5* Usability

Peej13

I can't seem to find it anywhere obvious, but at what point do 5* become truly usable? Yes, they have good match damage and health, but how many covers/levels do they need to start using them over everyone else?

Thanks in advance!

Orion

Peej13 wrote:

I can't seem to find it anywhere obvious, but at what point do 5* become truly usable? Yes, they have good match damage and health, but how many covers/levels do they need to start using them over everyone else?

Thanks in advance!

Even at 1 cover, the match damage alone from a 5* makes it playable. My go-to team for easy nodes or seed nodes is my 3-cover SS, 2-cover OML and Fist.

But to play them in PvP over 3* and 4* characters? Probably 7 or 8 covers. But even then, you have to level them up. The 5*s gain their power more from levels than they do covers.

LegendReborn

OML with just a red or yellow cover is a strong asset to a player who is just starting the 4* transition. The other 5*s don't compare and mainly act as meat shields and bring strong match damage. That isn't to say that they aren't usable but if you are decently into the 4* transition, those barely covered 5*s are decorations, especially if it's Silver Surfer.

Jarvind

I've got a 1/3/0 Old Man Logan, and even only leveled to 270 he is useful for PVE. I just stick him with other black/yellow/red characters (usually Cage and Cyclops) and he soaks up all the damage and heals back up. He struggles a bit on the later nodes because even his regen can't keep up with goon countdowns dealing 3-4k a pop at his current level, but he still extends my health supply by a lot.

The Viceroy Returns

I've been REALLY tempted to level my 3 1 1 OML.
Same for my 1 2 0 Surfer.
It's more a matter of I don't want to destroy my scaling, because I have a smattering of mid tier 4* characters at 185.
But with those others that high, I'm unsure how much it will effect scaling if I up OML to 270.
The mind boggles...

Liquid Fists

5* Phoenix needs 1 green cover to be viable in any pve node and is great for climbing in pvp.

The Viceroy Returns

Liquid Fists wrote:

5* Phoenix needs 1 green cover to be viable in any pve node and is great for climbing in pvp.

I have a 1 0 1 Phoenix.
So you more or less don't care if she dies so she can revive, is that the deal? Kinda like Grocket's Yellow?

Personally, I'd rather take my 3 1 1 OML + 1 2 0 Surfer + Iron Fist for the easy PVE nodes and OML + any good buffed 3 star + featured for early PVP climbs.
Knowing full well not everyone can do this, I can see the value of a single Green Phoenix. I'd imagine it's a good way to minimize Health Pack usage over several fights.

The OCD part of me is bothered when I use a character that has only their passive power and no active ones for some reason though.
My 0 3 0 Captain Falcon for example. Using him is what it sounds like when doves cry.

Liquid Fists

I take her in a match with a green accelerator and one other character, does not really matter who as long as they have decent health, for the rounds Phoenix is down to keep hits off the accelerator. Collect green, then accelerator color then whatever is useful. Keep her out front as much as possible, especially the big hits. She dies, protect her tile at all cost. She comes back I have 20 plus green and the match is over. She has 4k+ health left and is ready for the next node. It can be done without the green accelerator. She damages the other team members with her green. But I got a whole roster to work through.

Her resurrection tile probably gets destroyed or matched 2 out of about 10 times. Since I have had her she has died after resurrection 1 time. If either happens it means I wait a hour before I can start up again with her. She saves countless health packs. I expect her to be adjusted when more people have her green ability. This is not fast. But, it's not slow either.

For usefulness the other *5 stars don't really compare to me. They may be more powerful, that's debatable.

I don't expect to fully cover her. I have one green and one red cover. But at 5 green she would be effectively a permanent health pack.

DaveR4470

Pro of 1- or under-covered 5*s: They have really great match damage. Super useful in PvE to clear out lower-level nodes really quick.

Con of 1/under-covered 5*s: They have really great match damage. Which means they're probably tanking many (sometimes even 4 or 5) colors on the board. So despite their solid health, they're damage magnets and don't last as long as you'd probably expect they would.

I'd say that a 5* right out of the box is (if the cover is right) at least roughly as usable (in the abstract) as a mid-quality 166 3*. I think you probably have to get one to 280-300 before you could even talk about them being better than the best 3*s, and you have to have them pretty well-covered before they're competitive with maxed top-end 4*s.

My $.02. For the record, I like that they're mostly functional right out of the box. For example, 1-cover green Phoenix is, if nothing else, a 14000 health damage shield (10k base plus the 4k revival), which has its uses....

DaveR4470

The Viceroy Returns wrote:

The OCD part of me is bothered when I use a character that has only their passive power and no active ones for some reason though.
My 0 3 0 Captain Falcon for example. Using him is what it sounds like when doves cry.

How could you just leave Cap standing alone in a world that's so cold?

puppychow

I use my unleveled 5 characters to grind the trivial nodes in pve and save on heals. They are quite useful even with just one cover. As 5 tier, their health regen rate is extremely high.

fmftint

DaveR4470 wrote:

Pro of 1- or under-covered 5*s: They have really great match damage. Super useful in PvE to clear out lower-level nodes really quick.

Con of 1/under-covered 5*s: They have really great match damage. Which means they're probably tanking many (sometimes even 4 or 5) colors on the board. So despite their solid health, they're damage magnets and don't last as long as you'd probably expect they would.

I'd say that a 5* right out of the box is (if the cover is right) at least roughly as usable (in the abstract) as a mid-quality 166 3*. I think you probably have to get one to 280-300 before you could even talk about them being better than the best 3*s, and you have to have them pretty well-covered before they're competitive with maxed top-end 4*s.

My $.02. For the record, I like that they're mostly functional right out of the box. For example, 1-cover green Phoenix is, if nothing else, a 14000 health damage shield (10k base plus the 4k revival), which has its uses....

throw Luke Cage in with them and their durability stretches even father

Akari

Once they have their healing cover, they're usable immediately - SS blue, OML yellow, Phoenix Green. Sadly my SS and OML don't have those colors, so I don't bother using them outside of trivial stuff.

PeterGibbons316

Akari wrote:

Once they have their healing cover, they're usable immediately - SS blue, OML yellow, Phoenix Green. Sadly my SS and OML don't have those colors, so I don't bother using them outside of trivial stuff.

This is how I feel as well. My OML is 2/0/1 and doesn't feel usable quite yet. I'll use him to churn through the easy PvE nodes, but without his heal he just slowly loses all his health and isn't sustainable.

Marvelfamily

Yes, even from the start on the 5* ones are good playable, because of the tile damage factor and using them as shield and tank 2-in-one. My both Surfers (With red ability at Marvelfamily and black at Stormysusie) are really good options to hide Mystique... 2* Storm... there are a few combos that work.

It's not the ability that counts, it's the combination effect.

Love it!

Polares

If you have fully operatinal 4s then you need 6-8 covers depending on who is the 5 to be in the same level of usability that have best 4s. OML and Phoenix are usable first, specially Phoenix (green is very good even with 1 cover), SS on the other hand needs the 8 covers.

If you are in the 3s - 166 level 5s are usable for some things right away, but then it is better to not put too much iso into them if you dont want scaling to be too bad.

babinro

Old Man Logan:
- At 1/2/1 he became playable as a 'for fun' character. Clearly weaker than 4*'s but decent match damage and healing.
- At 1/3/1 he was objectively weaker than 4*'s but the self heal, match damage and people avoiding him in pvp made him worth it.
- At 1/4/1 he felt on par with 4*'s in terms of power.
- At 1/5/1 (my current build) he's clearly superior to any 4* release.

Silver Surfer:
- At 2/2/2 I consider him useless. Clearly weaker than 4*'s but would undoubtedly work as a damage sponge and possible pvp scarecrow.

Phoenix:
- At 3/2/1 she was useless to me. She probably played the defensive scarecrow role better than Surfer and if she died she could deal some high end AoE damage but she wasn't worth running over any 4*'s.
- At 3/3/1 she was weak. The purple feeding became pretty good but her damage was still too underwhelming.
- At 3/3/2 she was a slow but viable 4* character. Great match damage and health but she was still very slow.
- At 3/3/3 she finally feels better than most other 4* options. Her red damage is still pretty mediocre but it's easy to fire off the skill twice in a battle and the strike tiles are now powerful. Pair her with OML and the matches are quick.

avs962

I have one and one both at 255 still:

I've found I can burn through the bulk of a pve clear with the two of them and . Boost black/green match damage and just flood the board with black tiles. It's pretty fun.

mohio

This thread is just making me sad that after 50+ pulls I'm still stuck on just 2 5* covers total.

avs962

mohio wrote:

This thread is just making me sad that after 50+ pulls I'm still stuck on just 2 5* covers total.

I feel you there. I'm in the same boat

Malcrof

Peej13 wrote:

I can't seem to find it anywhere obvious, but at what point do 5* become truly usable? Yes, they have good match damage and health, but how many covers/levels do they need to start using them over everyone else?

Thanks in advance!

My 2/1/0 Silver Surfer, 0/1/0 OML (both lvl 270) and Rulk are my TBE team, can complete it in 5 minutes or less with them. I also use them for PVE trivial nodes, LR seed teams, etc.. So yes, even at 1 cover they can be useful! No, they are not PVP ready, but definitely worth the roster slots.