This Annoys Me - New Rosters

Unknown

Malcrof wrote:

Easiest solution would be to sell the covers.. and done.. scaling is back to where they need it.

it will be a while before they can really use 4*s.. but if they have the roster space, once they have their 2* transition 1/2 done, then the level 70's won't matter at all.

With the surfer.. best bet is to sell it, their commander should have advised against opening any legendary tokens until they were ready to roster 4*s.

If that's the solution then the game needs a revamp. You shouldn't be punished for getting some lucky pulls. Scaling is fine in theory but horrible in practice. Who gives a rip if a year long player can take his hulkbuster in and destroy PVE.

Better idea might be to have separate tiers of PVE so that the top guys compete with the top guys and mid-tier with mid-tiers. Scaling seems to try and make PVE competitive between all players when really it just sucks and is annoying.

grunth13

barrok wrote:

Malcrof wrote:

Easiest solution would be to sell the covers.. and done.. scaling is back to where they need it.

it will be a while before they can really use 4*s.. but if they have the roster space, once they have their 2* transition 1/2 done, then the level 70's won't matter at all.

With the surfer.. best bet is to sell it, their commander should have advised against opening any legendary tokens until they were ready to roster 4*s.

If that's the solution then the game needs a revamp. You shouldn't be punished for getting some lucky pulls. Scaling is fine in theory but horrible in practice. Who gives a rip if a year long player can take his hulkbuster in and destroy PVE.

Better idea might be to have separate tiers of PVE so that the top guys compete with the top guys and mid-tier with mid-tiers. Scaling seems to try and make PVE competitive between all players when really it just sucks and is annoying.

I'm sorry, but telling people to throw a way their one good 4* is a horrible advice. We all know how hard it was to get 4's covered. I would still not have any fully covered 4's if I hadn't bought covers. Now if they were going to give 2500 hero points for that cover since that is what it costs to buy one, that may be worthwhile, but any game that penalizes you for progressing with luck is not good in practice.

Unknown

Malcrof wrote:

Easiest solution would be to sell the covers.. and done.. scaling is back to where they need it.

it will be a while before they can really use 4*s.. but if they have the roster space, once they have their 2* transition 1/2 done, then the level 70's won't matter at all.

With the surfer.. best bet is to sell it, their commander should have advised against opening any legendary tokens until they were ready to roster 4*s.

My alliance member (a 2*player) got his 5* wolverine from the booth raffle at NYCC. Don't think he had a choice not to open it.

But where's the harm in letting him have it? It's not like with one cover he's suddenly a competitive god or something and is going to steal someone's top-2 PvE spot. But someday in the future when he's in that 4->5 transition he'd sure be happy to need one less lucky pull.

I guess one option, and a good one at that, would be to have 5*'s never expire from your holding pen. Best of both worlds! (The good type, not the creepy Borg type.)

Unknown

Someone has something before I think they should, therefore things have gotta be changed.

GMadMan040

Point to be made - 4* covers are available from the starting gate and have been for quite some time now. They can be earned through some effort OR they can be acquired through the purchase of token packs.

If someone on Day 1 decided they wanted to drop some dough on the game, they could potentially have a bunch of 4* immediately. And max covered.

I'm on day 210 right now, but I earned my first 4* cover in my first month of the game, Kingpin . I scored a t10 finish in his release event and got another and a . And they were huge for me, I got a lot of use out of KP, even at low level and under covered.

I didn't see another 4* character for quite awhile after that, but I really appreciated having him.

There are a lot of things that need to be addressed in terms of progression rates and balance, but the game is never gonna be put on rails.

Unknown

GMadMan040 wrote:

There are a lot of things that need to be addressed in terms of progression rates and balance, but the game is never gonna be put on rails.

*other then the console version. ;P

whoami24601

Stony wrote:

I've been along the same thoughts as OP for awhile. I've noticed that many of the people in our alliance that have pulled a SS all have underleveled rosters compared to me and another mate, who are firmly in 4* land. He and I have opened over 40 Legendaries (combined) and neither of us have pulled one.

I'm one of the more leveled rosters in my alliance, and I've opened 3 Legendaries. The other folks in my alliance have probably opened 20+ amongst them, if I were to guess.

Only one person has pulled a SS, and it wasn't one of the newer folk or the lower level folks. It was me, in the 3-4* transition.

Lee T

In my alliance only one guy has a Silver Surfer. He's our longest playing guy and he has by far the best roster compared to ours. Sometimes RNG works.

Avarice13

Im half and half on this. I had 5 maxed 2 stars and very few 3 stars before i got my first 4 star. IW yellow it was. A buddy of mine got IW green his first week from a silver token before he even maxed a 1 star.

Do i think people with new or low level rosters should be exempted from 3 and 4 or possibly 5 stars? No i dont, but they shouldnt be penalized for having one.

Also scaling needs a huge revamp, i have 4 maxed 3 stars, 2 at 12/13 covers and many others above 100 and the higher nodes in pve are usually level 200+.

MarvelDestiny

Statisticly speaking it isn't surprising. I mean, you get **** covers, I get **** covers, just about everyone in my alliance gets **** covers. There have to be those few out there who get showered in gold to balance it all out.

SunCrusher

I will chime in and say that have someone in my Alliance who was baaaaarely starting collecting 2*s (they didn't even finish their 1*s yet because they had literally just started the game only some weeks prior) when they pulled a 4* Nick Fury from I forget exactly which free token it was last year during Anniversary. It was one of those 'It MIGHT be possible, but don't think to count on it' sort of moments and I was completely green with envy.

I thought it was pretty insane for such a low level account to pull something so completely useless to them at the time...

But I guess at the same time, when I think about it, when -I- first started back in pre-47 (I think X-Force was the only 4* at the time if even?), I pulled Purple Classic Magneto from my very first Heroic and that was before I even had ANY built covers at all.

Additionally, I actually ended up with an ultimately fairly 'decent' pull rate at the end all be all (but I'm also the same person who pulled 12 Venoms in a ROW from Recruit Tokens only a week or so before!) and pulled myself some decent covers including an extra Devil Dino cover which - for novelty's sakes - is actually what I wanted most of all from an Anniversary token because what's a first anniversary party without that Dino?

I recall reading in another thread that someone else who is or was a relative newbie managed to get some excellent pulls... and because of it, stayed with the game and became a paying player to ramp up the rest of their roster and it really makes me wonder if it's possible that pull rates just might be at least sliiightly tilted in the newbies' favor for a period of time... the same way that newbies get newbie bracketing for events (at least, I think they do).

Related, back when we were all speculating about there being 'kiddie pool' brackets (and apparently, it really was true?), my same teammate got stuck in a kiddie pool bracket and while I fought out tooth and nail in my Heroic, they sailed right through theirs and managed top 50 without breaking a sweat while I lost sleep, got crazy scaling, set alarm clocks, managed to earn 50,000+ points, and BARELY managed snagging my cover.

THAT really super grinded my gears and I think I felt worse about that than I did with the fact that they pulled a 4* that they had no use for.

P.S. I have to admit; I'm an old-school Marvel fan and a Magneto fan besides. Pulling Magneto as my first Heroic cover was what encouraged me to stick it out back when the Prologue was still kind of crazy (Juggernaut going to crazy and sitting on all of your needed 2* covers!). Not saying that I wouldn't have stuck it through anyways, but it was a nice incentive. Wow, that was so long ago.

OneLastGambit

Telling lower level players to sell ultra rare covers is ridiculous. Telling them its their fault for opening a legendary is also dumb, I've got 3 4* covers from standard silver tokens, am I supposed to never open any token then I don't accidentally roster something above my level?

I think a better idea is instead of using an average of your team level to scale they should use the mode, for those who don't know what this is the mode is the most commonly occuring value in a set of data. For example looking at my roster you would see the most commonly occurring level is 90 or 86 and you could easily deduce that my roster quality is late 2* early 3* based on this and the OML that I just pulled will not skew my scaling based on this method either since this value appears only once you could easily tell I'm not a 5* player.

LegendReborn

Malcrof wrote:

Easiest solution would be to sell the covers.. and done.. scaling is back to where they need it.

it will be a while before they can really use 4*s.. but if they have the roster space, once they have their 2* transition 1/2 done, then the level 70's won't matter at all.

With the surfer.. best bet is to sell it, their commander should have advised against opening any legendary tokens until they were ready to roster 4*s.

The easiest solution is for them to flush their rewards away? I guess that's the easiest but it's also a solution that they shouldn't ever have to resort to.

SunCrusher

OneLastGambit wrote:

Telling lower level players to sell ultra rare covers is ridiculous. Telling them its their fault for opening a legendary is also dumb, I've got 3 4* covers from standard silver tokens, am I supposed to never open any token then I don't accidentally roster something above my level?

I think a better idea is instead of using an average of your team level to scale they should use the mode, for those who don't know what this is the mode is the most commonly occuring value in a set of data. For example looking at my roster you would see the most commonly occurring level is 90 or 86 and you could easily deduce that my roster quality is late 2* early 3* based on this and the OML that I just pulled will not skew my scaling based on this method either since this value appears only once you could easily tell I'm not a 5* player.

Though I'm on the side of hoarding 'suspicious' Tokens for later (if I collected a Legendary, no way am I opening it with the current system in place!), I agree that the expectation that people shouldn't open Tokens at all (because you can STILL net really good but initially detrimental characters from 'non-suspicious' Tokens) is really unrealistic.

The tutorial gives out a Heroic Token at the end and I managed to score a Purple cover of Classic Magneto even before I ever even started building my 1* roster pre-R47. That was nuts in both a good (favorite character) and bad (scaling) way.

That said, to my understanding, part of the point of scaling was so people with much stronger rosters wouldn't be competing on the same level as someone with a much less developed roster with a potential related rationale boiling down to, it is very possible that a less-developed roster with the much higher star character(s) can gain an 'unfair' advantage over other otherwise similarly-developed rosters who are lacking the same caliber of characters.

For this reason, gauging a roster just by most-used characters runs the risk of cherry-picking - conveniently canceling out higher characters for scaling purposes... but allowing them to optionally be in play if it's advantageous for the node/Event/whatever (not necessarily counting Essential) while still not figuring them into the scaling.

Unfortunately, the current system ALSO assumes that pulling a 3-4-5* (before you're ready to make use of them) means YOU -ARE- GOING TO PROGRESS FASTER/BETTER IN EVENTS when we all know that that isn't necessarily true. Sometimes true? Yes. All the time true? No.

Pulling a Sentry while I was early in my 2-3* transitioning did jack and squat for my roster as an example; he sat there collecting dust until I could use him for an Essential PvE node. In the meanwhile, he was figured into my scaling and this was before I even had fully built 2*s.

But pulling my first Hulk cover prematurely wasn't nearly so 'useless' and neither was pulling a Purple Classic Magneto cover (pre-nerf).

In my case, because I never threw out anyone, I saw both the cost and benefit side of things.

LegendReborn wrote:

The easiest solution is for them to flush their rewards away? I guess that's the easiest but it's also a solution that they shouldn't ever have to resort to.

Just musing over this out loud, but:

If people were given an option/function where they could VOLUNTARILY LOCK OUT a certain star level to soften their scaling a bit... but AT THE COST of 1) being unable to touch the characters in that star level at all during lock-out and 2) having that entire star level locked out (to prevent selective cherry-picking to game the system)...

Would people do it?

Because it could potentially address both the scaling issue that really does go nuts at times...

Note: Match-making/Bracketing? would still need to take into account the comprehensiveness of players' overall rosters though so genuinely under-covered rosters aren't competing against fully-covered rosters who are simply locking out the rest of their rosters... and so that lower-star rosters who have NOT locked out their higher stars can't get an unfair advantage in reverse by taking advantage of both being in an easier bracket and maybe having a more advantageous MMR while also having access to stronger characters.

And the issue of where throwing away a future-useful character is like ****...

While still offering potential risks and benefits for either option while maybe reassuring players that they can collect characters without worrying so much that a lucky hit might hurt their progression.

You can soften your scaling by a star-wide lock-out and risk having a harder time against enemies who really could have used a character from the locked-out star group... or you can keep all the star levels in play for wider variety and run the risk of increased scaling.

Not sure what other negative ramifications there might be for something like this, but I was thinking of this possibility because I was playing Pocket Frogs (a level-based collect-and-breed-and-collect-some-more sort of game) on my iPod Touch.

I had forgotten that I had some 'neutered' frogs in my mailbox that my higher level friends had sent to me before I had stopped playing. The present frogs were 'too advanced' (I'm not high enough leveled to use them) for me to take out and breed with other frogs, but I'm not being penalized and essentially forced to sell them off, either, for the sake of something like stupid scaling.

Obviously, if I have my cake and eat it, too, I would say I should be allowed to breed these frogs... but I think the 'neutered' option the game provides is also a reasonable compromise between keeping leveling and gameplay mechanics intact while still letting people collect beyond their normal bounds without being penalized so much (space is an issue in this game, too, but at least there's no 'having XYZ can totally bork the rest of your gameplay experience' eg: scaling issue).

GrumpySmurf1002

While I still don't believe in conspiracy, I thought this funny:

Loaded up my alt account for first time in a while at anniversary start, got 3500HP and Dino from 3 freebie tokens.

Did it again yesterday, had one more freebie, opened a Dino

So decided to take my new found wealth into PvP up to 300 for 3 more tokens. Dino , Fury Blue, and then streak over with 2Storm (which that account needed)

Good times.