Limiting rosters for PVE - why???

XandorXerxes

Lemminkäinen wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

I would go ahead and level your Cage as high as you can. He's a great tank, one of the best. Even undercovered at lvl 127 he will serve you well.

I believe the prevailing current theory is that damage taken is the primary component in calculating scaling and that would sorta mean that you should avoid using Cage, right?

Your mileage may vary - I leveled 5 of my top 6 guys to 166 pretty much at once from mostly low-hundreds (top two were 166 and 153 for PvP), and noticed no real changes to level in PvE (no changes were instant, they all grew gradually to compensate for my higher, quicker damage). The one clear I used Luke Cage on jumped all of my harder nodes and essentials at once.

Of course you can also just do what I eventually did - level Luke Cage, then don't use him unless you need to. Same with Surfer - if you pull him, just let him sit there. Of course if you level him to 450 and PvE caps at 395 (I assume this will disappear)...

Der_Lex

puppychow wrote:

Der_Lex wrote:

puppychow wrote:

LOL. To each his own. Personally, by keeping my roster level lower, I can still use my max 1/2* to grind nodes and save on heal packs.

How many heals are the 270 players buying per sub to get/keep a top 10 placement? I suspect the answer is a lot.

Add me to the 0 health packs bought crowd as well. In those cases when I am running low, I crack open some of my stockpiled taco tokens until I get more.

I'm seeing quite a few replies saying that you're cracking open tacos for heals. And honestly I cringe every time I see this. Am i the only fella willing to wait for 300 tacos before raiding the vault?

To me, 100% chance to grab the legendary token > 3 heals.

To me, waiting half a year to open taco tokens for a legendary token that I can earn multiple of each week isn't that interesting. Being able to occasionally push on in a PvE (note that usually the standard health packs are enough for me in PvE, but sometimes a bad node can cost you more than planned) because of a taco token effectively gets me an additional 1-2 4* covers at the end of the PvE while saving me 200 HP. Since I'm slowly but surely getting to the point where I can reliably hit 1300 in a pvp with only two shields, that 200 HP saved basically gets me another legendary token, and helps my season ranking as well. And because health packs are a frequent pull from the vault, I get this benefit much more often than once every six months.

Unknown

OJSP wrote:

colwag wrote:

I want to be able to hit 1000 in PVP without having to shield
The main reason I'm even considering leveling is for PVP, but GSBW or LazyCap feels like they'd need better support then just a Hood to scare people defensively I'd guess.

I think your roster probably provides one of the more valid arguments for leaving your 3*s "****" (to use another forumite's term) for the time being. And I agree, having only Luke Cage himself levelled to 127 will probably do more good than harm, purely because of the benefit you'll get from having him levelled higher.

I levelled my 3*s as they come, in batches, up to 94 too, like what you're doing. I didn't see the need to raise them to 102 or 104, purely because I would like to see my 2*s on the first selection page (or as close as possible to the first page). Once i deemed my 3* roster ready, I raised them to 120. If they have less than 12 covers, I would usually keep them at 120.

He's the only one in my roster, that is level 137, despite having only 11 covers. I had him a lot lower before, specifically because he wasn't Unbreakable (0 for a long time, bad timing with DDQ), so he wouldn't be as useful at higher levels..

I'll expand on your questions below:

If aiming to do well in PvP, don't rely on defensive wins. We need to use shields to maintain our scores. Unless we have a couple of the strongest 4*s or at that MMR stage where you are still being matched against weaker rosters, defensive wins would be rare and being unshielded at higher points would make us a juicy target for stronger rosters.

To be able to hit 1000 without needing to shield, many people have said before.. But for me, there are several factors we need to consider: higher scoring shards, climbing at the right time, not an off-season event, Multiple boosted characters (greater than 200 when featured or boosted) and luck (sometimes, due to unintended cascades or bad boards, we would need to use health packs more frequently).

Just a comment on the team you were asking about: Whenever I saw GSBW or LazyCap they were usually paired with Hulk, typically I would attack them even when I only had lvl 94 2*s.. They are not that difficult to beat, even when maxed. With a decent featured character, Ares and OBW, we can beat them with minimal damage (sometimes even the loaner can be used just as a meat shield). The problem after that was usually the other team could simply retaliate to win back some of the points they lost.

You have a better chance of people skipping you, if you pair Lazy Cap with Hood as it can depend a lot on the type of board we get. One Star Spangled Avenger or Twin Pistols, could mean 1 or 2 health packs at the end of the match. However, unless people bring another Hood, it can be tricky to beat a team with the Hood and they are risking leaving themselves exposed with Hood as a defensive team like you worried about. Or, they would bring someone to quickly down our Hood, which in 3* and 4* land, there are plenty of options.

So, unfortunately with the current system in PvP, it seems your options are either to use a few shields or to wait until you've got more 3*s covers (Cyclops or Iron Fist are notably missing, Magneto and Black Panther too). Patch is decent, paired with Hulk or Loki can beat almost any team. But, Patch preferably needs to be 5/3/5 (which will be fixed soon with the next cycle of DDQ), Hulk needs another , and Loki still needs a lot of work.

I suggest until then, keep using the 2*s in PvPs for now, try joining late in the last day, so you'll likely have high scoring targets and would still be unattractive to attack as your points would be relatively lower. You could potentially get high placement, as high as top 25 using this method, so you'll get your 3*s at a faster pace and possibly cheaper too in terms of shield usage. Just remember to shield until the end of the event, as it's like a bloodbath otherwise when people are trying to obtain as many points as possible to get their own rewards. (If the event awards the 3*s covers you don't need anymore, consider joining the event anyway, for the HP progression rewards or the extra iso)

The SHIELD Simulator now could be a decent place to obtain some rewards too. With a level 94 2* roster, I can see you should have no problem reaching 900 with the Dark Avengers trio, alternating with your other 2*s or 3*s to safe health packs. (People should be sick at facing Daken, Ares, and Moonstone, they would probably either skip you, or attack you with a vengeance.. could work both ways.. :) )

If you ever to decide to level the 3*s, 104 or 120 would be a safe soft cap level. The 3*s wouldn't necessarily tank for the 2*s, but their damage output should be similar at 104 or significantly noticeable at 120. (Also, 120 is when levelling the characters become more expensive)

Tip: Luke Cage, Patch and OBW is an excellent team.. 2* Wolverine could be used too, with not much significant difference, except when boosted (But, you don't have him in your roster, so it's moot)

Thanks for the butt-load of advice there. And yeah, I'm not looking for Defensive PVP wins moreso then, say, getting to 759, and being able to play a match without 4 people attacking me. 94 2*s, and a boosted featured 3* at 94 too boosted or not, seemed pretty darn juicy for people to attack. Scarecrows, man. (And a 166LCap and a 150ish Hood sounds like a way better scarecrow then a 150 Ares/94OBW) Shielding is kinda scary, since no guaranteed returns on it, and I kinda need to save up HP to get the roster slots for the mentioned 3*s I'm missing that the RNG gods have not been too generous on spreading.

Shield simulator was way more effective then I thought it'd be last goaround, at least. I think I got near 1300 or so last season in my first "hey how far can we go" peek at it, using mainly Patch/2Daken/Moonstone, even if it didn't hold up defensively but eh as far as I can tell nothing does.

Anyways, I boosted up my Cage and did some random leveling for better or worse, hoping it'd help me if I did it mid-event in PVE, hoping to hit that Legendary, but eh. Jugs hurts as always. We'll get there eventually.

Roswulf

As a daily but somewhat casual player with 23 maxed threes, all capped at lvl 100, it's about maximizing my fun. I spent a long time with a 2* roster where my only real options for all but the easiest nodes were Stormneto or OBW/Ares and/or Thor. It's been a revelation to get my 3* active over the last few months- suddenly I have dozens of characters with useful abilities, and endless teams and synergies to explore, depending on boosts and the specific context. It's so much more fun to have virtually the whole of the 2* and 3* line-up at rough parity with one another. And even with 1.5 million iso in the bank, if I started maxing 3* my range of options would meaningfully go down.

Would I be able to perform better in PvP if I maxed the best of my 3*? Probably, but maybe not in practice. Even as it is, the primary barrier to my achieving success in PvP isn't the level of my roster, it's how much time I'm interested in spending playing a match three game. To be honest, I generally stop at 300, even if I could be safe and stable above 400. It's just not worth it to me to spend the time to hit the really important progression thresholds- and that would be true whatever the level of Luke Cage.

The fact that it shaves some time off my PvE gameplay when I want to push for top 150/top 100 for a choice placement cover is just a bonus.

Unknown

Just make everything progression based (so no need to balance ** rosters against ****, and no need to grind ad nauseam). Make multiple tiers of nodes, with the higher tiers being more difficult and giving more points, so you need to do the tougher nodes to get better rewards (or go grind crazy I guess; this could be worked around if we don't people doing this). Everyone gets a challenge for what they want, everyone gets something. The whole idea of "top 100" just leads to scaling mangment, bracket size tracking, optimal play times, and all sorts of metagaming that are completely beside the reason we play the game.

Daiches

puppychow wrote:

Der_Lex wrote:

puppychow wrote:

LOL. To each his own. Personally, by keeping my roster level lower, I can still use my max 1/2* to grind nodes and save on heal packs.

How many heals are the 270 players buying per sub to get/keep a top 10 placement? I suspect the answer is a lot.

Add me to the 0 health packs bought crowd as well. In those cases when I am running low, I crack open some of my stockpiled taco tokens until I get more.

I'm seeing quite a few replies saying that you're cracking open tacos for heals. And honestly I cringe every time I see this. Am i the only fella willing to wait for 300 tacos before raiding the vault?

To me, 100% chance to grab the legendary token > 3 heals.

Firstly, it's 5 heals or the equivalent of 200HP.

Secondly, to me, 100% chance to grab a better finish and more covers in a 4 star event (retain top 10) is better than a lottery for a Legendary token where the cover you pull might be a duplicate.

Taco's are for heals. If you pull 250HP, sweet, a heal and 50HP. If you pull a when you have 'm all covered, you cry a little

UncleSmed

Having just pushed my 5th character beyond level 135, I can honestly say I'd prefer to have my **** roster back to remain competitive in both PvE and PvP.

I have 35 3*'s of 130-140 in level
And 5 slightly undercovered except for Ragnarok (bad luck with covers)
My 4*'s don't bear consideration and I've been playing for over 400 days.

I now face a wall of teams in PvP that are all maxed. As a casualcore player (I play every day, pick and choose some events and infrequently drop money for slots and do like to play for fun), removing half the content or making it seem like half the content just became mountainous to climb against? That's just off-putting.

Prior to that, I was finding that having a well-developed roster and levelling up evenly in increments of 5 levels from about 120 onward has been good and allowed me to develop a roster which consistently hits 800 in pvp and has a couple of times seen me hit 1000 with hopping and pushing and boosts.

My PvE roster is fine, well developed and I'm only lacking covers in 2* Capt America, and Prof X, Thing and Xpool to cover the essential nodes. With that it's easy enough to hit Top 50 if you want it and Top 10 or 20 if you push and play optimally.

I can now totally understand why people **** their rosters, because no longer do we crush through enemies with max 2*'s on our way to 600 in pvp (though I was on the receiving end of that, but lately it's been similar with a cruisey run to 650 and then the real work beginning).
I only wish there was more transparency on the categories which dictate your "weight class", for lack of a better term. Allowing players to determine how they want to play and also showing players when their roster is developed enough that they should be pushing forward.

It could allow the players who want to be competitive and play for 5 stars to do so, with each other, without having to create artificial difficulty for players who want a more fun experience. It leads the way to a tiered system of rewards, whichever level you're playing at.. the rewards can be tailored to promote you towards the next level of play. We already have a tiered system for the characters, has it not been considered for the players?

I'm not asking for a gimme.. I'd just like to see other people whose characters aren't all 166+, so I can use the entire of my roster, developed over time and invested in heavily with ISO and HPs and feel competitive, not like I'm going to get my tinykitty pushed in in every single battle because I leveled up 5 guys beyond 135.