Gotta question this CP thing

Unknown

I've spent about $400 over the last two years to grab covers during sales. Can't see myself ever buying HP again now that i'm going to be using CP for covers. Guess it's a good thing as my wife will be much happier about it but....

I did like the idea that if they released a character I really wanted (gambit) I could just drop $100 and buy him. Now I'll never drop that $100 or any other cash so why wouldn't they just have both (CP and HP) purchases

hmm

wymtime

I don't disagree with you that the change is bad, but the ability to whale a 4* through direct purchase seems to be what the want to get away from. I don't know why they want to take this option away from paying customers but they do. HP was the cornerstone currency of the game and now they have this new shinny CP they want to promote and drive. How much $$ will they need to lose before we see CP for sale? Maybe they feel the 40 pack is the better buy so you can champion your characters instead of spending your money on 1 character you really want to play

Malcrof

The game-makers are not un-intelligent. A change of this magnitude most likely has other aspects yet to be revealed. I am sure HP will have other uses, and CP will start flowing regularly in new ways.. along with probably some changes in purchase packages.. my advice, wait a bit.. this is most likely the beginning of a slew of changes.

GurlBYE

wymtime wrote:

I don't disagree with you that the change is bad, but the ability to whale a 4* through direct purchase seems to be what the want to get away from. I don't know why they want to take this option away from paying customers but they do. HP was the cornerstone currency of the game and now they have this new shinny CP they want to promote and drive. How much $$ will they need to lose before we see CP for sale? Maybe they feel the 40 pack is the better buy so you can champion your characters instead of spending your money on 1 character you really want to play

Thats likely not the reason, 25 4 stars too late, 3 in particular.

I really doubt someone whaled Mr fantastic, ghost rider ,miles, venom, etc.

Sm0keyJ0e

I'm sure they're not un-intelligent, but their lack of communication re: just about everything is not smart. Where is the harm in getting feedback from your userbase ahead of time rather than dropping bombshells on them and having to backtrack?

It's entirely possible these changes will be well received, but there is a lot of anxiety among players who have a lot of time (and, for some, money) invested in this game which could easily be resolved by telling us what's going on.

For example--what are the progression rewards for adding champion levels?? What will HP's be used for in the future? How else can folks get CP's? Answers to some basic questions could satiate so many fears...

GuntherBlobel

While it seems odd that they would remove a revenue source, they did ask us directly in a poll, if we would want HP ability upgrades to disappear. I voted yes. Maybe others did as well.

My guess is that they stand to make more money off of random token pulls. Maybe they see that people stop spending once they whale a cover-maxed Jeay Grey. Whatever the reason, they still gotta keep the servers running so they must feel confident that they have other ways for you to keep spending (if you so choose).

Unknown

I also get the feeling they'll actually get more people buying cover-upgrades if it used CP and not HP, too.

Especially in 3* land, where it's pretty cheap (20 CP), and that it's using a currency thats only other use is to buy Legendary Tokens with.

Buying a cover with HP was usually pretty dumb for most players beforehand, since that HP was usually much better spent in roster slots. Without that opportunity cost, though, I can totally see myself getting more covers directly.

LegendReborn

The CP change definitely benefits players still trying to finish up those important 3* characters and I don't mind the actual changes. I think they are beneficial with one big assumption. We need more ways to obtain CP for players working on 4* characters but at the same time not flooding players finishing up 3*s with CP. I thought they had a good idea with the 1150 progression tier rewarding CP. I don't think it needs to be 15 like for the Naughty or Nice PVP but I do think somewhere between 3 and 5 CP between the 1000 and 1300 progression rewards would be more than reasonable.

simonsez

Malcrof wrote:

The game-makers are not un-intelligent.

Cite reference please?

mpqr7

Sm0keyJ0e wrote:

For example--what are the progression rewards for adding champion levels??

This doesn't fully answer your question, but it does provide some information:

http://d3publisher.helpshift.com/a/marv ... -champions

What Kind of Rewards are Earned from Adding Levels?

You will receive Hero Covers, Tokens, Iso-8, Hero Points and Command Points as rewards. Each star rating has their own reward structure with most rewards being Iso-8, Hero Points and Command Points with Covers and Tokens added at increasing levels. Here are some notable rewards for each star rating:

2-Star: Heroic Tokens and a related 3-Star Hero Cover.

3-Star: Legendary Tokens and three related 4-Star Hero Covers.

4-Star: Compared to 3-Star Champions, 5x Legendary Tokens and 4x the Hero Points and Commands Points.

5-Star: Compared to 4-Star Champions, 5x Legendary Tokens and Hero Points and 6.25x the amount of Command Points.

simonsez

mpqr7 wrote:

4x the Hero Points

Awesome. I'll pool those with my Confederate money and invest it in Lehman Brothers stock...

tdglory49

Just for my own entertainment, my roster tracking spreadsheet calculates how much it would cost me in real dollars to max cover all my characters using HP. I decided to see the difference with CP. At this point, I'm only looking for 4*s and 5*s (about 130) combined, and I used the $100 dollar package for each, so 20,000 HP and 7 CP.

- With HP, 4*s cost $1,400
- With CP, 4*s costs $328,000
- With CP, 4*s and 5*s costs $832,000

That's absurd. Unless CP is going to suddenly be direct for sale, or start flowing much more, some explanation seems in order to clarify what they're trying to do/solve. Admittedly, I was never worried about whales maxing 4*s, but D3 has a better idea of the game's economy than I do.

Unknown

simonsez wrote:

mpqr7 wrote:

4x the Hero Points

Awesome. I'll pool those with my Confederate money and invest it in Lehman Brothers stock...

Getting more Hero Points was the most exciting part of the Championingness rewards to me.

That hasn't changed.

When I get into a world where I have a roster slot ready for every character that comes out, with plenty of buffer, then and only then will I be "yeah I don't need HP more then anything."

But that doesn't seem to be happening anytime soon, so yeah, HP is still the most attractive currency to me, and my likelihood of buying any has not changed.

tdglory49 wrote:

- With HP, 4*s cost $1,400
- With CP, 4*s costs $328,000
- With CP, 4*s and 5*s costs $832,000

That's absurd. Unless CP is going to suddenly be direct for sale, or start flowing much more, some explanation seems in order to clarify what they're trying to do/solve. Admittedly, I was never worried about whales maxing 4*s, but D3 has a better idea of the game's economy than I do.

That's if you're thinking of HP and CP purely in terms of "how can I whale these covers in", and they serve no other purpose.

While whaling covers has always been more "Do I want one more X-force cover, or do I want 2.5 roster slots?" And even in CP terms, it's a much more generous "Do I want one X-Force cover, or do I want 2-and-a-half token pulls for a chance for one?"

I get the feeling more covers are going to be bought with CP then they were with HP.

...but I don't think people are going to do so with dollar bills as much, though.

Punisher5784

The whole point of the new Championing release and the removal of HP purposes is to extend the 3-4* transition. Think about how fast the 2-3* transition became once DDP was implemented. We have requested this similar approach with 4*s but 4* DDQ, Legendaries, CP, and extra covers as rewards is not what we're looking for because we want to reach 4* land as quickly as 3* land. I am sure the devs realize that speeding up the 4* transition is not feasible for the game long-term so they extending it with Champions and removing HP covers to keep us all playing to reach 4* land.

The devs did mention adding new 5*s more frequently, perhaps 1 per month so once they have enough 4*'s, maybe things will change and we will all be clamoring for 5* land with CP becoming Infinity Crystals (IC) to buy covers as 6*'s are released.

Unknown

Punisher5784 wrote:

The whole point of the new Championing release and the removal of HP purposes is to extend the 3-4* transition. Think about how fast the 2-3* transition became once DDP was implemented. We have requested this similar approach with 4*s but 4* DDQ, Legendaries, CP, and extra covers as rewards is not what we're looking for because we want to reach 4* land as quickly as 3* land. I am sure the devs realize that speeding up the 4* transition is not feasible for the game long-term so they extending it with Champions and removing HP covers to keep us all playing to reach 4* land.

The devs did mention adding new 5*s more frequently, perhaps 1 per month so once they have enough 4*'s, maybe things will change and we will all be clamoring for 5* land with CP becoming Infinity Crystals (IC) to buy covers as 6*'s are released.

I kinda feel the opposite... that this update is for speeding up and/or making the 2-3* transition more fun.

With Champions, you're going to be less likely to stall at level 94 for a huge amount of time collecting covers, you'll still be getting HP and CP from said releases, while also CPing a 3* character for 20 CP is way more doable then 1250 HP (better spent on roster slots).

Like I see all this stuff as "Yeah, trying to make the 3* range easier and more fun to get to."

ErikPeter

GuntherBlobel wrote:

While it seems odd that they would remove a revenue source, they did ask us directly in a poll, if we would want HP ability upgrades to disappear. I voted yes. Maybe others did as well.

My guess is that they stand to make more money off of random token pulls. Maybe they see that people stop spending once they whale a cover-maxed Jeay Grey. Whatever the reason, they still gotta keep the servers running so they must feel confident that they have other ways for you to keep spending (if you so choose).

Dunno about that. A while back I was sitting on the remains of my post-Anniversary hoard and made the mistake of buying a 40 pack of taco pulls (after a bad week where I went 10/10 2*). You know, felt I was "due", in a gambling mood, whatever: I got nothing. No HP reward, no 4*, a couple of unusable 3*. I sat there thinking, "tinykitty I could have had 2 Hulkbuster covers, man I'm stupid". I'm not going to buy a random pack ever again unless it's really good/breakable odds like the Naughty or Nice vault.

Who knows. Maybe (Hopefully), they'll use it as an excuse to increase token quality by a good amount. In the current system, 200+ HP for a token that is most likely a 2* is awful compared to 2500 for a desired 4*. The chances are just too low. But if you can't buy covers with HP, tokens could be interesting, combined with the Champion system where those 3* you get are still worthwhile. Supposedly, they're going to be sandboxing token exploiters, so hopefully would boost the odds and make 200 HP seem like a good deal.

colwag wrote:

I also get the feeling they'll actually get more people buying cover-upgrades if it used CP and not HP, too.

Especially in 3* land, where it's pretty cheap (20 CP), and that it's using a currency thats only other use is to buy Legendary Tokens with.

Buying a cover with HP was usually pretty dumb for most players beforehand, since that HP was usually much better spent in roster slots. Without that opportunity cost, though, I can totally see myself getting more covers directly.

For players like me, with 73 slots already, Buying 4* covers was a great deal at that price. Until they give us something else to do with it, HP is going to be a lot less good for me now. Sure, I'll keep buying roster slots when I get a "lucky" drop, but I don't do well enough in PvE to win the new guys anyways. I play semi-casually as a weary vet, generally getting top 100 in a late-start PvP season bracket (but never top 50 in PvP anymore, don't have the time to consistently break 800-1000 points). PvE, I rarely find a miraculous easy bracket with a chance at the top, so it usually feels like an uphill battle not worth the couple tokens I get; I'll do the CP mission once or twice but not bother grinding it to dust if I fail to get the token.

So I get like, 3 CP a week. 120 for a 4* cover is... Let's just say it seems a lot more expensive than 2500 HP in my mind. Asking 1250 for a 3* was insane, though. Just like 20 CP for a 3* is insane.

firethorne

Malcrof wrote:

I am sure CP will start flowing regularly in new ways.

Just like ISO has

Unknown

firethorne wrote:

Malcrof wrote:

I am sure CP will start flowing regularly in new ways.

Just like ISO has

2+ years in, with the game as it currently (still) stands, that kind of faith starts bordering on religious... or something. lol

DBC

Arimis_Thorn

GuntherBlobel wrote:

While it seems odd that they would remove a revenue source, they did ask us directly in a poll, if we would want HP ability upgrades to disappear. I voted yes. Maybe others did as well.

My guess is that they stand to make more money off of random token pulls.

Probably. I use to work at a F2P game company who was porting a VERY popular F2P game to English. In Korea, players could buy whatever upgrades they wanted. In the Japanese version, it was pretty much random pulls. While most of the Americans who played the game played the Korean version and loved buying what we want when we want it, ('MURICA!), that's what they were expecting. However, the parent company went with the Japanese model because it made more money.

The game in question was eventually cancelled in the US for lack of performance.

Not quite an Apples to Apples scenario, and I'm not suggesting this move will kill MPQ. I was just reminded of this when I read the announcement of the change.

Warbringa

I agree with ErikPeter, I have quite a few roster slots and will need some for 4* as I accumulate them but now HP is really only going to be for roster slots. I didn't buy a ton of covers with HP but every once and a while I did. Tokens are not a good deal with HP in general. A feature to convert HP to Iso would be appreciated. Lucky me, I just bought my first Stark Salary ever after playing for nearly two years this xmas during the sale. Ended up buying a number of IMHB covers as there was no way I would need all of that HP for roster slots in the near future. My issue is that CP are fairly limited unless you are in a competitive alliance. I am a casual but dedicated player and I have 90 CPs. I play daily and place fairly well when I try in both PvP and PvE. No way I will be buying covers with those CPs at that rate.

The Bob The

Arimis Thorn wrote:

Not quite an Apples to Apples scenario, and I'm not suggesting this move will kill MPQ. I was just reminded of this when I read the announcement of the change.

Yeah, I remember when Apples to Apples went free-to-play. All the whales were making these awesome analogies and I'm over here trying to compare a duck to a satellite dish.