plus two lvl 120 chars), which I can't even think of going against. Which means, if I wanna have a chance of continuing to play, I have to lose quite some isos, until I get someone I can go against. Point being, IMHO revenge matchups shouldn't be affected by skip taxes. If you voluntarily skip white matchups, sure, have it there, but not if you've been attacked by beasts.

And that takes me to the second point: global matchups. Once I get to a rank 100 or less, I'll start getting white matchups with beasts, again, teams with level 50+, who I don't even have a chance against. Which means, I'll lose a ton of isos skipping, until I give up, stop playing for a couple hours, let my rank drop from a dozen attacks, lose isos again by skipping red matchups, and go for teams that are on my level. Even if it's just to try and get cumulative rewards instead of rank rewards. Point being, IMHO there should be an option to choose balanced matchups (between lvl 0 and 10 levels above yours, tops), or global. That way, we could slow down the iso bleeding from skip taxes.

Unknown

I would replace the 10 ISO loss with a 2 point loss in the standings for excessive skips.

ISO means nothing to top players. But, you aren't going to skip 100 times looking for that right matchup if you lose 200 points in the standings!

reckless442

TheBraintrust wrote:

I would replace the 10 ISO loss with a 2 point loss in the standings for excessive skips.

ISO means nothing to top players. But, you aren't going to skip 100 times looking for that right matchup if you lose 200 points in the standings!

You have obviously never been at 1200 or 1300 points, shielded, and searching for targets. When you have to skip 25-30 opponents to queue up two opponents in the teens, it costs a lot. But it is far better than having to fight multiple 3-point matches that leave you exposed to losses that will drop you by 30-40 points each. If you were to impose a massive penalty on scores like you suggest, players would just remain shielded, scores would drop overall as fewer high-point targets are available, and few people would reach the top progressive rewards.

Unknown

TheBraintrust wrote:

ISO means nothing to top players. But, you aren't going to skip 100 times looking for that right matchup if you lose 200 points in the standings!

Do top players really need to skip so much? Isn't this just a problem for lower level players (like myself, or even lower)?

Unknown

Conspiranoid wrote:

TheBraintrust wrote:

ISO means nothing to top players. But, you aren't going to skip 100 times looking for that right matchup if you lose 200 points in the standings!

Do top players really need to skip so much? Isn't this just a problem for lower level players (like myself, or even lower)?

There are two primary reasons people skip:

1) Looking for a winnable match (mainly lower level players, with some middle)
2) Looking for match worth a decent number of points (primarily high, with some middle too)