Is this a joke?

Unknown

whereisbatman wrote:

This video sums up the Spiderwoman variant cover issue better than most:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB6TiRJNI-Q

Fair warning: since "****" is apparently controversial here, there are far worse words in the video.

God bless maddox.

GrimSkald

ArkPrime wrote:

whereisbatman wrote:

This video sums up the Spiderwoman variant cover issue better than most:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB6TiRJNI-Q

Fair warning: since "****" is apparently controversial here, there are far worse words in the video.

God bless maddox.

Again, kind of funny - I watched about three minutes of the video (I gotta get going, I've procrastinated enough,) and I agree with every individual point he's making - the way the fabric covers the butt, the way the fabric clings, etc, but I disagree with the underlying point of it. I do think Io9 Picked on the wrong details (and some of the right details, but some of the wrong ones too.) They really aren't the same pose - one is sexualized, the other isn't.

Is this the worst problem regarding female portrayals in comics? Tinykitty no, content ranks much higher in my mind. Are there male poses as sexualized? Sure, some (Stupid sexy Cyclops.) Are women portrayed in a very different way than men in general? Absolutely yes. Is this portrayal negative for women in general? Yeah, I think so, I definitely think so.

Unknown

GrimSkald wrote:

ArkPrime wrote:

whereisbatman wrote:

This video sums up the Spiderwoman variant cover issue better than most:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB6TiRJNI-Q

Fair warning: since "****" is apparently controversial here, there are far worse words in the video.

God bless maddox.

Again, kind of funny - I watched about three minutes of the video (I gotta get going, I've procrastinated enough,) and I agree with every individual point he's making - the way the fabric covers the butt, the way the fabric clings, etc, but I disagree with the underlying point of it. I do think Io9 Picked on the wrong details (and some of the right details, but some of the wrong ones too.) They really aren't the same pose - one is sexualized, the other isn't.

Is this the worst problem regarding female portrayals in comics? Tinykitty no, content ranks much higher in my mind. Are there male poses as sexualized? Sure, some (Stupid sexy Cyclops.) Are women portrayed in a very different way than men in general? Absolutely yes. Is this portrayal negative for women in general? Yeah, I think so, I definitely think so.

Nice interview, Grim. Do you have any more questions, Grim?

GrimSkald

ArkPrime wrote:

Nice interview, Grim. Do you have any more questions, Grim?

Nah, I think I'm good. You?

Unknown

GrimSkald wrote:

ArkPrime wrote:

Nice interview, Grim. Do you have any more questions, Grim?

Nah, I think I'm good. You?

Let me see.

Am I good? Yes I am. Am I hungry? Yes I am. Am I going to stop typing now and go get some pizza? Sure.

Unknown

As I said on another thread :

Mods are taking their status way too seriously lately...

Most of Marvel contents is not for kids. I've been reading a lot of Marvel comics in the last months and apart from Marvel Kids, there's a lot of extreme violence, sex (even Runaways introduce lesbian characters)... In brief, real life.

Once again, another mod has felt he had to make us behave...

Even the mods have changed in this game. We used to have people like Nonce and many others of great quality.

Now we have wannabees chief commander in a Kindergarten.

To each his own...

Dragon_Nexus

Malcrof wrote:

Funny part is, noone complained when it was parker in the same pose


http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-2yEA6L06bhc/V ... rwoman.jpg

I think it's because his cheeks aren't spread open by themselves.
Eww.

As for the topic, I got a warning recently as well. The post is still there so it was just a slap on the wrist. Weird though since I didn't think the post was particularly mean, just overly sarcastic and scathing. Never had a note from a mod here before, so it's good to see the mods actually on the move since the self policing side of things is likely reduced significantly due to a lack of negative voting.

GothicKratos

This is getting wildly off-topic and becoming an argument. I'm going to go ahead and lock this. If you'd like a personalized response, I'm going to have to suggest simply messaging said mod.

fight4thedream

Sorry Gk, hope you don't mind me unlocking this topic to respond to Ark Prime's inquiry regarding the deletion of his post.

Honestly, had there been no complaint against the OP's post, I would not have deleted it. However, someone reported it with a complaint that it was sexist and looking into the matter I made a quick call and decided to delete it. Nothing more, nothing less.

I notified the OP because I thought he had a right to know my decision and the one who reported it as well. The reason I notify members of these decisions is so that they are aware of what is going on and are free to contest and appeal said decisions. Admittedly, deleted posts cannot be retrieved but it is helpful to know for future reference what I should be more careful doing when modding.

Believe me, I appreciate crude geek humor as much as any other geek but I also have to consider my responsibility as a mod and to the greater forum community. A member made a valid complaint against such humor and I decided it better to err on the side of caution and take action against the post. Unfortunately I wasn't feeling particularly creative so I decided to delete it.

I'm actually surprised that this has become an issue and I am genuinely interested in knowing what other members would have done if they were in my position. I became a mod because I wanted to give back to the forum community that has given me so much. I do the best that I can but obviously sometimes I am going to make decisions that will upset some people. I appreciate when people take the time to tell me why they think my judgement was mistaken because I am always looking to improve and find better ways to address issues.

So in the hopes of receiving constructive feedback not only from the OP but from the forum community I am going to keep this thread unlocked but I ask that you try to keep it on topic and civil. (Yes, I know that it's an ironic request considering the original source of this issue).

Unknown

I know I'd like to see some more pictures to get a better perspective of what the issue might be.
I personally do not see the issue & enjoyed looking at pictures.
but just to make sure we are all in agreement - some more pictures?

Edit: Thank you for introducing me to Maddox.

Unknown

I'm glad I could read your version of the situation. Thanks for your explanation.

What would I have done in this situation ?

Place a spoiler tag surrounding the sexist joke, and comment in green saying :

Beware, this sort of joke may be considered as sexist, and may annoy some people in a public area.

ArkPrime would have probably thought further about his joke, and would have thought better in the future before posting a joke on the forum.

Der_Lex

The only thing that should matter is of a post breaks forum rules or not. And I think it's a bit of a stretch to consider this comment 'sexually demeaning'.

The post refers to one of the biggest (and most pointless, IMO, but I'll happily admit that I find Tumblr/twitter 'feminism' that is offended by absolutely tinykitty everything incredibly pointless and tiresome) controversies in comics of late. If you know this context, it's a funny reference, no more, no less. If you don't know the context... Well, that's really on you, isn't it? If every post we make has to take the (culturally) ignorant and easily offended into account, we might as well pack it in and call it a day.

Don't get me wrong, there are posts that definitely break the offensive material rule, and I've reported some of them myself in the past. There are one or two people that make even me wonder why they haven't been permabanned yet, because just about every post they make contains hateful and/or discriminatory bile.

But this? The fact that this was even reported at all is a serious case of hypersensitive pearl-clutching.

Unknown

Der_Lex wrote:

The only thing that should matter is of a post breaks forum rules or not. And I think it's a bit of a stretch to consider this comment 'sexually demeaning'.

Don't girls who play MPQ already know most of the players are male chauvinists and like to make fun of women just because they think they will sound as "real males" ?

I've seen gross jokes in chatrooms, and girls were reading, and I haven't read any comment from them saying "this is sexist, I am shocked".

fight4thedream

arktos1971 wrote:

I'm glad I could read your version of the situation. Thanks for your explanation.

What would I have done in this situation ?

Place a spoiler tag surrounding the sexist joke, and comment in green saying :

Beware, this sort of joke may be considered as sexist, and may annoy some people in a public area.

ArkPrime would have probably thought further about his joke, and would have thought better in the future before posting a joke on the forum.

First, thanks for the feedback arktos and Der_Lex (and the joke Chungachangas lol). I really appreciate your ideas and comments on the matter and after reading arktos's response, I do feel that it is the best solution to the problem and apologize to ArkPrime for deleting his joke.

Humor is always a tricky beast to tackle but I think the use of a spoiler tag and warning would have sufficed and it was simply an error in judgement on my part.
As always, if you feel a mod has made a mistake I hope you take the time to contact them either through PM or on the forum. Most of us are reasonable people and willing to work with the members here.

Please keep in mind that we are people just like you and unfortunately we are bound to make mistakes or questionable decisions on occasion but that primarily we are here to listen and help.

Again, my apologies to ArkPrime for the deletion. A simple spoiler tag and warning would have sufficed and I will be more careful in the future when dealing with potentially offensive humor.

Best,
fight4thedream

Raffoon

Just to throw in one more personal opinion about the joke:

I don't think it was sexist.

Why should it be sexist to acknowledge that some men (or women) enjoy looking at different body parts on women? That's where the whole "**** man"/"**** man" idea comes from.

This doesn't reduce the entirety of a real woman or a fictional woman's existence to that one superficial dimension, it simply acknowledges that some people prefer to look at different things.

How could someone possibly be offended by this? What's more though, do we have to cater to every possible offense that a person might conceivably take? For shame, someone has acknowledged the fact that human sexuality exists in their joke! We must stone them!

Anyway, I'm glad to see that this got talked-out the way it did. It seems healthy that such matters can at least be discussed. I certainly raised my eyebrows when I saw this topic locked for "becoming an argument". Arguments are often good.

simonsez

fight4thedream wrote:

I am genuinely interested in knowing what other members would have done if they were in my position.

The thread where that post appeared has 112,000 views. One person complained. What I would have done is not worry about appeasing the fringe.

Unknown

simonsez wrote:

fight4thedream wrote:

I am genuinely interested in knowing what other members would have done if they were in my position.

The thread where that post appeared has 112,000 views. One person complained. What I would have done is not worry about appeasing the fringe.

This exactly. There are people who will be offended by anything outside of the most vanilla, most trite language and dialog. If you moderate every time a single person points out something as offensive, you're going to be doing so all day, and you'll be turning this forum into a hostile environment for anyone who isn't interested in keeping their posts restricted to saying "neat" on threads about new characters. I don't think the spoiler tag is warranted. I don't think any sort of moderation is warranted. Regardless of the context behind what I said.

Arondite

Keep in mind, this is the same forum where telling someone who doesn't shield hop that they don't know the intricacies of shield hopping is against the rules.

DrStrange-616

arktos1971 wrote:

Der_Lex wrote:

The only thing that should matter is of a post breaks forum rules or not. And I think it's a bit of a stretch to consider this comment 'sexually demeaning'.

Don't girls who play MPQ already know most of the players are male chauvinists and like to make fun of women just because they think they will sound as "real males" ?

I've seen gross jokes in chatrooms, and girls were reading, and I haven't read any comment from them saying "this is sexist, I am shocked".

Just wanted to briefly address this. Being a girl who likes comics isn't easy. Most don't take offense at the little stuff. If something does cross the line and someone complains it's seldom well-received. The person speaking out is often labeled as a rabid feminists or worse. So most just keep quiet. It's a lose-lose.

Unknown

DrStrange-616 wrote:

Just wanted to briefly address this. Being a girl who likes comics isn't easy. Most don't take offense at the little stuff. If something does cross the line and someone complains it's seldom well-received. The person speaking out is often labeled as a rabid feminists or worse. So most just keep quiet. It's a lose-lose.

If its any consolation I think most men feel the same, if a few people make sexist/racist comments in a Line room there's usually well over a hundred shaking their head. I know the common feminist point of view is that sexism should be tackled immediately, but most of us realise that entering into discussion with these people on the internet is a fruitless task as you cant argue with an idiot because they'll never know when they've lost.