Phaserhawk's requested Character fixes by the forum
Phaserhawk
Posts: 2,676 Chairperson of the Boards
So after I obtained powers to have SW and Pun get tweaked I started getting PM'd like crazy to try other characters. For a little background, I have created board games with friends in which I was in charge of character balance or game balance, essentially play, find out what's working or not and tweak it a few %'s then do it again. The key is to generally try to keep a character, mechanic, etc. as close to what was intended before having to scrap it, so no further ado.
1* and 2*. Most of these can be fixed with AP reduction. Yelena can, IM35 blue, Venom's black needs to lower web tile requirement (more on web tiles with Spidey). Wolverine needs to have his healing be like Rocket and Groot's. Bag-Man, if they left his AP costs the same and didn't increase them as skills leveled he would be a solid PvE. anyway, to the meat of the issue.
Beast--okay
Black Panther--Defense Grid--everything is fine, but like Punsisher's Moltov Cocktail, this needs to create a shield in addition to the CD tile, at least give the player something, as is, it's pay 8 and hope you get a shield, at least let them pay 8, get a shield with the chance of more.
Black Widow--fix her color order
--Sniper Rifle--with PX not as bad as before, overall it probably needs a slight AP reduction with a slight dmg reduction just to make it more consistent.
--Pistol--I'm torn on this, being able to target is nice, but 17 at max? I think this needs a consistent AP cost same as Sniper and then have the dmg adjusted accordingly. She's not in a bad spot, just needs a shine.
Blade--okay
Bullseye--health buff, he should be in line with Daredevil
Captain America--Sentinel of Liberty--If this is going to be left at 19 then it needs to overwrite all tiles, otherwise drop the cost. You are not going to break his power level if he could throw out some shields earlier, if this went to 14, dropped shield strength accordingly it would really round out Cap
Captain Marvel--fix her color order
--Energy Absorption--This is going to be similar to Hulk and Deadpool, but all of her skills are lower costed and lower damaged because she was suppose to be spamming skills from the AP on this....problem...she doesnt. This skill like Hulk and Deadpool, need to be tied into % current health. If you put Energy absorption as 7-10% of current health taken in dmg, oh wow she is a scary beast, her red and black would possibly need dmg tweaking, but she would turn into the machine gun of firing abilties she was meant to be.
Colossus--make red his primary color
--Immovable Object--this needs to protect against all damage, strike tiles included, this guy should not be outclassed by Cage
--Fastball Special--drop AP to 12, and drop time in air by 1 across the board, so max level no air time, at lvl 4 1 turn, at lvl 3 2 turns.
Cyclops--fine, he pushes the dmg line, he's strong not broken
Daken--he needs a health increase, the character health buff's really left him behind, I would put him to Iron Fist's level for starters
Daredevil--Radar Sense--this just needs a dmg buff, short of that he's a really fun character after getting fixed.
Deadpool--Life of the Party--this is where this character is limited, first off he's already limited in that he can only dive in when another character is in front and of lower health. His passive needs to just like Marvels, tied into a % of characters current health. I would start with 10% of the lower character's current health in dmg and then keep Deadpool's healing rates current, then after more data you can tweak how much he heals for, but thinking if he could just dive in at 10% and then keep healing the same he would be so fun.
Doctor Doom--health increase, I feel he just needs about 5% more
Doctor Octopus--Insult to Injury--10% increase in dmg
--Armed and Dangerous--10% increase in dmg
Falcon--yellow needs to create a weak random tile if not 3 on board
Gamora--Bad Reputation--to me this is her signature skill and it just isnt' quite up to snuff. First off, it's restricted to yellow tiles, that's fine, it keeps it balanced, but if I'm paying 12 AP for a skill that doesn't do damage, I want a lot more than what she is offering. First off, 9 is the most you will probably get from this skill, but that is if she is last man standing. You will generally avg 6.75 assuming she is tanking 3 colors. First off, this needs to go from 4 that bare her symbol to 3 that way you are at least going to be getting 9 strike tiles more often. Second, I think these need to be at max level on Black Panthers strength, not Patch. Patch at least gets damage up front. Have her get 1 tile for every 3 on her name and increase to 175 and now we have the scary daughter of Thanos.
Human Torch--Inferno--this is a skill I never feel good using. The damage is meh, but the cost is bad, plus with tile placement you are rarely going to get all 8 tiles. This needs a fix. First and foremost, get rid of the the AP drain on the other colors if you are leaving this at 10AP, otherwise you can drop it to 8 and keep the AP drain. (If you haven't noticed black skills usually have a negative drawback for power or speed). Second you are already gimping this skill with AP drain, and now you allow it to only go on basica tiles in a circle? I'm okay with the circle but If you don't allow it to possibly overwrite tiles at higher levels then the cost needs to go down further, albeit with a dmg decrease too.
--Flame Jet--Ah Flame Jet, how the AI loves to use this for no dmg. This skill I feel also needs a rework. In keeping with the theme, what I would do is for 5-6AP have it create a tile with 3-4 charges that do dmg each turn, as the CD burns out, much like a flame. The more green AP you have when you use it, puts more damage on it, similar to Rocket and Groot's green, have it work instantly, but the more you delay, the more dmg it can do. But having 2 skills that essentially drain AP is not good. But essentially I would have this cost 5, with 3-4 CD timers and for every extra AP you have over 5 when used, it adds that much extra dmg onto the countdown. This also allows you to use him with another green user since your AP won't keep draining.
Iron Fist--not sure, he's extremely strong, but I think that not getting the health increase really kept him a bit more in check. And with Jean coming in, he is a little less powerful, I think he needs a bit more time to tell.
Ironman--this guy needs a complete rework unfortunately, but until then D3 should at least get rid of the AP drain on his red and blue, there are many great ideas in IM40's character page on how to take him
Kamala Khan--fine
Loki--he needs a health buff, I would start small though, 6500 seems good.
Luke Cage--fine
Magneto--fix his color order and most important his colors should have never changed, yellow should still be blue, and blue should be purple.
--Magnetized Projectiles--should be purple, and it still hasn't quite recovered from it's damage nerf, I would add about 10% more onto this skill, since it's limited by the board and swaps
Mystique--Infiltration--it was too strong before, but when the number of tiles got decreased, the AP should have remained the same, bring the cost back to 9AP
Psylocke--Psychic Knife--dmg increase for starters, as well as either reduce AP by 1, or allow her to create 2 strike tiles of 113.
--Bewilder--I would copy and paste She-Hulk's green on this, and drop the AP, when it resolves removes 1 color 100% and the second color depedent upon level.
--Psi-Katana--maybe a dmg boost on the intial black dmg, reason being because it creates attack tile on black, you are prone to having to match it to use ability again.
Quicksilver--this guy needs it all, but isn't as bad as appears. To me blue is his signature skill, so that needs to remain core. The problem is how he original came out would have been broken. The thing is when you could have switched 2 tiles or created 2 crits, having blue at 5 made sense, but since you got rid of those, leaving blue at 5 just doesn't work. To me he was always meant to be a 5/5/3, with black helping to create blue matches to have his AoE go off. So, either leave blue at 5 but have it create 2 locked tiles on blue matches, in which case you can leave everything as is, or drop it to 4. But IMO black should be able to go as low as 7 without triggering, and green to 6. So at 4 blue matches kaboom, black standard should be 10 and green 9. Then we can see again, but look to QS character discussion for great ideas
Ragnarok--Godlike Power--this either needs to do more damage for 14AP or drop the AP for damage now.
--Thunderclap--more damage
--Lightning Rod--add 1 more charged tile all around
Rocket and Groot--maybe a tad more dmg on green
Scarlet Witch--fine
Sentry--complete rework
She-Hulk--fix her colors
--Settlement--these kind of skills need to be able to create tiles if all requirement not mean, so have it steal 2 out of 3, if only 1, have it create tiles of low strength in order to get it to work.
--Power of Attorney--more dmg
Spiderman--total rework. The problem with Spidey is the web-tiles, it always has been. For a character that has 3 skills all reliant on web tiles being on the board, but only 1 skill to make them, while another consumes is a problem. In order for Spidey to work, because I love the webtile mechanic, is that all his skills have to create webtiles, or at least 1-2 making multiple. See Spiderman character page for great ideas.
Squirrel Girl--Furry Friends--1 less AP and she's golden
Storm--Mistress of the elements--needs to do more damage
The Hood--needs a small health buff, I would give him Loki's current health
Hulk--Thunderous Clap--a small dmg buff or a health buff
--Smash--Don't have this consume green AP
--Anger-- would like to see this as a % of his current health not total
The Punisher--Molotov Cocktail--if not for Judgement the dmg on this sucks, but because of that it's okay, problem is attack tiles. This needs stronger attack tiles, and like BP, it should create an attack tile plus a CD tile upon use, and when CD resolves you get another attack tile and CD tile as the fire spreads.
--Judgement--either needs a 4th tile at max level or about a 33% jump in strike tile strength
--Retribution--needs a small dmg buff on the intial dmg, otherwise it's perfect.
Thor--probably needs a dmg nerf, but I would then want to see a health buff, so in the end he's very strong but not overly broken
Vision--Attack Protocol--I might be one of the few that loves Vision, but Attack Protocol is a problem, I like how it works with blue and yellow, and that yellow attack protocol has saved me a few times, the problem is with red alone, it does way too little dmg for a 10AP skill. I think dropping the AP would make him broken as you could do lots of AoE for very little, so I say bring his red only dmg up to Cyclops level, "he has a freaking infinity gem in his head, he should be anhiliating people with that blast".
Patch--health buff, he got left too far behind, IF level I think
--Best There Is--AP reduction. This is already limited with him needing to tank, I would start with 12AP maybe a slight dmg reduction, but at least it would give him 2 servicable skills.
4 Stars
Carnage--fine
Devil Dino--fine
Elektra--Double Cross--simple AP reduction, because for a 7/14 skill it doesn't do much, but if it was 5/10 or 6/12 then she's cooking, because all that's holding this back is the AP cost.
--Shadow Step--I think it needs 1 less AP dmg fine
--Ballet of Death--simple, either have it go to random tile, or take the dmg and divide it amongst 3 tiles, boom perfect
Invisibile Woman--Force Field Crush--This gal has had more reworks than I don't know what. For this I would do to Elektra, IF, Cage, where if no tiles have her create 3 for 5-6 AP, then blow up 3 for 5-6, nothing worse then being stuck with 12 AP and no force tiles, this would keep it from happening.
Iron-Man--not sure, he's very strong, I could maybe see a reduction of strength on his attack tiles, and a beef up on protect tiles, but overall he's strong but balanced.
KingPin--fine
Nick Fury--fine
Prof X--strong, but fine, especially with Jean coming
Star-Lord--Everyone with Me--like X-Force yellow it needs a blow up penalty, in forms of at least yellow AP return if not some other colors.
--Oldest Trick in the book--damage needs to occur on placement, and then on resolve so divide it up
The Thing--fine
Thor--I'll roll of her skills in one. The nerf on her blue was too much. When I first saw her and did a progression, (before we knew max blue) I figured it should create 6 charged tiles and stun for 2 turns. When it was 9 and 4 turns I was shocked. 3 turn stun and 5 tiles not enough, I would either go to 3 turn stun 6 tiles or 2 turn stun 7 tiles. As for yellow, needs a dmg boost. Red needs 1 of 2 things, either have it create the charged tiles before dealing dmg, which means you can reduce the base dmg to zero, or she needs a bigger base dmg increase, because it's just poor for 10AP to do that dmg. I for one think you remove the based dmg, and have her create 4 tiles first then deal 1000 dmg per tile, that means if you went blue (at 6 tiles) plus red, thats 19 AP for 10K damage. Antman is 18AP for 10K so that seems right on point.
X-Force--X-Force--this needs about another 400-500 dmg and it's fine, to me this skill should deal about 2.5 on the blow up, if you average 42 dmg per tile thats 630, so green should be about 1870 at max, this puts him perfectly balanced on this skill.
--Surgical Strike--I'm 90% okay with this, but after seeing KingPin Purple, I would gladly take a dmg per tile reduction for maybe a 5 AP destruction of strongest color, but again, I can live with it.
Antman--fine, haven't played much, although first take, yellow needs more dmg
1* and 2*. Most of these can be fixed with AP reduction. Yelena can, IM35 blue, Venom's black needs to lower web tile requirement (more on web tiles with Spidey). Wolverine needs to have his healing be like Rocket and Groot's. Bag-Man, if they left his AP costs the same and didn't increase them as skills leveled he would be a solid PvE. anyway, to the meat of the issue.
Beast--okay
Black Panther--Defense Grid--everything is fine, but like Punsisher's Moltov Cocktail, this needs to create a shield in addition to the CD tile, at least give the player something, as is, it's pay 8 and hope you get a shield, at least let them pay 8, get a shield with the chance of more.
Black Widow--fix her color order
--Sniper Rifle--with PX not as bad as before, overall it probably needs a slight AP reduction with a slight dmg reduction just to make it more consistent.
--Pistol--I'm torn on this, being able to target is nice, but 17 at max? I think this needs a consistent AP cost same as Sniper and then have the dmg adjusted accordingly. She's not in a bad spot, just needs a shine.
Blade--okay
Bullseye--health buff, he should be in line with Daredevil
Captain America--Sentinel of Liberty--If this is going to be left at 19 then it needs to overwrite all tiles, otherwise drop the cost. You are not going to break his power level if he could throw out some shields earlier, if this went to 14, dropped shield strength accordingly it would really round out Cap
Captain Marvel--fix her color order
--Energy Absorption--This is going to be similar to Hulk and Deadpool, but all of her skills are lower costed and lower damaged because she was suppose to be spamming skills from the AP on this....problem...she doesnt. This skill like Hulk and Deadpool, need to be tied into % current health. If you put Energy absorption as 7-10% of current health taken in dmg, oh wow she is a scary beast, her red and black would possibly need dmg tweaking, but she would turn into the machine gun of firing abilties she was meant to be.
Colossus--make red his primary color
--Immovable Object--this needs to protect against all damage, strike tiles included, this guy should not be outclassed by Cage
--Fastball Special--drop AP to 12, and drop time in air by 1 across the board, so max level no air time, at lvl 4 1 turn, at lvl 3 2 turns.
Cyclops--fine, he pushes the dmg line, he's strong not broken
Daken--he needs a health increase, the character health buff's really left him behind, I would put him to Iron Fist's level for starters
Daredevil--Radar Sense--this just needs a dmg buff, short of that he's a really fun character after getting fixed.
Deadpool--Life of the Party--this is where this character is limited, first off he's already limited in that he can only dive in when another character is in front and of lower health. His passive needs to just like Marvels, tied into a % of characters current health. I would start with 10% of the lower character's current health in dmg and then keep Deadpool's healing rates current, then after more data you can tweak how much he heals for, but thinking if he could just dive in at 10% and then keep healing the same he would be so fun.
Doctor Doom--health increase, I feel he just needs about 5% more
Doctor Octopus--Insult to Injury--10% increase in dmg
--Armed and Dangerous--10% increase in dmg
Falcon--yellow needs to create a weak random tile if not 3 on board
Gamora--Bad Reputation--to me this is her signature skill and it just isnt' quite up to snuff. First off, it's restricted to yellow tiles, that's fine, it keeps it balanced, but if I'm paying 12 AP for a skill that doesn't do damage, I want a lot more than what she is offering. First off, 9 is the most you will probably get from this skill, but that is if she is last man standing. You will generally avg 6.75 assuming she is tanking 3 colors. First off, this needs to go from 4 that bare her symbol to 3 that way you are at least going to be getting 9 strike tiles more often. Second, I think these need to be at max level on Black Panthers strength, not Patch. Patch at least gets damage up front. Have her get 1 tile for every 3 on her name and increase to 175 and now we have the scary daughter of Thanos.
Human Torch--Inferno--this is a skill I never feel good using. The damage is meh, but the cost is bad, plus with tile placement you are rarely going to get all 8 tiles. This needs a fix. First and foremost, get rid of the the AP drain on the other colors if you are leaving this at 10AP, otherwise you can drop it to 8 and keep the AP drain. (If you haven't noticed black skills usually have a negative drawback for power or speed). Second you are already gimping this skill with AP drain, and now you allow it to only go on basica tiles in a circle? I'm okay with the circle but If you don't allow it to possibly overwrite tiles at higher levels then the cost needs to go down further, albeit with a dmg decrease too.
--Flame Jet--Ah Flame Jet, how the AI loves to use this for no dmg. This skill I feel also needs a rework. In keeping with the theme, what I would do is for 5-6AP have it create a tile with 3-4 charges that do dmg each turn, as the CD burns out, much like a flame. The more green AP you have when you use it, puts more damage on it, similar to Rocket and Groot's green, have it work instantly, but the more you delay, the more dmg it can do. But having 2 skills that essentially drain AP is not good. But essentially I would have this cost 5, with 3-4 CD timers and for every extra AP you have over 5 when used, it adds that much extra dmg onto the countdown. This also allows you to use him with another green user since your AP won't keep draining.
Iron Fist--not sure, he's extremely strong, but I think that not getting the health increase really kept him a bit more in check. And with Jean coming in, he is a little less powerful, I think he needs a bit more time to tell.
Ironman--this guy needs a complete rework unfortunately, but until then D3 should at least get rid of the AP drain on his red and blue, there are many great ideas in IM40's character page on how to take him
Kamala Khan--fine
Loki--he needs a health buff, I would start small though, 6500 seems good.
Luke Cage--fine
Magneto--fix his color order and most important his colors should have never changed, yellow should still be blue, and blue should be purple.
--Magnetized Projectiles--should be purple, and it still hasn't quite recovered from it's damage nerf, I would add about 10% more onto this skill, since it's limited by the board and swaps
Mystique--Infiltration--it was too strong before, but when the number of tiles got decreased, the AP should have remained the same, bring the cost back to 9AP
Psylocke--Psychic Knife--dmg increase for starters, as well as either reduce AP by 1, or allow her to create 2 strike tiles of 113.
--Bewilder--I would copy and paste She-Hulk's green on this, and drop the AP, when it resolves removes 1 color 100% and the second color depedent upon level.
--Psi-Katana--maybe a dmg boost on the intial black dmg, reason being because it creates attack tile on black, you are prone to having to match it to use ability again.
Quicksilver--this guy needs it all, but isn't as bad as appears. To me blue is his signature skill, so that needs to remain core. The problem is how he original came out would have been broken. The thing is when you could have switched 2 tiles or created 2 crits, having blue at 5 made sense, but since you got rid of those, leaving blue at 5 just doesn't work. To me he was always meant to be a 5/5/3, with black helping to create blue matches to have his AoE go off. So, either leave blue at 5 but have it create 2 locked tiles on blue matches, in which case you can leave everything as is, or drop it to 4. But IMO black should be able to go as low as 7 without triggering, and green to 6. So at 4 blue matches kaboom, black standard should be 10 and green 9. Then we can see again, but look to QS character discussion for great ideas
Ragnarok--Godlike Power--this either needs to do more damage for 14AP or drop the AP for damage now.
--Thunderclap--more damage
--Lightning Rod--add 1 more charged tile all around
Rocket and Groot--maybe a tad more dmg on green
Scarlet Witch--fine
Sentry--complete rework
She-Hulk--fix her colors
--Settlement--these kind of skills need to be able to create tiles if all requirement not mean, so have it steal 2 out of 3, if only 1, have it create tiles of low strength in order to get it to work.
--Power of Attorney--more dmg
Spiderman--total rework. The problem with Spidey is the web-tiles, it always has been. For a character that has 3 skills all reliant on web tiles being on the board, but only 1 skill to make them, while another consumes is a problem. In order for Spidey to work, because I love the webtile mechanic, is that all his skills have to create webtiles, or at least 1-2 making multiple. See Spiderman character page for great ideas.
Squirrel Girl--Furry Friends--1 less AP and she's golden
Storm--Mistress of the elements--needs to do more damage
The Hood--needs a small health buff, I would give him Loki's current health
Hulk--Thunderous Clap--a small dmg buff or a health buff
--Smash--Don't have this consume green AP
--Anger-- would like to see this as a % of his current health not total
The Punisher--Molotov Cocktail--if not for Judgement the dmg on this sucks, but because of that it's okay, problem is attack tiles. This needs stronger attack tiles, and like BP, it should create an attack tile plus a CD tile upon use, and when CD resolves you get another attack tile and CD tile as the fire spreads.
--Judgement--either needs a 4th tile at max level or about a 33% jump in strike tile strength
--Retribution--needs a small dmg buff on the intial dmg, otherwise it's perfect.
Thor--probably needs a dmg nerf, but I would then want to see a health buff, so in the end he's very strong but not overly broken
Vision--Attack Protocol--I might be one of the few that loves Vision, but Attack Protocol is a problem, I like how it works with blue and yellow, and that yellow attack protocol has saved me a few times, the problem is with red alone, it does way too little dmg for a 10AP skill. I think dropping the AP would make him broken as you could do lots of AoE for very little, so I say bring his red only dmg up to Cyclops level, "he has a freaking infinity gem in his head, he should be anhiliating people with that blast".
Patch--health buff, he got left too far behind, IF level I think
--Best There Is--AP reduction. This is already limited with him needing to tank, I would start with 12AP maybe a slight dmg reduction, but at least it would give him 2 servicable skills.
4 Stars
Carnage--fine
Devil Dino--fine
Elektra--Double Cross--simple AP reduction, because for a 7/14 skill it doesn't do much, but if it was 5/10 or 6/12 then she's cooking, because all that's holding this back is the AP cost.
--Shadow Step--I think it needs 1 less AP dmg fine
--Ballet of Death--simple, either have it go to random tile, or take the dmg and divide it amongst 3 tiles, boom perfect
Invisibile Woman--Force Field Crush--This gal has had more reworks than I don't know what. For this I would do to Elektra, IF, Cage, where if no tiles have her create 3 for 5-6 AP, then blow up 3 for 5-6, nothing worse then being stuck with 12 AP and no force tiles, this would keep it from happening.
Iron-Man--not sure, he's very strong, I could maybe see a reduction of strength on his attack tiles, and a beef up on protect tiles, but overall he's strong but balanced.
KingPin--fine
Nick Fury--fine
Prof X--strong, but fine, especially with Jean coming
Star-Lord--Everyone with Me--like X-Force yellow it needs a blow up penalty, in forms of at least yellow AP return if not some other colors.
--Oldest Trick in the book--damage needs to occur on placement, and then on resolve so divide it up
The Thing--fine
Thor--I'll roll of her skills in one. The nerf on her blue was too much. When I first saw her and did a progression, (before we knew max blue) I figured it should create 6 charged tiles and stun for 2 turns. When it was 9 and 4 turns I was shocked. 3 turn stun and 5 tiles not enough, I would either go to 3 turn stun 6 tiles or 2 turn stun 7 tiles. As for yellow, needs a dmg boost. Red needs 1 of 2 things, either have it create the charged tiles before dealing dmg, which means you can reduce the base dmg to zero, or she needs a bigger base dmg increase, because it's just poor for 10AP to do that dmg. I for one think you remove the based dmg, and have her create 4 tiles first then deal 1000 dmg per tile, that means if you went blue (at 6 tiles) plus red, thats 19 AP for 10K damage. Antman is 18AP for 10K so that seems right on point.
X-Force--X-Force--this needs about another 400-500 dmg and it's fine, to me this skill should deal about 2.5 on the blow up, if you average 42 dmg per tile thats 630, so green should be about 1870 at max, this puts him perfectly balanced on this skill.
--Surgical Strike--I'm 90% okay with this, but after seeing KingPin Purple, I would gladly take a dmg per tile reduction for maybe a 5 AP destruction of strongest color, but again, I can live with it.
Antman--fine, haven't played much, although first take, yellow needs more dmg
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Comments
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Psylocke- Take away or increase the strike-tile limit on Red. Change Blue from drain biggest pool to drain strongest color.
IW: Force Crush also destroys locked tile.0 -
Please stop. Scarlett Witch and Punisher are screwed up now. You've done enough0
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firethorne wrote:Please stop. Scarlett Witch and Punisher are screwed up now. You've done enough
So a character that is now doing what they were also suppose to do is screwed up?
If you had free HBO and the cable company found out and stopped it, is the cable company screwed up for taking away something you weren't suppose to have to begin with?0 -
Welcome back, impressive list you put together. I hope you do have the super powers they speak of.0
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Pinko McFly wrote:Welcome back, impressive list you put together. I hope you do have the super powers they speak of.
Would be nice. Most of the characters need a tweak, some characters are in need of complete overhaul, but I'll call a spade a spade. If a character is too strong he probably needs to be pulled back, but I would much rather see counters, like Jean Grey to IF and Prof X then to out right nerf.0 -
Phaserhawk wrote:firethorne wrote:Please stop. Scarlett Witch and Punisher are screwed up now. You've done enough
So a character that is now doing what they were also suppose to do is screwed up?
If you had free HBO and the cable company found out and stopped it, is the cable company screwed up for taking away something you weren't suppose to have to begin with?
Well how did the Cable company find out? Did another participant tell the Cable company that we were getting free cable?
Regardless, I doubt the devs will look at this huge list but I would be amused if we get a post in a few days "Fixes to Characters" and they listed all your suggestions.0 -
Some actual character bugs to fix: (sorry if any of these are actually fixed by now)
Daredevil - if matched red trap is "overkill" damage for the last opponent in a survival node wave, trap does not get replaced.
Elektra - modified colored "black" traps dont work and/or do not increase modified color AP. (pls check modcolored red trap too)
Also seems buggy: when opponent hits Elektra multiple times while black traps are active. (dmg done visually in one event, may cause overkill dmg to go to waste)
Red trap should inflict damage in separate events (multiple strike tile dipping)
IW/bubbles:
- Bubbled Mystique shapeshift gets replaced on second shapeshift cast. Bubbled Ant-man tiles can be still Grow'd. Freshly unlocked Ultron drop tiles may explode after Ultrons death. Matching bubbled special tiles triggers Doc.Oc-s passive.
Hood, Sentry, etc - Does not get free turn back if turn-ending ability creates match-5. Can we please forget turn-ending???
Hood - Intimidation makes CD-tiles "explode" all-at-once. working as intended?
Several AP gaining abilities if casted on full 30AP stock - don't count AP which is lost on ability cast but should restock by the abilities AP gain. (Storm Green, Torch red, etc)
ProfessorX, OBW, Mistique - air-critting critical tiles.
ProfX special tile improvement: seems buggy in comparison with falcons special tile improvement.0 -
Phaserhawk wrote:Pinko McFly wrote:Welcome back, impressive list you put together. I hope you do have the super powers they speak of.
Would be nice. Most of the characters need a tweak, some characters are in need of complete overhaul, but I'll call a spade a spade. If a character is too strong he probably needs to be pulled back, but I would much rather see counters, like Jean Grey to IF and Prof X then to out right nerf.
My personal issue with this is that IF and Xavier were not actually problems defensively in pvp. Therefore the attempts to counter them kind of falls flat. Jean Grey will act as a great deterrant to Iron Fist users but it won't stop these powerful characters from dominating the game relative to other options.
On offense Iron Fist's purple turns Hulkbuster into someone that people actually perceive as overpowered. In reality, HB is designed pretty much on par with 4Thor with a slight damage boost but none of the utility benefits. He's a well balanced character. What throws that balance off is the ease of spamming black tiles for just 5 purple. HB isn't 'broken' when combined with Doom in the same way that 4Thor isn't broken when combined with Cyclops. Iron Fist's purple needs to cost 8AP to be put in line with other tile creators (Cyke costs 7 but replaces not creates). Obviously you'd buff the conditional damage of Fist and or the number of tiles created to compensate as well. Perhaps even lowering the 12 black AP condition limit for his skills down to 10 black AP.
Jean's counter to Xavier is even more of a joke. Xavier is barely used in PvP let alone his winfinite builds. When you see him it's often as a defensive deterrant. Xavier's problem is that he enables several winfinite builds that allows players to bypass all intended challenge in PvE modes of play. Heck, if you're lucky enough to get a 5-match purple on your first turn you can sometimes win without ever even giving the enemy a move. He directly conflicts with the messages D3 sent in the past where winfinite was harmful for the game. I guess the fact that it only impacts PvE rankings/personal scaling makes it fine?0 -
Phaserhawk wrote:firethorne wrote:Please stop. Scarlett Witch and Punisher are screwed up now. You've done enough
So a character that is now doing what they were also suppose to do is screwed up?
If you had free HBO and the cable company found out and stopped it, is the cable company screwed up for taking away something you weren't suppose to have to begin with?
But you need to account for the mistake being better than the design. This isn't a case of us someone getting something for free that doesn't equally apply to everyone else. A better analogy is this is like Pfizer developing a chest pain medication and discovering a side effect of some unusual "stiffness." They didn't ditch it because of the error. They leaned into it because the error was a popular result. They just changed the name to Viagra and changed the marketing focus.
Sometimes simply changing the descriptions is the far better move. I don't think either of these were overpowered.0 -
firethorne wrote:Phaserhawk wrote:firethorne wrote:Please stop. Scarlett Witch and Punisher are screwed up now. You've done enough
So a character that is now doing what they were also suppose to do is screwed up?
If you had free HBO and the cable company found out and stopped it, is the cable company screwed up for taking away something you weren't suppose to have to begin with?
But you need to account for the mistake being better than the design. This isn't a case of us someone getting something for free that doesn't equally apply to everyone else. A better analogy is this is like Pfizer developing a chest pain medication and discovering a side effect of some unusual "stiffness." They didn't ditch it because of the error. They leaned into it because the error was a popular result. They just changed the name to Viagra and changed the marketing focus.
Sometimes simply changing the descriptions is the far better move. I don't think either of these were overpowered.
That's a very good counterpoint. With SW, whether she got double AP or not, I still used her as a purple accelerator, with Punisher, I never used him for strike tiles, I wanted board destruction, and was so mad it never did as intended, but I will agree, somtimes a side effect can be better than the original product. Most of what I listed here are quality of life changes, but some are not quick fixes like Spidey, IM40 and Sentry, other just a recoding here and viola, balance0 -
I should probably give my 2 cents on the character buff aspect of this post as well...
While I don't agree with all of Phaserhawk's suggestions I think that the spirit of this post is accurate. Phaser is pointing out specific aspects of characters that could really use attention in one way or another to make them more compelling.
That said I'll point out a couple of areas that I think are important.
- Beast:
Have you seen a lot of people running around with 5 yellow? His green and blue are up to par but the character has one undisputed build for a reason. This applies to all well balanced characters that have a clear 3 cover dump skill.
- Bullseye:
Needs more than a health buff unless he's part of some great builds that I don't know about. Allowing his purple to target any non-basic tile on the board would really help.
- Captain Marvel/Hulk:
I disagree completely with your execution. This would be a nightmare for players to track. At least now we can calculate the threshold and tactically play around that. I think the key issue with these character types (including Vision) is that there's no easy way for them to tank when you want or need them to...especially with boosted characters and 4* tier. To make these abilities compelling they need to 'jump in' like Thing/Deadpool or have some other means of getting around this fundamental problem without making them overpowered.
- LThor:
As much as I love to call out character nerfs I'll actually disagree with this one. AoE damage was heavily nerfed with the health total increases in the game. His skills are no where near as impressive as they were before that...especially with the number of 4*'s out there now. He's a powerful synergistic character but I wouldn't say overpowered.
- Elektra:
I think her purple is fine cost wise but needs to also target Attack Tiles and Protect Tiles. Her red should be reduced further to 6 AP. The damage it deals is truly pathetic and even at 6 AP it would need about 3 pulses to equate to Deadpools red.
- Invisible Woman:
Either reduce the cost of her green to 9AP or allow players to target which bubbles are destroyed. Additionally give her green a much better effect when used without force bubbles on the board.
- Nick Fury:
His purple really looks pathetic next to Jean's now. At the very least it should be reduced to 9 AP to 'try' and save face. I still think Jean's purple is far too undercosted for the benefit but her character does not seem OP as a result.
I'll stop there. This has already become a much larger post than I intended, lol0 -
BP yes!
GSBW Pistol cost needs to be reduced or flattened.
Captain Marvel No. Tying it to 7-10% of current health is a horrible decision making her incredibly tough to kill without an ability. It wouldn't be fair if she picked up 15 red and 9 black just because of 3 matches during your turn. You could occasionally fill up their entire red AP meter in a single turn. It's fine as it is.
Colossus --Immovable Object: I'm pretty sure they already stealth buff fixed it to absorb strike tile damage right? Could be wrong.
--Fastball Special: Yes.
Daken I agree but could see why they're keeping him this low; same with Patch.
Daredevil yes.
Deadpool no.
Doc ock Insult to Injury is fine. Armed and Dangerous does feel weak.
Gamora Mostly agreed, particularly the 3 instead of 4 part at max covers.
Torch Somewhat disagree on Flame Jet.
Loki Good enough as is.
Mystique Agreed. She feels really weak right now as is.
Ragnarok Godlike Power should destroy 2 columns instead of 1.
--Lightning Rod Either that or have basic tiles transformed into charged green tiles.
Sentry rebuff sacrifice a little, and make wr 10 AP, still a 4 match move, but not as hard to get.
Punisher Sounds about right.
Thor Nah, AP denial, board control, and stun tactics deal with him well enough now. He's good but very beatable.
The rest I either don't agree/disagree with enough to really comment.0 -
babinro wrote:I should probably give my 2 cents on the character buff aspect of this post as well...
While I don't agree with all of Phaserhawk's suggestions I think that the spirit of this post is accurate. Phaser is pointing out specific aspects of characters that could really use attention in one way or another to make them more compelling.
That said I'll point out a couple of areas that I think are important.
- Beast:
Have you seen a lot of people running around with 5 yellow? His green and blue are up to par but the character has one undisputed build for a reason. This applies to all well balanced characters that have a clear 3 cover dump skill.
- Bullseye:
Needs more than a health buff unless he's part of some great builds that I don't know about. Allowing his purple to target any non-basic tile on the board would really help.
- Captain Marvel/Hulk:
I disagree completely with your execution. This would be a nightmare for players to track. At least now we can calculate the threshold and tactically play around that. I think the key issue with these character types (including Vision) is that there's no easy way for them to tank when you want or need them to...especially with boosted characters and 4* tier. To make these abilities compelling they need to 'jump in' like Thing/Deadpool or have some other means of getting around this fundamental problem without making them overpowered.
- LThor:
As much as I love to call out character nerfs I'll actually disagree with this one. AoE damage was heavily nerfed with the health total increases in the game. His skills are no where near as impressive as they were before that...especially with the number of 4*'s out there now. He's a powerful synergistic character but I wouldn't say overpowered.
- Elektra:
I think her purple is fine cost wise but needs to also target Attack Tiles and Protect Tiles. Her red should be reduced further to 6 AP. The damage it deals is truly pathetic and even at 6 AP it would need about 3 pulses to equate to Deadpools red.
- Invisible Woman:
Either reduce the cost of her green to 9AP or allow players to target which bubbles are destroyed. Additionally give her green a much better effect when used without force bubbles on the board.
- Nick Fury:
His purple really looks pathetic next to Jean's now. At the very least it should be reduced to 9 AP to 'try' and save face. I still think Jean's purple is far too undercosted for the benefit but her character does not seem OP as a result.
I'll stop there. This has already become a much larger post than I intended, lol
Yes, by no means am I saying my build or nothing else, but even when people disagree with how to fix it, the common denominator in agreement is that something about it needs to be fixed. I'll agree the % current health of Captain Marvel and Hulk would probably need to be higher, but for Hulk it would seem fitting the more he has been hurt, the angrier he becomes, the trade off is that Thunderous clap and Anger would have to do less damage. Captain Marvel needs something though, it's just too easy to play around her, she's mean to spam low costed low damage abilties because you hurt her, as is she just sits there and looks constipated.
I do agree about Jean's purple, 10 AP for that kind of AoE damage seems way high, in fact it's unprecedented, add to the fact she has Fury's same health and ugh. I"m sure the defense is that she only has 2 active abilties, but yeah, I hope they increase the cost or decrease the damage.0 -
babinro wrote:Phaserhawk wrote:Pinko McFly wrote:Welcome back, impressive list you put together. I hope you do have the super powers they speak of.
Would be nice. Most of the characters need a tweak, some characters are in need of complete overhaul, but I'll call a spade a spade. If a character is too strong he probably needs to be pulled back, but I would much rather see counters, like Jean Grey to IF and Prof X then to out right nerf.
My personal issue with this is that IF and Xavier were not actually problems defensively in pvp. Therefore the attempts to counter them kind of falls flat. Jean Grey will act as a great deterrant to Iron Fist users but it won't stop these powerful characters from dominating the game relative to other options.
On offense Iron Fist's purple turns Hulkbuster into someone that people actually perceive as overpowered. In reality, HB is designed pretty much on par with 4Thor with a slight damage boost but none of the utility benefits. He's a well balanced character. What throws that balance off is the ease of spamming black tiles for just 5 purple. HB isn't 'broken' when combined with Doom in the same way that 4Thor isn't broken when combined with Cyclops. Iron Fist's purple needs to cost 8AP to be put in line with other tile creators (Cyke costs 7 but replaces not creates). Obviously you'd buff the conditional damage of Fist and or the number of tiles created to compensate as well. Perhaps even lowering the 12 black AP condition limit for his skills down to 10 black AP.
Jean's counter to Xavier is even more of a joke. Xavier is barely used in PvP let alone his winfinite builds. When you see him it's often as a defensive deterrant. Xavier's problem is that he enables several winfinite builds that allows players to bypass all intended challenge in PvE modes of play. Heck, if you're lucky enough to get a 5-match purple on your first turn you can sometimes win without ever even giving the enemy a move. He directly conflicts with the messages D3 sent in the past where winfinite was harmful for the game. I guess the fact that it only impacts PvE rankings/personal scaling makes it fine?
Now I think 8AP would kill him, possibly a compromise would be to not allow him to overwrite all tiles but only a color, this is what keeps Cyclops in check. Perhaps one of his opposties yellow, red, blue or similar to Mystique and have him overwrite only certain colors. Gives him a defensive like quality without enabling as high of a cascade. If he was 5AP turn x red tiles black, that might curb some of the issue.0 -
Prof X--strong, but fine, especially with Jean coming
Fix Blind Spot, in that it is actually bugged.0 -
aesthetocyst wrote:Hilarious thread, Phaser, I hope the forum takes it all as good fun (It is just having a go...right?)
After the response you got on Punisher, I thought about creating a "What should Phaser fix next?" poll, but thought, "Nah, that'd be silly, shouldn't go there w/o asking him first ..."
Is the OP all your work, or the result of discussion with others?
I like how you list characters as being "fine" as if an authority is passing judgment
No all me. I kept getting, "hey mention this character and do this", hey could you do this, as if I even could, but I'll strike why the iron is hot, and yes these are all my opinions although we probably could all agree that while a proposed fix I have may not be in agreement with someone else, we can probably all agree that something other than what is current needs to be done.
Honestly the 3 targets I have that I would really, really love to see have a new life is Sentry, IM40, Spidey. My 4th is Quicksilver, but I still think he can be saved with some AP tweaks and blue creating 2 tiles. The other 3 seriously need a rework beyond tweaks.
Edit: I am glad you at least get my sometimes hidden sense of humor.
0 -
Buret0 wrote:Prof X--strong, but fine, especially with Jean coming
Fix Blind Spot, in that it is actually bugged.
I 100% agree it should be right after match, the problem is, I think it's doing what it was suppose to do. This is serioulsy just Falcon's code with symbol instead of yellow tile, I mean it's cut and paste programing, which is why I am all but 100% certain they did this on purpose.0 -
Phaserhawk wrote:Buret0 wrote:Prof X--strong, but fine, especially with Jean coming
Fix Blind Spot, in that it is actually bugged.
I 100% agree it should be right after match, the problem is, I think it's doing what it was suppose to do. This is serioulsy just Falcon's code with symbol instead of yellow tile, I mean it's cut and paste programing, which is why I am all but 100% certain they did this on purpose.
Yeah, but the timing is so strange compared to Falcon.... if they wanted to just let the cascades finish before activating to make sure that the buffs only went on tiles that weren't destroyed that turn, that's one thing... but waiting until your opponent's turn to activate the ability without any sort of reference in the ability description makes it seem more like they just screwed up the order of operations.
Match a 5 with PX in his Blind spot and see what happens. Nothing. Then just as you go to make your next match, after you swipe the buffs come in.
With Falcon, you match yellow and the boost takes place /before/ the attack tiles deal damage. With Blind Spot, the boost comes /after/ the attack tiles deal damage. If PX is tanking yellow and both Falcon and PX are in play, there is no reason that Falcon's special tile buffs should come before the attack tiles deal damage and PX's buffs coming after the attack tiles deal damage.
In fact I just ran through a test using PX/Falcon/IF to demonstrate it.
1) Attack tile = 618 damage per turn.
2) Match three with PX.
3) Attack tile does 618 damage.
4) Attack tile flashes to show it is boosted.
5) On my next turn, attack tile shows 718 strength.
6) Do a yellow match 3, inspiration triggers immediately.
7) Attack tile does 795 damage.
8) On my next turn, attack tile shows 795 strength.
Obviously if they intended the two abilities to activate at different times, they succeeded. But the language doesn't seem to indicate that there should be a difference.
If Charles makes a match while this tile is present, he strengthens 2 friendly special tiles by 100.
When the team makes a Yellow match, Falcon improves the strength of 3 friendly Protect, Strike, or Attack tiles by 77.
Again, if you make a match 5 with Charles, the bug becomes even more clear. You match 5 and nothing happens. Then you swipe to make your next match and blind spot activates as the tiles you swiped are swapped.
The reason that they won't address this bug is obviously because their code has gotten so complicated they can't figure out how to fix this without breaking something else.0 -
IW fix easy.
Force Field Crush
POWER COST 12
Invisible Woman shatters the tiles surrounding 2 random Force Bubbles. Does not generate AP. Each Force Bubble deals 64 damage and is unlocked (but not destroyed). If there are no Force Bubbles, she creates 2 in random locations, then destroy them and deals 64 damage for each Bubbles.
Level Upgrades:
Level 2: Deals 283 damage per unlocked Force Bubble.Destroys up to 3 Force Bubbles and the tiles surrounding them.
Level 3: Deals 503 damage per unlocked Force Bubble.
Level 4: Destroys up to 4 Force Bubbles and the tiles surrounding them. If there are no locked tiles, makes 3.
Level 5: Deals 1070 damage per unlocked Force Bubble. Can't destroy her blue protect tiles and invisible tile
At Max Level:
Level 3: Deals 998 damage per unlocked Force Bubble. (1996 + tile damage)
Level 4: Deals 998 damage per unlocked Force Bubble. (2994 + tile damage)
Level 5: Deals 2123 damage per unlocked Force Bubble. (6369 + tile damage)0 -
Some differing opinions on my own (anything not mentioned, we agree on):
Beast--NOT okay. His yellow is one of the worst abilities in the game. Pure (non-true) healing abilities are generally useless and Beast's is one of the weakest. The conditional protect tiles are not enough to save it by any means. I know they want to show Hank's medical abilities but there must be ways of doing it that are not immediately dismissable.
Black Widow--Her red needs a reduction in cost. Anyway, I think the best part of the ability is the targeted tile destruction. Damage is already close to irrelevant, so I'd much prefer if it was completely eliminated in exchange of giving her more "shots" (3-4) that maybe destroy only 2x2 squares.
Bullseye--His green needs a cost reduction. I know that eliminating targeted tiles is kind of premium, but when a cost gets over 10 AP, especially in green, you'd rather have a powerful AoE effect.
Captain America--Sentinel of Liberty--I'd prefer if that ability was reworked. Like healing, abilities that only create protect tiles are comparatively much weaker to anything that would contribute to winning the game. I know it's important to show the defensive side of cap but there are better ways of doing so.
Colossus --Fastball Special--I actually like the 1-turn airborne delay and I think it's a feature rather than a drawback. Good to save characters from imminent AoE nukes. Instead, I believe that it stands being cost as little as 10 AP.
Daredevil-- Powers that rely on traps placed on red tiles are near useless. Either trap behaviour must be changed or the traps need to go into yellow, green or blue tiles, which have much fewer overriders.
Deadpool--Life of the Party--Since many people just kills deadpool first and his HP is not particularly great, this ability only actually triggers accidentally or if you forgot. I'd add that he gets his regeneration tile when he himself is hit by >X damage. The returned HP is not that impressive anyway, but it will encourage players to play around it as they do with Hulk.
Doctor Octopus--Armed and Dangerous--I like the idea of the multi-tasking arms but I believe that the current options are too random and weak. It just needs more toying with to figure a way of making it worth of its cost for a green ability.
Gamora--I think Bad reputation is fine as it is. On the other hand, her green needs to deal a bit more damage, again, not to be enterily dismissable among all the better expensive green abilities.
Human Torch--Flame Jet--Please, no. Leave Flame Jet alone, it is an unique, fun and decently powerful ability that is kind of a minigame on its own. I like it a lot and use it to great effect.
Scarlet Witch-- not fine. Her purple is too weak and/or the stun shouldn't be random. Her green has the worst ratio of investment vs gain among AP generating powers, and the tiny, random, unreliable board shake and damage you get in addition is nowhere close to making it fair.
Sentry--I think Sentry's powers are fine and need no rework. It just needs more tuning of those numbers. Since no one is using him anymore, few noticed that the diminished allotment of boosts constituted yet another nerf to him, so I'm almost positive that the CD tiles of World Rupture could stand going back to 2; AP cost likely needs to stay the same as it is now, though. Sacrifice needs to deal quite less damage even if the strike tile would have to be weaker.
She-Hulk--I also think that Furious Charge is too random to be used reliably even at its cheap cost. I'd rather have it cost 7 or 8 and be able to choose at least one of the colours to be drained.
Spiderman--Spidey is fine, the only thing that needs to be changed is his nearly useless yellow, preferably making it an attack power.
Squirrel Girl--Very surprised you don't think her yellow also needs improvement. I have already expressed my distaste for purely defensive abilities, but the fact that this one ends the turn makes me not use it even if I have the AP and no other yellow power.
Storm--I think that her abilities need quite a lot more pizazz. Being an exact replica of a 1* character, only slightly more powerful than if that character could level up to 166 is rather pathetic. Her 2* version is much more interesting and comparatively powerful.
4 Stars
Devil Dino--I know that his status as "joke character" has kept it out of being relevant, but hopefully some day he'll be more official and his red and green powers will receive an upgrade in damage, proper of a 4*.
Elektra--Double Cross--I wouldn't mind the 7 cost if it gave you at least one strike tile to get started.
--Ballet of Death--see my note on Daredevils, red power.
Invisible Woman--Force Field Crush--I think what she needs is to combine her green and blue powers into one that's based on previous castings (like Ant-Man's powers), and get a completely different third power.
Thor--I think that completely reworking her yellow power into something that is more reliable useful and stronger and also adds some charge tiles would pretty much round up the character, making red able to hit for more, more often.0
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