over a year in: reflecting

Bowgentle

simonsez wrote:

shurak wrote:

Oh! Thanks for reminding. Having to schedule your life around the game is even worse than the grind itself.

No one said you have to hit them on the clock. There's so much room for inefficient play if all you want is the progression, it doesn't really matter when you clear them. You should know that if you read the forum, but yeah, it's way easier to just whine about it instead.

Well that's not completely true.
Will you be able to grab the token if your clears are a few hours off? Sure.
Will you be able to grab it if you have to triple clear? Maybe? I can't say for sure.

Yes, a lot of people are able to do clears whenever they want.
A lot of people are able to clear like clockwork - I always have them in my brackets when I compete.

But really, I think the Stockholm syndrome is strong in the forum.
The time commitment to do WELL is worse than for a top raiding guild in an MMO.

Is it really OK to require at least 2.5hrs per day (3 clears), spaced apart reasonably, to have a shot at somewhat meaningful rewards?
Just because an insane time commitment is required, we have to LIKE it?

Sometime I wonder what their target demographic for PVE is, and how much time the devs think t10 should require.

TxMoose

Bowgentle wrote:

and how much time the devs think t10 should require.

I'm curious about this too. because my experience is that t10 requires ~5-6 hrs/day - 3 scheduled clears plus the 2-3 hour grind at sub end. I've done it once when I got a late bracket (~1.5 days left) for psylocke rewards that nobody else wanted. that is not something I'll ever consider through an entire event.

Unknown

Yeah, trying to get Dem in PVE has always been kinda tiring.

I have to schedule to play as soon as I wake up in the morning, then as soon as I get off work, then get home, and grinde the nodes down before they change then do the next node once, then stall until I go to bed and clear it one more time if I'm trying to do it ideally.

The Venom heroic was kinda like that. Play when you wake up, before anything else. Go to work, play as soon as you get out, then be sure you're there when the new node comes in ASAP!

You probably don't need to be perfectly on point for that, I got my token with one or two more clears left I couldn't get arsed to do, but it feels like you SHOULD, and it gets kinda tiring.

For some reason the Invisible Woman DDQ knocked out my desire to try it again with the Simulator. Just wait for a shorter event again, I guess.

BlackSheep101

From what it sounds like, you just can't play a lot every day. I'm only 325 days in, and not only have I collected all the 3* characters, I'm close to fully covering all of them. I don't grind pve for placement above t150 for the featured 3* cover, and I've only hit 1k in pvp once. I've gotten a few lightning round tokens before realizing that I don't have the flexibility to time those events right. Apart from DDQ, which I agree was a godsend, I've just been picking off covers from each event and shooting for the heroic 10-pack each season.

I mainly play on the train about 45 minutes each way, and around half an hour more at night. I manage 2 full clears of a pve sub plus DDQ plus a little pvp in that time, so I'm not sure where some of the time estimates being thrown around are coming from.

The game is designed to get people to play a lot, and the rewards are structured around that. DDQ is an exception to that rule, and given how difficult the new 4* node is, I wonder if the developers regret making it so easy to pull down a 3* cover every day.

The biggest change I made was joining a casual alliance that manages to finish in the top 250-500 of each event, which was a nice bump in my HP stream allowing me to afford the roster slots to keep all the characters I wanted. (We're looking for new members, btw.) That and focusing my efforts on the things I really want. If I've already maxed out on the featured cover, I don't push that event very hard. If I'm missing the essentials for a pve and things don't work out so I'll hit the legendary token, oh well, I'll have to be happy with the rewards I can earn. I've played every day for almost a year, and there are things about the game that make me curse, but the reward structure just isn't one of them.

simonsez

Bowgentle wrote:

Is it really OK to require at least 2.5hrs per day (3 clears)

Do you really spend 50 minutes on just one clear?

Bowgentle

simonsez wrote:

Bowgentle wrote:

Is it really OK to require at least 2.5hrs per day (3 clears)

Do you really spend 50 minutes on just one clear?

35 minutes or so, although the next sub in TAT will take forever with those one time nodes.

I don't think my roster is representative for the wider player base though, also a few cascades and an unexpected meeting at work can screw up a clear pretty badly.
If I can fully devote my time, yeah, 30-35 minutes.

cyineedsn

colwag wrote:

Yeah, trying to get Dem in PVE has always been kinda tiring.

I have to schedule to play as soon as I wake up in the morning, then as soon as I get off work, then get home, and grinde the nodes down before they change then do the next node once, then stall until I go to bed and clear it one more time if I'm trying to do it ideally.

The Venom heroic was kinda like that. Play when you wake up, before anything else. Go to work, play as soon as you get out, then be sure you're there when the new node comes in ASAP!

You probably don't need to be perfectly on point for that, I got my token with one or two more clears left I couldn't get arsed to do, but it feels like you SHOULD, and it gets kinda tiring.

For some reason the Invisible Woman DDQ knocked out my desire to try it again with the Simulator. Just wait for a shorter event again, I guess.

What? I don't think you have to grind the nodes down to get the legendary (assuming you have all the essentials). I've been able to get the leg tokens with a day (or so) to spare by doing 4 clears each node, on a non-optimal schedule, something like 12pm at lunch, 6pm on the train home, 11:30pm before bed, then a 4th singular (not repeated grinding) pass 11:30am before the sub changes.

(Note I skipped the Simulator because even doing one pass on those nodes felt too hard, so if scoring was different there I know nothing about that)

Unknown

simonsez wrote:

shurak wrote:

Oh! Thanks for reminding. Having to schedule your life around the game is even worse than the grind itself.

No one said you have to hit them on the clock. There's so much room for inefficient play if all you want is the progression, it doesn't really matter when you clear them. You should know that if you read the forum, but yeah, it's way easier to just whine about it instead.

Hey! Watch your mouth. I may be sick of your professing all over the forum how easy it is to progress in MPQ if you have nothing better to do with your personal life. But I didn't offend you.

Tatercat

Just a few thoughts from a 700+ day player, I started maybe the 1st week of the iOS app. I think the real thing you've got to find for yourself is where the game is still fun and then when it becomes work. As someone who's crossed that line and didn't realize it, I got sucked so much into it that I didn't realize how crazy it was making me and ruining my sleep (anyone remember when the PVE refreshes were every 2 HOURS?) I burnt out and walked away from the game for months, just checking in to get the daily rewards. I had a couple of 4*'s but not enough to justify using them and PVP didn't interest me as you always hit that 4* ceiling in opponents eventually (and I got tried of buying shields to survive at that level)

When I came back (around anniversary 4* Thor I think last year), I just accepted that I didn't need to be Top 10 in PVE. Top 100 was enough to get one cover of a 3* and that was enough for me. If a PVE didn't have my characters as essential, I didn't worry about it, just played for fun when I had the time. If I play PVP I don't buy shields and am happy if I get a 300 point token.

I've built up a solid 3* group of characters that way, which has given me a a stronger footing in getting the legendary progressions. If didn't get the final progression reward in a PVE, it's because I didn't bother with it. I've gotten Legendary from progression rewards in PVE event so far since they started this past month than in the previous 2 years (along with DDQ 4*, which I've been lucky on, especially that Nick Fury one). None of them are above 200. And in each of those PVE's I've never cracked the top 20 or even Top 50 for most of them.

This is not meant to be a "Oh this was easy for me, the 2 year vet" argument. I'm saying you can get a lot out of this game if you give up the hang-up of being top 10 in everything or getting everything as soon as it's available. Don't worry about being "left behind". If an alliance gives you flack about it, drop 'em. A single 3* cover for one event is good enough to walk away from, PVE or PVP. It all builds. Just find the ones you like (preferable to reliable get you through DDQ each day) and enjoy them. Eventually they'l grow and those 4* progression rewards will be easier and easier to hit. If it feels like a grind, ease off.

fYI, my relaxed play is usually 1 PVE pass (each node once) in the morning before work, another when I get home and another before I go to bed (11ish usually), 8 hour refresh be damned. (usually I do the first tier for 7am EST start and end times) I might grind at the end of at the sub on just high points nodes like essentials but normally not more than once. Each pass is no more than 30 minutes so I go over 90 minutes a day, then it's because I'm bored. That's what works for my schedule without it seeming like a job. It will vary from person to person and what they have going on. Just find that sweet spot and don't worry about "winning".

Try slice 4 if you're roster is similar and you struggle to get points - it really works

I am going to try this. Now a days I usually only play PVP is I've got at least two of the boosted characters and it's a new character that no one has built up yet (like Icebreaker where I finally hit 1000 for once -without shields!)

dr tinykittylove

cyineedsn wrote:

What? I don't think you have to grind the nodes down to get the legendary (assuming you have all the essentials). I've been able to get the leg tokens with a day (or so) to spare by doing 4 clears each node, on a non-optimal schedule, something like 12pm at lunch, 6pm on the train home, 11:30pm before bed, then a 4th singular (not repeated grinding) pass 11:30am before the sub changes.

(Note I skipped the Simulator because even doing one pass on those nodes felt too hard, so if scoring was different there I know nothing about that)

I wonder if they were missing essentials? I didn't have to grind any of the pves except for the first one, which I was not sure of. Didn't clear on time, didn't grind at all, got the tokens with lots of time to spare.

The Simulator felt like the fastest progression - I cleared about 3x each sub, not on time, and had it at the end of the second sub with a few extra clears of individual nodes. Probably was the hardest pve though - doing that put me in top 50 for the subs and 1 unnecessary clear of the last sub plus replaying the surfer node a few times put me in top 50 overall.

JVReal

The amount of grinding "required" for any placements in this game are solely dictated by the players, not the developer. The progression is determined by points established by the developer, but placement is determined by the players.

If the player base didn't do insane grind, then insane grind wouldn't be "required" to win.

If you do not like grinding, do not ever expect top 10. If you want top 10, then be prepared to grind.

If you want placement instead of progression, join a day or two late and in a fresh bracket and you will have a more relaxed time placing since those people are not the ones that are grinding for the Legendary token.

If you want top 100 AND the legendary token, then expect to push a few clears after the top progression points. I have found that many players really push until they get the legendary, then coast. That is your time to push your clears and watch yourself climb from 150 to 60 in a clear or two.

Please manage your own expectations. Do not expect top 10 rewards by playing 1 hour a day. Do not expect to win the new release 4* during their PVE if you do not want to or cannot play as optimally as possible.

If you do not have the time to play every 8 hours, that's perfectly fine. That means you are managing your life well and prioritizing things above the game. There is nothing wrong with that. If you can manage to make time to clear every 8 hours, there is nothing wrong with that either, so long as your job or family aren't suffering.

Play for fun. If fun means losing yourself in the game and playing every chance you get... success! If fun means playing for 20 mins in the morning, and a bit during lunch or after work or before bed... success! If you can only play limited amount of time during the day and you want more out of the game for that time allotment, then maybe this isn't the game for you.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, just not everyone feels the need to post an entire thread about it. If it is fun, enjoy it, if it isn't fun, find something that is.

When the game frustrates me, I stop playing it, and I chat with my alliance on Line, or I go for a bike ride, or I do whatever I was going to do next, and only come back to the game when my frustration is gone.

mrflopwelligan

Yup, I get it. I got burnout, too. That's why I dialed my play waaaaaay back. I've just been doing DDQ for the past 2 months.

If I have the time (usually on the weekends) I may grab a PVP event and go for the 300 pt token, but I don't go crazy.

I've found my love for the game slowly creeping back - but I still don't have it in me to grind for PVE.

I REALLY enjoy the Growth Industry and Ultron events. It's the challenge of them. There's no real challenge in PVE, it's just grind for points/placement. But those 2 events were actually fun because there was strategy involved.

That's what I miss about this game as compared to other games - there's not really strategy to most of the events. It's just slug it out. But Growth Industry and Ultron really made you think about how to beat those levels.

simonsez

shurak wrote:

But I didn't offend you.

Sure you did. I'm deeply offended by people who constantly insist things that aren't true. And there was nothing offensive in my post either. I just laid out two facts: you don't need to clear on the clock to get the progression, so scheduling your life around PvE is not necessary; and, whining is easier than playing. These are two facts that are not disputable. If you find facts offensive, that's your problem, not mine.

dr tinykittylove

What I really should have said instead of blithering on about pve clears and progressions...

What I like about this game, despite its flaws, is that there is no right way to play it.

You can be a whale and get all the shiny new toys now!

You can focus on playing nothing but pvp, slugging it out and/or hopping with other players.

You can ignore pvp and play nothing but pve, just because.

You can grind pve/pvp to progress fast even as an f2p freeloader.

You can take your time, play a few games here and there casually... and still make progress, thanks to ddq.

It's all about finding a balance that works for you. You don't have to have all the things RIGHT NOW. You can just fool around collecting a token here and a taco there, and eventually the divine light of RNGesus will smile down on you, and Elektra will spring forth from a random heroic token, Starlord will descend from a taco and Dino will dance his way from daily supply into your cynical heart, and the mpq world will be beautiful.

Unknown

aesthetocyst wrote:

shurak wrote:

Oh! Thanks for reminding. Having to schedule your life around the game is even worse than the grind itself.

Well, hey, great news. On 24hr subs (which is just about all of them ...) the grind itself is worth 3 clears. Actually slightly more if you reeeeally grind it to nothing!

So, to make that new max prog, you have choice: clearing every 8hrs OR grinding—whenever you like! Yay!

But that was my point exactly. One of the worst parts of this game for me is having to do it on schedule, not when you feel like it. Over time it became to feel more like a chore than fun. That's why I barely touch PVEs anymore even though there is now big juicy 4* carrot at the end.

TxMoose

shurak wrote:

But that was my point exactly. One of the worst parts of this game for me is having to do it on schedule, not when you feel like it. Over time it became to feel more like a chore than fun. That's why I barely touch PVEs anymore even though there is now big juicy 4* carrot at the end.

but that was his point exactly. that doing what the top guys do at the end of each sub. grinding the nodes to 1. that will be the equivalent of 3 timed clears. that is not doing anything timed out. just grind them all to 1 in one sitting and you'll still get there - tied to no schedule whatsoever. your choice.

cyineedsn

dr tinykittylove wrote:

You don't have to have all the things RIGHT NOW.

THAT IS CRAZY TALK

brisashi

loroku wrote:

qkumbredood wrote:

3 PVE clears a day (about an hour and a half total) will get you to the legendary token and usually T100 placement IF YOU ARE ME.

brisashi wrote:

I have to strongly disagree with you regarding 4* covers being harder to get IF YOU ARE ME.

dr tinykittylove wrote:

But the pve token? Easy as hell to get IF YOU ARE ME

I fixed those quotes for you. Don't forget that your experience speaks for no one but yourself.

The same can be said for everything you have posted in this thread. You don't have to point out that opinions are subjective, that is already known.

Unknown

simonsez wrote:

shurak wrote:

But I didn't offend you.

Sure you did. I'm deeply offended by people who constantly insist things that aren't true. And there was nothing offensive in my post either. I just laid out two facts: you don't need to clear on the clock to get the progression, so scheduling your life around PvE is not necessary; and, whining is easier than playing. These are two facts that are not disputable. If you find facts offensive, that's your problem, not mine.

Where the hell did you see me whining? Did I complain about not getting some prizes? Or sharing opinion on what I think is bad design is same as whining? Where did you see me insisting on things that are not true? I was supporting OP's point that making the game playing on schedule makes it feel like a job instead of fun. I wasn't even disputing your saying on how to properly play.
Learn to read what people say before badmouthing.

Malcrof

Let's keep things civil and constructive