Silver Surfer recruitment

Blykmyk

So, I'm a casual player that has built up all of my three stars to 166 and have IW fully covered up to 166 and Nick Fury 4/3/2 at 166 as well. All my other four stars are basically 2 or 3 covers (for example...I,had zero,chance of defeating Cyclops in DPD yesterday).

With my Legendary token in Hulk I got a Silver Surfer cover. Can anyone tell me what the recruitment of SS will do to my scaling? Will it really ruin everything else for me in the game?

scottee

Scaling always adjusts to how you perform. If you want to progress into 4*, gimping your heroes will only hold you back. That includes your Invisible Woman and Nick Fury.

So add Surfer, level, and try to perform as best you can.

Trying to manipulate scaling by holding back levels is like saying, "Yay, I won a 1st place trophy," because you've been staying in the 4th grade for 8 years.

Blykmyk

I'm not sure what that means. Being that the best way to get tokens is pve placement, making it harder to get thst token would seem counterintuitive.

If I add him to my roster will I start facing enemies as if my entire roster was in the 200s?

scottee

Blykmyk wrote:

I'm not sure what that means. Being that the best way to get tokens is pve placement, making it harder to get thst token would seem counterintuitive.

If I add him to my roster will I start facing enemies as if my entire roster was in the 200s?

You'll face enemies that you can beat. You'll always face enemies you can beat. It adjusts to how well you perform. You'll perform better if you use Surfer, but not harder than you can beat. The top PVE placements are filled with people with all kinds of rosters, including maxed 4* rosters. So your roster doesn't inherently hurt your placement, no.

Blykmyk

So if I recruit silver surfer and start the rocket and groot event I will face the same levels of enemies I've been playing in the past because I've never used SS?

I thought scaling was based on your roster levels.

Unknown

Blykmyk wrote:

So if I recruit silver surfer and start the rocket and groot event I will face the same levels of enemies I've been playing in the past because I've never used SS?

I thought scaling was based on your roster levels.

I'm honestly unsure at this point too.

Arguably, your scaling would go up because you'll win more matches with SS then you did without him which would scale the enemies up moreso then his level, which could potentially be an issue when you use any other character not as good as him.

I think?

Like, if this guy added SS, and never used him at all, would his levels stay similarish?

Blykmyk

Guess I'm not buying the idea that they magically know what you "can beat" there has to be something used to make that judgement.

Pongie

Will this be the first silver surfer cover sold as ISO?

Blykmyk

I wasn't planning on selling it. But, did want to understand the ramifications from ppl that seem to track the ins and outs of the game pretty well. Thought that was what forums were for...

Zen808

I believe that someone once posted a conversation they had with Customer Service, wherein it was revealed that initial PVE levels are set at the start of an event, based on the average level of your top 4 characters.

In addition, anecdotally, I am pretty sure that this takes into account the boosted characters for the event. This is because personally, in events where the boosted characters in my roster were of relatively lower level, I faced lower level opponents across the board.

Now, if you have almost all 3*'s, it's fair to say that your scaling will be based off of a Top 4 of 270 (Essential 3* for the event) + 3x 240 (boosted 3*'s). Add Silver Surfer into the mix, and your Top 4 becomes 270 + 255 + 2x 240. The difference is really insignificant.

Your in-event scaling will be based off of your performance. Again, if you already have the all of boosted 3*'s for the event, I don't honestly see a 1 cover SS making any significant change to your performance either.

Go ahead and recruit him if you have him.

Blykmyk

Thanks for the feedback! Just wanted to get a little bit better idea on the mechanics. Didn't think about how boosted characters could have similar impacts to my average level.

XandorXerxes

I keep forgetting to post the actual numbers when I get home, for which I apologize - I raised my average level of my first 4/6/page/roster and tracked it. When I first raised 3 characters at once to 166 from ~115 (disclaimer: I already had one 166), my levels didn't change at all.

If you get SS, roster him, and never use him in theory nothing will change for you. In practice there could be some crazy code in there that bases it off your top character, or the devs could change it in the future. SS is rare enough that I'd risk it.

GrumpySmurf1002

Blykmyk wrote:

Thanks for the feedback! Just wanted to get a little bit better idea on the mechanics. Didn't think about how boosted characters could have similar impacts to my average level.

My understanding is scaling is set at the beginning of the event (but possibly each sub). So if you're that concerned, just wait til after Groot event to roster him.

But it shouldn't be an issue unless you use and dominate with him.

mindsuckr

We are testing this theory over on Reddit right now with two people. I didn't know that scaling is set at the start of an event and doesn't change much, so came to the wrong conclusions the first time that SS doesn't change things.

Now it seems like Silver Surfer DOES change levels for you. One guy used him on two trivial nodes and saw his levels jump pretty noticeably compared to my levels. Another guy just recruited him for the final day (and I don't think he used him) and saw a decent level jump as well.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelPuzzleQuest/comments/3l6k0b/should_i_add_the_silver_surfer/cv3l11n

TxMoose

my experience. way back when (earlier this year) I pushed a pvp team high (166 and 153) and all the rest of my 3*s were at 104. as long as I did not use my 166 in pve, scaling was not an issue and my 2*s were still very usable all the way to the hard nodes. around ultron and the hb EotS I started using my 166 (thor) and my scaling started increasing, but not dramatically. of course much has changed since and my 2*s would need some luck to even do the essential nodes at this point. but if you don't use SS in pve, I don't think you'll see much difference. although 250 and 166 are certainly much different levels so, who knows.

wiz_biz

while i am usually the one explaining to friends to just suck it up and level their characters, i am a little concerned about not having clear answers on how SS affects scaling for low level rosters. my sister is a noob with a stable full of lvl 70's, and of course she just pulled an SS.

the reddit thread linked to above is troubling me...the OP admitted he used his SS on trivial nodes and saw his scaling go up, so okay that makes sense:

[–]Alderaad 2 points 6 hours ago
Final nodes for initial pass
Previous Sub - 164 <-- added Silver Surfer mid sub, used him on 2 trivial nodes.
Savanna - 194
Nevada - 209
The majority of my 3* characters are at level 100. I could see the 194 -> 209 increase due to performance cause I've cleared every node on every refresh. So the initial jump is probably due to just adding him to the roster.
So yeah, he affects the initial level, and I jumped the gun in my posting earlier.
I also just noticed that on the DDQ essential node, it's now rated trivial where before it was rated as easy.


but a second guinea pig also rostered mid-event during hulk (but didn't use him) and posted this:

Steveu0323 3 points 15 hours ago*
So I just got thru the Nevada event and there was a huge jump in levels for the final node...
In savanna the final level after several clears was roughly 160 In Nevada the starting level is roughly 209 per
My overall ranking for the event is roughly the same 55ish so I don't think it is increasing based on general performance
Which leads me to believe that having the surfer greatly impacts your scaling for a near unusable character

so, i can honestly say i'm a bit stumped as to how to advise her...any chance anyone out there can quell my fears? and even better, have data to back it up?

XandorXerxes

wiz_biz wrote:

so, i can honestly say i'm a bit stumped as to how to advise her...any chance anyone out there can quell my fears? and even better, have data to back it up?

I'm fairly confident that if she rosters him, but doesn't use him, it won't affect her scaling. I didn't start gathering data until I already had a level 166 though, so I can't really say for certain how much of an impact just rostering that first high level character will have.

wiz_biz

XandorXerxes wrote:

I'm fairly confident that if she rosters him, but doesn't use him, it won't affect her scaling. I didn't start gathering data until I already had a level 166 though, so I can't really say for certain how much of an impact just rostering that first high level character will have.

thanks xandor - i'm really hoping for the best and that they wouldn't implement something that has the potential to ruin gameplay for beginners...but since we're in the same alliance, i will at least advise her to wait until meet R&G is over

TxMoose

wiz_biz wrote:

thanks xandor - i'm really hoping for the best and that they wouldn't implement something that has the potential to ruin gameplay for beginners...but since we're in the same alliance, i will at least advise her to wait until meet R&G is over

if she rosters SS, make sure she knows to NOT use him in any pve or the system will sense the huge jump in performance and she'll back herself into a corner of having to use him on every hard node and maybe every essential. can use him in any other aspect of the game - prologue, pvp, ddq, LRs, etc. no pve though. we know what happens if he gets used (scaling WILL go up), we just don't know for certain what happens when he just sits on the bench in pve.

wiz_biz

TxMoose wrote:

wiz_biz wrote:

thanks xandor - i'm really hoping for the best and that they wouldn't implement something that has the potential to ruin gameplay for beginners...but since we're in the same alliance, i will at least advise her to wait until meet R&G is over

if she rosters SS, make sure she knows to NOT use him in any pve or the system will sense the huge jump in performance and she'll back herself into a corner of having to use him on every hard node and maybe every essential. can use him in any other aspect of the game - prologue, pvp, ddq, LRs, etc. no pve though. we know what happens if he gets used (scaling WILL go up), we just don't know for certain what happens when he just sits on the bench in pve.

yup, thanks tex! already all over that, she definitely gets a barrage of unwanted advice and do's and don'ts from me all too often.

mindsuckr

wiz_biz wrote:

so, i can honestly say i'm a bit stumped as to how to advise her...any chance anyone out there can quell my fears? and even better, have data to back it up?

The evidence right now says that SS affects scaling whether you use him or not in PVE. I'm still waiting on the guy to confirm 100% he didn't use SS, but he said he was going into the test knowing not to use him and see if scaling is affected. If she goes the route of selling SS, then she should at least recruit him first and see if the scaling is acceptable. She can always recruit and sell to go back to normal (in theory) and still get the same amount of ISO.